Commercial BSSC

[Beccbra]

I’m currently going through the process of buying a second hand boat and will be using it for personal use as well as static short-term rental. I’ve done some research and understand it can be difficult to obtain the commercial BSSC, so prior to buying I’d like to be mindful of what these considerations should be…. But really struggling to find this detail online. Does anyone have experience and able to offer any info please? 
 

Also any other advice & or experience of doing this would be much appreciated. Success stories, failures - I’m all ears!

[Chewbacka]

This may help

https://www.boatsafetyscheme.org/requirements-examinations-certification/hire-boats-requirements-2017/additional-hire-boat-requirements/

[Alan de Enfield]

12 minutes ago, Chewbacka said:

This may help

https://www.boatsafetyscheme.org/requirements-examinations-certification/hire-boats-requirements-2017/additional-hire-boat-requirements/

 

 

Superceded.

 

The new 2022 BSS now covers both 'leisure' and 'commercial' BSS requirements in one standard

 

For each section (in the top right hand corner of the section) there are  one or two 'letters' (either an R or a A)

 

The 1st letter is for the 'leisure BSS' and the 2nd letter is for the 'commercial BSS'

 

If there is only one letter that means it applies to both leisure and commercial vessels

 

An R means it is a Requirement (and not doing it is a BSS Fail)

An A means it is an advisory and is strongly suggested that you do whatever it is, but, if you do not it is not a BSS fail.

 

 

I was going to attach the new BSS requirements in a Pdf but it is 4.5Mb and the forum limit is only 2.9Mb

 

You will need to go onto the BSS website and download it.

 

This is what you are looking for

 

BSS Examination Checking Procedures Core Checks for privately owned and managed vessels And, Parts 2-9 of Hire Boat Requirements examination.

Non-controlled Review Version 28 Sept 21 – 31 March 22

Edition 4 Version 0.2 – 28 September 2022

 

Example :

 

 

Edited March 20 by Alan de Enfield

[Beccbra]

Oh this is amazing - thank you so much

[Alan de Enfield]

3 hours ago, Beccbra said:

difficult to obtain the commercial BSSC

 

Just remember that a boat built as a 'leisure' boat will most likely fail a commercial BSS unless work is done - a typical failure point is the height above the waterline of hull fittings (exhaust, water drain etc) which has a specified minimum height for commercial boats.

 

In additional to the BSS, if you are going to rent it out you will need a commercial hire boat licence,and commercial hire boat insurance.

You will also need 'Landlord gas and electrical' safety certificates (we have just had a Landlord Gas certificate for a hire caravan which cost £500 to achive)

[Beccbra]

Thanks, that’s really useful info. It’s starting to sound not as achievable as I’d hoped. 
 

Is there anyway to know of these measurements prior to a survey? 

[Tony Brooks]

1 hour ago, Beccbra said:

Thanks, that’s really useful info. It’s starting to sound not as achievable as I’d hoped. 
 

Is there anyway to know of these measurements prior to a survey? 

 

It is all in the BSC documents, so download, print out, study them. I think it is 10" expressed in mm.

 

Some people manage to get it to work legally, but anecdotally more do such things illegally that means the boat is effectively uninsured. The general advice is that it is not very achievable, CaRT usually require commercial operators to have suitable moorings with the facilities CaRT think the operator needs. I suspect many marinas would not be happy with a "private" commercial operator on one of heir berths.

[TheBiscuits]

https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/business-and-trade/business-boating/starting-or-expanding-a-boating-business

 

Details of what you need for Static Letting are available here.

 

Or more specifically here:

 

https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/business-and-trade/business-boating/starting-or-expanding-a-boating-business/static-letting

 

[MartynG]

The rule about openings is much misunderstood.  The opening in the hull may be less than 250mm from the waterline.  But the pipe or hose  connected to the opening must rise inside the boat such that 250mm freeboard is provided by the pipe or hose . This is normal for lumpy water boats .

https://www.boatsafetyscheme.org/requirements-examinations-certification/non-private-boat-standards/part-10-non-private-boats-safety-features/water-intakes/

 

[Beccbra]

9 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

It is all in the BSC documents, so download, print out, study them. I think it is 10" expressed in mm.

