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Which skills (to learn) would serve a new liveaboard the best?


The Narrow Way

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There are so many skills that could potentially aid a new liveaboard in maintaining their boat.  I'm thinking - electrical knowledge, woodworking, welding, engine-wrangling, etc.

 

As somebody with a low starting base in all things mechanical, I don't have the capacity to learn all that is required in-depth, but I would really like to throw myself into learning one or two of these areas in order to reduce my reliance on paid help and favours.

 

So if you were just starting out (for context - I am pre-boat and just planning ahead), and didn't know what you know now - what would you prioritise?

 

Beyond boat-handling skills, what topics would you prioritise to give the best chance of avoiding issues and making repairs and modifications while out on the cut?

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1 minute ago, The Narrow Way said:

So if you were just starting out (for context - I am pre-boat and just planning ahead), and didn't know what you know now - what would you prioritise?

 

With a low-skill level, initially, I'd arrange to have plenty of money available (so you can pay someone to do the work, watch them, and learn for the next time it breaks).

 

The most important thing to learn is the fuel system & keeping the engine / gearbox running (forget electrics and water you can manage without them) if the engine is working you are never stuck in the middle of nowhere and can always get to someone to sort out other peoblems.

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Just now, Alan de Enfield said:

 

With a low-skill level, initially, I'd arrange to have plenty of money available (so you can pay someone to do the work, watch them, and learn for the next time it breaks).

 

The most important thing to learn is the fuel system & keeping the engine / gearbox running (forget electrics and water you can manage without them) if the engine is working you are never stuck in the middle of nowhere and can always get to someone to sort out other peoblems.

Thanks, this is great advice actually.  I hadn't really been thinking about self-maintaining the engine much, but you are right - it's the heart of operations!

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Understanding batteries and being your own power station is quite important and an area that seems to hit a lot of boaters when their lights go out in the early evening and they have no power until after 8am the following morning when they can start charging again.

 

Being considerate to fellow boaters and not being one of the modern "I'm all right so f**k the rest of you" brigade that are becoming more common on the cut.

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I agree with Alan. Concentrate on earning £100k a year then spend it on people to do it all for you :) 

 

But more seriously, the skill you'll need first. It could be anything, but when the first problem crops up, concentrate on that. 

 

 

 

 

It will probably be batteries.

 

 

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Spend a few? hours perusing this forum and look at old posts as most boating problems have been aired at great length.

Tony Brookes (bless him) has done free downloads of mechanics and electrics, of boats and I am sure would be worthy of study.

Talk to boaters, they are generally a gregarious lot, and chat about boats and canals, there will be various (conflicting opinions, as there are on this forum) but your research will be helpful when you start boating.

Many people on here may suggest hiring a boat for a week or so to get a taster of boating, and I agree.

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15 minutes ago, Rob-M said:

Understanding batteries and being your own power station is quite important and an area that seems to hit a lot of boaters when their lights go out in the early evening and they have no power until after 8am the following morning when they can start charging again.

 

Being considerate to fellow boaters and not being one of the modern "I'm all right so f**k the rest of you" brigade that are becoming more common on the cut.

 

Yes, I'm already doing a lot of reading on here about charging states, etc.  I think battery management is definitely going to be a focus.

No worries on the considerate boater front.  I'm a community-oriented person, and somebody that really respects the tradition of the lifestyle.  

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29 minutes ago, The Narrow Way said:

There are so many skills that could potentially aid a new liveaboard in maintaining their boat.  I'm thinking - electrical knowledge, woodworking, welding, engine-wrangling, etc.

 

As somebody with a low starting base in all things mechanical, I don't have the capacity to learn all that is required in-depth, but I would really like to throw myself into learning one or two of these areas in order to reduce my reliance on paid help and favours.

 

So if you were just starting out (for context - I am pre-boat and just planning ahead), and didn't know what you know now - what would you prioritise?

 

Beyond boat-handling skills, what topics would you prioritise to give the best chance of avoiding issues and making repairs and modifications while out on the cut?

After buying your boat, get River Canal Rescue to teach you how to service your engine. They come to your boat to teach you.

