Towing

[IanD]

14 minutes ago, M_JG said:

 

I trust you didn't carry out a tow using a hire boat?

No it was a hire boat (we had two), and was done with the hire company's approval to get it to somewhere they could come out to and fix it.

Edited April 17, 2023 by IanD

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, IanD said:

No it was a hire boat (we had two), and was done with the hire company's approval to get it to somewhere they could come out to and fix it.

 

We once declined to do a tow on the Soar as we knew we weren't allowed to do so.

 

Then on bow hauling the boat into the next lock one of the crew slipped and broke her wrist.

 

I wished we'd just risked it after that.

Edited April 17, 2023 by M_JG

[alan_fincher]

1 hour ago, M_JG said:

 

I trust you didn't carry out a tow using a hire boat?

 

I've "towed" hire boats on multiple occasions, albeit only with them travelling backwards, and also only for very short distances.

 

The purpose of these manoeuvres has been to tow them off whatever scour they have grounded themselves on or just to retrieve them from shallows where they are often also embedded in offside bushes.

 

We have never failed to rescue one yet.

[PeterScott]

23 hours ago, jonathanA said:

The worst thing I've ever had to tow on a canal was a grp cruiser behind  a nb. Couldn't cross strap due to the high bow on the cruiser ...

 

 

On this day in 2004. It worked OK with the cruiser tight on our rear fender, although the rope fixing points weren't quite 'cross-straps' in the proper sense ...

 

 

Edited April 17, 2023 by PeterScott

[TheBiscuits]

23 minutes ago, PeterScott said:

 

 

On this day in 2004. It worked OK with the cruiser tight on our rear fender, although the rope fixing points weren't quite 'cross-straps' in the proper sense ...

 

Take the towline round the pulpit rail uprights and tie off on the cleat.  Works well unless the deck is so rotten the pulpit separates from the boat ...

 

DAMHIK ! 

[jonathanA]

12 hours ago, PeterScott said:

 

 

On this day in 2004. It worked OK with the cruiser tight on our rear fender, although the rope fixing points weren't quite 'cross-straps' in the proper sense ...

 

 

the problem I had was the cruiser was this style (not this one just nicked the pic) 

 

so was riding too high over the back of our semi trade for any X-strap to work. also the damn thing had no engine and was more or less an empty hull so a dog passing wind on the towpath would send it sideways across the cut.... the owner had been bow hauling it having bought it as a 'project' 

[Grassman]

Thanks for the further advice about 'steering' the towed boat. I'm an experienced boater (40+ years) but having never been towed before I'm a complete novice with that. I can see the logic in that trying to steer a towed boat could actually make the situation worse, so I will bear that in mind.

 

There'll be two of us stood on the cruiser stern deck ready to fend off/pole off if the back end sways too close to a moored boat or the bank. There's 18mph winds forecast which could add to the fun!

[howardang]

5 minutes ago, jonathanA said:

the problem I had was the cruiser was this style (not this one just nicked the pic) 

 

so was riding too high over the back of our semi trade for any X-strap to work. also the damn thing had no engine and was more or less an empty hull so a dog passing wind on the towpath would send it sideways across the cut.... the owner had been bow hauling it having bought it as a 'project' 

In some circumstances you may have found it easier to tow alongside, but of course the downside to that method is that in all tight spots - bridges, single locks etc - you  have to revert to, cross straps or similar,  or sometimes a longer  tow line.  In other words a pain!😊

 

Howard

[Captain Pegg]

32 minutes ago, Grassman said:

Thanks for the further advice about 'steering' the towed boat. I'm an experienced boater (40+ years) but having never been towed before I'm a complete novice with that. I can see the logic in that trying to steer a towed boat could actually make the situation worse, so I will bear that in mind.

 

There'll be two of us stood on the cruiser stern deck ready to fend off/pole off if the back end sways too close to a moored boat or the bank. There's 18mph winds forecast which could add to the fun!

Wind will be a pain. A presence on the rear deck is a reassurance to other boaters as much as anything. Don’t endanger yourself though.

 

While Kings Bromley to Great Haywood is a little further than I imagined when a first posted it is important not to over-think it.

 

Being on cross-straps is the single critical thing. Everything else is a detail. You just need it to move with a sufficient degree of control. You’re not towing 15 tonnes of boat loaded with 25 tonnes of aluminium or trying to get an empty pair of boats to the coalfield for the next order.