 

Some people manage to get it to work legally, but anecdotally more do such things illegally that means the boat is effectively uninsured. The general advice is that it is not very achievable, CaRT usually require commercial operators to have suitable moorings with the facilities CaRT think the operator needs. I suspect many marinas would not be happy with a "private" commercial operator on one of heir berths.

I see, thank you. I guess I can hope that I find a suitable ex-hire as presume in order to have achieved the commercial BSC previously, the spec would still be the same? 
 

Understood on the flouting of the rules. Presume it would be the lack of a commercial BSC (and correct Letting License) that would invalidate the insurance.
 

Do uninsured accidents happen on the inland waterways often? I’m not weighing up the risk by the way… I’m just an inexperienced boater-to-be and would like to have as much knowledge as possible in preparation. 

[MartynG]

29 minutes ago, Beccbra said:

 

Do uninsured accidents happen on the inland waterways often? 

They can occur

Its the 3rd party liability that can cost big time.

This fire was caused by an uninsured boat

You cant get a license without insurance and a valid BSS. 

 

 

 

[Alan de Enfield]

32 minutes ago, Beccbra said:

Do uninsured accidents happen on the inland waterways often? I’m not weighing up the risk by the way… I’m just an inexperienced boater-to-be and would like to have as much knowledge as possible in preparation. 

 

Very rare - except  when folks are hiring out their 'Private leisure boat' and then there are a few examples most years.

 

ABNB, boat rental, etc etc are all 'commercial use'.

1 minute ago, MartynG said:

This fire was caused by an uninsured boat

 

The cause was not the lack of insurance, it was becasue they refueled (with petrol) didn't use the bilge-blower before starting the engine and the petrol fumes exploded.

[Tony Brooks]

37 minutes ago, Beccbra said:

Do uninsured accidents happen on the inland waterways often? I’m not weighing up the risk by the way… I’m just an inexperienced boater-to-be and would like to have as much knowledge as possible in preparation. 

 

Accidents do happen, usually not serious ones, but they can be. It is not unknown for a boat to be T boned at a junction and that could throw someone into the water. It could also do a lot of damage to the hit boat, especially if it was GRP. On the Thames we had a fatality when someone ignored the instruction to never tow another boat and the tow-rope flipped a child off the towed boat. The point is that you don't know what will happen, so you need insurance "just in case". If your insurance company voids the policy because you did not inform them of a material fact, you could be in trouble.  A number of years ago, there was a boat called Qua Sera (spelling) that was hired out with private boat insurance and the hirers did not bring it back. As far as I know, it was never found and the policy was voided.

 

[MartynG]

3 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

The cause was not the lack of insurance, it was becasue they refueled (with petrol) didn't use the bilge-blower before starting the engine and the petrol fumes exploded.

Lack of insurance never causes accidents.

But I understand the boat owner in that case was uninsured .

As well as the justrefulelled  boat being destroyed two others were damaged and the fuel pontoon severely damaged .

I heard the boat owner was pursued for recovery .

 

PS 

Third party insurance is cheap as chips.

[LadyG]

If the idea of part use, part hire to recover your costs and making your boating free for your self I would forget it. Too many pitfalls.

I believe some hire companies will use and manage boats owned privately, this could work for you, but probably not if you have used a loan to finance the deal. 

[Tam & Di]

As LadyG says really. Going fully commercial is a possibility, but hoping to be doing just enough to cover costs never works - not the least because the costs are far more than first appears and 'commercial use' increases them (and the risks) enormously.

 

Tam

Edited March 22 by Tam & Di

[cuthound]

11 hours ago, LadyG said:

 

I believe some hire companies will use and manage boats owned privately, this could work for you, but probably not if you have used a loan to finance the deal. 

 

This is known as sponsoring a hire boat. Here is a link to one of the many hire companies that do it.

 

https://www.aquanarrowboats.co.uk/sponsorship/

[ditchcrawler]

On 21/03/2023 at 05:53, Beccbra said:

Thanks, that’s really useful info. It’s starting to sound not as achievable as I’d hoped. 
 

Is there anyway to know of these measurements prior to a survey? 

You could always buy an ex hire boat, if you could get one straight from a hire company you would be well on the way.