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1 minute ago, Laurie Booth said:

After buying your boat, get River Canal Rescue to teach you how to service your engine. They come to your boat to teach you.

 

Ah, this is very cool.  Just checking their site, they offer a Helmsman Certificate course, which interests me.  Any idea whether it would be advisable to do this with them or with the Narrowboat Skills Centre?

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Just now, The Narrow Way said:

 

Ah, this is very cool.  Just checking their site, they offer a Helmsman Certificate course, which interests me.  Any idea whether it would be advisable to do this with them or with the Narrowboat Skills Centre?

I have no experience of using Helmsman courses, only engine servicing.

:) 

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Unless you buy a rust bucker AND have the facilities to get it out of the water, welding would be very low down the list. If it is in tolerable condition inside, then woodworking is only marginally higher up the list.

 

You missed out preparation and painting because unless you will be able to afford several thousand pounds (£5000 to £10,000 say) every 10 years or so you will be repainting the boat.

 

The advice to get to grips with batteries and the charging is arguably the most vital skill because if you don't get your head around that expect to be paying well over a hundred a month for new batteries that you have ruined - and just to help some battery "gauges" seem designed to help less aware boaters destroy their batteries.

 

I would put learning to maintain and diagnose engine and drive line faults to be very important, but they are pretty reliable given reasonable maintenance (including de-watering the fuel tank annually) so I would put this third from top.

 

That just leaves the electrics, learning the circuits and how to test them using a meter. An electrical fault can stop you starting, prevent you getting any water, in many cases flushing the toilet and can leave you with no lights so I would make this the number 1.

 

The notes Arthur refers to are on www.tb-training.co.uk, but they were course notes, the "how to do it" were hands-on during the courses that no longer run, although the RYA franchisees offer engine courses of variable quality (in my opinion), so if you decide to pay for one ask for recommendations.

 

Either privately by email to myself or by posting on  this forum will get you answers to the many questions that you will have.

 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

The advice to get to grips with batteries and the charging is arguably the most vital skill because if you don't get your head around that expect to be paying well over a hundred a month for new batteries that you have ruined - and just to help some battery "gauges" seem designed to help less aware boaters destroy their batteries.

 

I'd agree with you - BUT - only if the engine / fuel system has been well maintained and serviced, and, the fuel is regularly checked for water and dieselbug.

 

Have a look back over the last 2 or 3 months postings (crys for help) and compare have many have been "engine based" and how many have been 'battery based' questions.

 

I cannot think of a single 'battery problem' thread but there have been a number of "I've got diesel in my engine'", " it wont start" "I've got white / black smoke', "It keeps overheating" and several more.

 

If you have a functioning engine you can recharge you batteries.

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Basic Engine Maintance

followed by

Basic Battery Management 

 

Already been been said but it is so important.

Without an engine you won’t get far. There’ll be times when you’re out in the sticks and need to problem solve yourself. And without an engine you won’t charge them batteries. 

And again, curtesy with others, it’ll get you a long way with help when you need it. 

 

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25 minutes ago, The Narrow Way said:

 

Ah, this is very cool.  Just checking their site, they offer a Helmsman Certificate course, which interests me.  Any idea whether it would be advisable to do this with them or with the Narrowboat Skills Centre?

After 30 years sailing, when bought my own seagoing boat in 2006, I did the RYA diesel engine course and, to give my wife a gentle intro to boat handling, we did did the Helmsmans course. Bothe served us well, and I can recommend them.

 

The next most useful thing would be a knowledge of how batteries and charging sources work.

 

Other than that, I learned things as they went wrong. YouTube  videos are very useful, as is this forum, as long as you explain your issue, and ignore the curmudgeonly responses that often ensue from the usual suspects.

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41 minutes ago, The Narrow Way said:

 

Yes, I'm already doing a lot of reading on here about charging states, etc.  I think battery management is definitely going to be a focus.

 

 

I can virtually guarantee it. No matter how crucial and important you decide it is, you'll discover it is more so.

 

 

42 minutes ago, The Narrow Way said:

No worries on the considerate boater front.  I'm a community-oriented person, and somebody that really respects the tradition of the lifestyle.