[Grassman]

After the previous great advice on this thread (thanks again), I thought I'd let you know that the tow went reasonably well yesterday. Our two close coupled 62ft narrowboats presented a challenge in places and the 16mph wind caused a bit of an issue at times, but except for a few minor scratches on the cabin side from protruding offside vegetation, it went very well. We took it steady and did the 10 miles and 2 locks in 7 hours.

I'm relieved it's over though!

[Jess--]

Our experience of towing a powered narrowboat (with dead engine & small rudder) was that breasted worked best (to be honest we just hooked centre lines and pulled it tight).

our attempts at towing with a single (long or short) line were hilarious failures until we lashed a long gangplank to the swan neck giving a nice flat rudder (more of an oar) with a lot of travel to either side, then it needed a bit of muscle to steer but was actually very controllable.

[Captain Pegg]

3 hours ago, Grassman said:

After the previous great advice on this thread (thanks again), I thought I'd let you know that the tow went reasonably well yesterday. Our two close coupled 62ft narrowboats presented a challenge in places and the 16mph wind caused a bit of an issue at times, but except for a few minor scratches on the cabin side from protruding offside vegetation, it went very well. We took it steady and did the 10 miles and 2 locks in 7 hours.

I'm relieved it's over though!

I passed you at Wolseley Bridge. If I’d have known who was towing you I’d have suggested to let them decide how to do it.

 

As it happened I did a short tow this morning with a 60’ boat towing a 50’ boat. As I was working on my own I lashed up the tiller straight and not having planned to tow and therefore not travelling with my own cross straps I used a mooring line to form both straps, which kind of self rights itself in terms of equalising the length.

 

After needing one in situ adjustment after setting off the towed boat obediently followed behind.

 

I really wouldn’t recommend breasting up unless on a canal where the published width is at least 14’ other than between broad locks in closely spaced flights. Try breasting up even on the northern GU and you will get stuck. Don’t even think about it on a narrow canal.

 

 

Edited April 21, 2023 by Captain Pegg

[Ronaldo47]

While conditions of hire usually prohibit towing, on my first canal holiday in 1976, when a group of us hired Black Prince's original fleet of two boats, the owner himself suggested that we might like to try breasting up at the locks on the GU  (the base was at Cosgrove).  We only did it once, at the flight of locks at Braunston, and there were no boats coming the other way to worry about. It certainly speeded up transit: just drive the pair in, without the faff of positioning, and holding, the first in position while the second entered. The boats were essentially identical 60' Harborough Marine products, which simplified the lashing together, and we only used the engine of one boat. 

Edited April 21, 2023 by Ronaldo47

[Captain Pegg]

26 minutes ago, Ronaldo47 said:

While conditions of hire usually prohibit towing, on my first canal holiday in 1976, when a group of us hired Black Prince's original fleet of two boats, the owner himself suggested that we might like to try breasting up at the locks on the GU  (the base was at Cosgrove).  We only did it once, at the flight of locks at Braunston, and there were no boats coming the other way to worry about. It certainly speeded up transit: just drive the pair in, without the faff of positioning, and holding, the first in position while the second entered. The boats were essentially identical 60' Harborough Marine products, which simplified the lashing together, and we only used the engine of one boat. 

 

That makes sense with two boats from the same company under control of the same group. Towing a third party boat is a whole different ball game, especially from the insurance point of view. That's likely to be the principal reason hire companies don't permit towing. It also carries quite a bit of reputational risk.

 

The other way is to simply drive both boats side by side. I suggested this to a steerer while ascending Calcutt bottom lock a few weeks ago. He agreed and being on the outside for the bend between the locks I said I'd be taking a wide line to the middle lock, because it's important that both boats are square to the lock and well set up on approach. He just cut the corner and that was the end of that.

 

I got a tow from a hire boat last year. I shan't mention where and which company but when I accepted the offer I did remind the crew that the hire company would not approve and left it up to them to decide if they wished to continue. They claimed to have towed before although I didn't get the impression they were particularly clued up. Unlike a private boater who had given me a tow earlier in the year who definitely knew what he was doing and was rather good. Unfortunately I can't remember the name of the boat concerned. Nice boat too.

 

[Grassman]

20 hours ago, Captain Pegg said:

I passed you at Wolseley Bridge. If I’d have known who was towing you I’d have suggested to let them decide how to do it.