 

In which case you'll find yourself in the minority.

 

Oh dammit, I've done that 'curmudgeonly' thing again!! 

 

 

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58 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

Unless you buy a rust bucker AND have the facilities to get it out of the water, welding would be very low down the list. If it is in tolerable condition inside, then woodworking is only marginally higher up the list.

 

You missed out preparation and painting because unless you will be able to afford several thousand pounds (£5000 to £10,000 say) every 10 years or so you will be repainting the boat.

 

The advice to get to grips with batteries and the charging is arguably the most vital skill because if you don't get your head around that expect to be paying well over a hundred a month for new batteries that you have ruined - and just to help some battery "gauges" seem designed to help less aware boaters destroy their batteries.

 

I would put learning to maintain and diagnose engine and drive line faults to be very important, but they are pretty reliable given reasonable maintenance (including de-watering the fuel tank annually) so I would put this third from top.

 

That just leaves the electrics, learning the circuits and how to test them using a meter. An electrical fault can stop you starting, prevent you getting any water, in many cases flushing the toilet and can leave you with no lights so I would make this the number 1.

 

The notes Arthur refers to are on www.tb-training.co.uk, but they were course notes, the "how to do it" were hands-on during the courses that no longer run, although the RYA franchisees offer engine courses of variable quality (in my opinion), so if you decide to pay for one ask for recommendations.

 

Either privately by email to myself or by posting on  this forum will get you answers to the many questions that you will have.

 

 

 

 

Brilliant, many thanks.

There's a definite theme emerging -

1) Electrics & Batteries
2) (but very close to 1) Engine & Drive

Your site looks like an incredible resource, and I do understand the context of it being reference for a previous course, so will bear that in mind while perusing it.

 

43 minutes ago, Goliath said:

Basic Engine Maintance

followed by

Basic Battery Management 

 

Already been been said but it is so important.

Without an engine you won’t get far. There’ll be times when you’re out in the sticks and need to problem solve yourself. And without an engine you won’t charge them batteries. 

And again, curtesy with others, it’ll get you a long way with help when you need it. 

 

 

Cheers! I appreciate your last point too.  I definitely am aware that I would be entering a community and reliant on mutual support to an extent.

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35 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

 

I can virtually guarantee it. No matter how crucial and important you decide it is, you'll discover it is more so.

 

 

 

In which case you'll find yourself in the minority.

 

Oh dammit, I've done that 'curmudgeonly' thing again!! 

 

 

 

Actually, I think you were right to pull that sentence out - it's a bit clunky.  from what I perceive, narrowboat living (and leisuring) is a mix of traditions, collective needs, and individual whimsy in any case.  But the point is - I respect it's foibles!

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11 minutes ago, The Narrow Way said:

There's a definite theme emerging -

1) Electrics & Batteries
2) (but very close to 1) Engine & Drive

 

I disagree. 

 

1) impacts on new boaters almost immediately. There are any number of threads on here by people who just collected their new boat the day before yesterday saying "Help, all my power had gone" (to paraphrase). And all they've done is run their knackered set of batteries flat. 

 

Engine and drive maintenance is a long term thing. You can basically forget about it until it suits you and is convenient. A hundred or two hours after getting the boat, say. 

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1 minute ago, MtB said:

 

I disagree. 

 

1) impacts on new boaters almost immediately. There are any number of threads on here by people who just collected their new boat the day before yesterday saying "Help, all my power had gone" (to paraphrase). And all they've done is run their knackered set of batteries flat. 

 

Engine and drive maintenance is a long term thing. You can basically forget about it until it suits you and is convenient. A hundred or two hours after getting the boat, say. 

 

This is a good point. 

 

However, I think we have settled on a 1) and a 2), so that's a start!

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3 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

I disagree. 

 

1) impacts on new boaters almost immediately. There are any number of threads on here by people who just collected their new boat the day before yesterday saying "Help, all my power had gone" (to paraphrase). And all they've done is run their knackered set of batteries flat. 

 

Engine and drive maintenance is a long term thing. You can basically forget about it until it suits you and is convenient. A hundred or two hours after getting the boat, say. 

What would you suggest for 2) ?

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7 minutes ago, Richard10002 said:

What would you suggest for 2) ?

 

Still engines and drive lines. The difference is how urgent the individual thinks it is. MtB and myself suggest it is less urgent, especially if you buy a decently maintained boat. If you buy a "bargain" boat, then it is unlikely to have been well looked after engine wise. It is even worse if it has an "odd" engine in it. A recent topic was a boat that broke down and refuse to start several times on the way home. It had a Saab engine in it that only a minority will be really familiar with, and I am sure it was a cheap boat. It is usually the cheap bats that have early problems. If the OP is looking at the £25,000 or less market then he needs lots of knowledge right now, but if he is expecting to pay a decent price then I stand by my listing.

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Just to echo the general theme, engine and electrics.

And specifically, find out what engine you've got and there'll probably be a youtube video on how you service it. 

If there isn't, get a pro to do the first service, but only on the understanding that they explain the steps to you as they go- you can offer a few more quid as this will slow them down a fair bit. You can also video them doing the service so you have something to refer back to.

Fees do vary wildly, but I've been asked for almost £200 to do an engine service including alternator belts, and you very quickly realise that there's a lot of money you can save by doing the servicing yourself. 

 

The thing about the batteries is that you need to be aware of their state literally within minutes of you first moving onto the boat. 

I didnt look at my batteries until the second day, and by then they had already been over-discharged and probably damaged by my ignorance, and the cost of those mistakes will be a few hundred quid for a new set. So check the battery voltage when you get aboard, and keep an eye on it every hour or so throughout the first few days.  

 

 

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1 hour ago, Goliath said:

And again, curtesy with others, it’ll get you a long way with help when you need it. 

And appreciate that sometimes the knowledgeable folk here may need more information than you have provided initially to diagnose whatever problem you have. So if you are asked supplementary questions, they are to help, not to catch you out. And if you can't answer straight away (for example because you won't be visiting the boat for a fortnight) much better to say so than to go silent, leaving others to speculate why you aren't helping them to help you.

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5 minutes ago, David Mack said:

And appreciate that sometimes the knowledgeable folk here may need more information than you have provided initially to diagnose whatever problem you have. So if you are asked supplementary questions, they are to help, not to catch you out. And if you can't answer straight away (for example because you won't be visiting the boat for a fortnight) much better to say so than to go silent, leaving others to speculate why you aren't helping them to help you.


agreed 👍totally 

 

but I was on about  when out on the cut in general 😃

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38 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

Just to echo the general theme, engine and electrics.

And specifically, find out what engine you've got and there'll probably be a youtube video on how you service it. 

If there isn't, get a pro to do the first service, but only on the understanding that they explain the steps to you as they go- you can offer a few more quid as this will slow them down a fair bit. You can also video them doing the service so you have something to refer back to.

Fees do vary wildly, but I've been asked for almost £200 to do an engine service including alternator belts, and you very quickly realise that there's a lot of money you can save by doing the servicing yourself. 

 

The thing about the batteries is that you need to be aware of their state literally within minutes of you first moving onto the boat. 

I didnt look at my batteries until the second day, and by then they had already been over-discharged and probably damaged by my ignorance, and the cost of those mistakes will be a few hundred quid for a new set. So check the battery voltage when you get aboard, and keep an eye on it every hour or so throughout the first few days.  

 

 

 

I would just comment that unless a battery bank is faulty, checking the voltage will not tell you much unless you understand "rested voltage" and how rested voltage relates to approximate state of charge. To the lay person, there is not much difference between 12.2 and 12.7, or even 11.8 and 12.7 volts. The above answer shows how poorly battery voltage is understood. If the engine or any other charger is running then the voltage will be the charging voltage, not the rested voltage, and if you try to infer state of charge from that it will be too high. Likewise, if you measure the voltage with a load running, especially a heavy load, then the voltage will not be the rested voltage, and you will underestimate the state of charge. This is why getting a good grasp of batteries and their charging very early in ownership is vital.

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