 

 

 

 

 

Did you know the chap who was towing me? I would have recognised your boat name and given you a wave but I was concentrating so much I didn't notice you. 

[Captain Pegg]

30 minutes ago, Grassman said:

 

Did you know the chap who was towing me? I would have recognised your boat name and given you a wave but I was concentrating so much I didn't notice you. 

Yes. He’s got plenty of experience of towing butty boats, although they are of course steerable when towed.

 

I figured you must have known him, how did things come about then?

 

We spoke to each other - assuming you were the chap in the yellow coat - while your ‘tug’ was being extricated from the mud and bushes on the offside. You wouldn’t have recognised the boat because I was moving someone else’s boat (officially).

 

 

[Grassman]

3 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

Yes. He’s got plenty of experience of towing butty boats, although they are of course steerable when towed.

 

I figured you must have known him, how did things come about then?

 

We spoke to each other - assuming you were the chap in the yellow coat - while your ‘tug’ was being extricated from the mud and bushes on the offside. You wouldn’t have recognised the boat because I was moving someone else’s boat (officially).

 

 

 

 

He and his wife are fellow IWA members and both do the winter offside vegetation work with me. My other helpers are also IWA, and from my OV team, one of whom is also a lock vollie at Atherstone. It certainly helps having friends in the right places 😀. I wasn't in the yellow jacket. I was at the helm not doing a lot except worrying!

 

Here's one of the photos I took

 

 

 

 

[Captain Pegg]

7 minutes ago, Grassman said:

 

 

He and his wife are fellow IWA members and both do the winter offside vegetation work with me. My other helpers are also IWA, and from my OV team, one of whom is also a lock vollie at Atherstone. It certainly helps having friends in the right places 😀. I wasn't in the yellow jacket. I was at the helm not doing a lot except worrying!

 

Here's one of the photos I took

 

 

 

 

Funnily enough when I came through Ash Tree bridge I noted the bank profile on the offside really doesn’t accommodate a towed boat. It looks like the towed boat may be dragging the back end of the tug around here and impact with the inside wall is imminent.

 

Think of the enormous sweep on the offside of the A425 bridges between Napton and Shuckburgh, built to accommodate a loaded butty on a long line.

[Rob-M]

Ash Tree can be a problem in just a single boat, I upset fisherman there last week as they were fishing right by the bridge so I gave it plenty of power as I came out of the bridge.

 

Good to see Heritage Working Boats pairs training being put to good use.

[Captain Pegg]

3 minutes ago, Rob-M said:

Ash Tree can be a problem in just a single boat, I upset fisherman there last week as they were fishing right by the bridge so I gave it plenty of power as I came out of the bridge.

 

Good to see Heritage Working Boats pairs training being put to good use.

The back end of towed boats and fishists are not a good mix.

 

Sunday is not a good day for towing.

[Rob-M]

4 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

The back end of towed boats and fishists are not a good mix.

 

Sunday is not a good day for towing.

I've had them fishing at Rotton Park junction a few times when I'm heading back to Icknield Port with the pair and I always suggest they move their rods and nets otherwise the butty may wipe them out.

[Grassman]

On 22/04/2023 at 10:00, Captain Pegg said:

Funnily enough when I came through Ash Tree bridge I noted the bank profile on the offside really doesn’t accommodate a towed boat. It looks like the towed boat may be dragging the back end of the tug around here and impact with the inside wall is imminent.

 

 

 

We actually managed through the bridge quite well. You'll see in that photo one of my helpers standing on the towpath just inside the bridge, he had to fend us off that side a little but other than that we did it okay and the offside wall wasn't touched by either boats.

 

Here's a couple more photos - Turning out of the marina, and Armitage Tunnel which was a bit tight. 

 

 

 

[Captain Pegg]

20 minutes ago, Grassman said:

 

We actually managed through the bridge quite well. You'll see in that photo one of my helpers standing on the towpath just inside the bridge, he had to fend us off that side a little but other than that we did it okay and the offside wall wasn't touched by either boats.

 

Here's a couple more photos - Turning out of the marina, and Armitage Tunnel which was a bit tight. 

 

 

 

 

Fair play, that bend at the south end of Armitage tunnel is tight for all boats.

 

Personally I would have prohibited anyone from fending either boat off from the bank. Oblique contact is what the rubbing strakes are intended to accommodate. Far too many broken limbs have occured in that way and generally working between boat and bank is the best way to fall in. No harm will come to the boat at the appropriate speed.