Not looking good for us

[LadyG]

1 minute ago, Goliath said:

Thought you’d gone back on the Leeds Liverpool?

Not yet, I've yet to go over the tops, I want to enjoy the moors, but a bit of a wimp when it comes to survival conditions. 

[David Mack]

2 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Not yet, I've yet to go over the tops, I want to enjoy the moors, but a bit of a wimp when it comes to survival conditions. 

Which way did you get to Hebden Bridge then?

[Arthur Marshall]

14 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Only because you or a previous owner has declared it when licencing the boat. CRT has no independent verification of any of the boat data on their records.

 

Post RCD boats should have all the relevant documentation, but I imagine as the years pass this may get separated from the boat. And there may be no reliable records for pre RCD craft, home built boats etc.

 

No idea how old mine is. CRT don't know,  BW didn't. Might be able to do carbon dating on the rust... I bought it, I think,  in 1989, the guy I got it from had bought it off someone else about ten years before. It looks like an early hire boat by the layout and I think the engine is mid sixties, except I've also forgotten how to work that out from the Lister data plate.

But as most boats don't decrease much in value, age may not be a good way of deciding a decreasing charge. I really don't think there is one.

People who can afford it, and who like it, will always mess about in boats while there's something to mess about on. And most of them still wave as they pass, however rich they are (virtually all of them more than me, that's for sure).

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

17 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Not yet, I've yet to go over the tops, I want to enjoy the moors, but a bit of a wimp when it comes to survival conditions. 

Stoodley Pike is an accessible walk.

 

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

35 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Only because you or a previous owner has declared it when licencing the boat. CRT has no independent verification of any of the boat data on their records.

 

Post RCD boats should have all the relevant documentation, but I imagine as the years pass this may get separated from the boat. And there may be no reliable records for pre RCD craft, home built boats etc.

 

yes I think CRT accepts what you give them

 

 mine’s like yours an old hull (well half an old hull) with a 1980’s cabin, so old in both respects but which to go by?
I guess the hull.

 

[IanD]

21 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

No idea how old mine is. CRT don't know,  BW didn't. Might be able to do carbon dating on the rust... I bought it, I think,  in 1989, the guy I got it from had bought it off someone else about ten years before. It looks like an early hire boat by the layout and I think the engine is mid sixties, except I've also forgotten how to work that out from the Lister data plate.

But as most boats don't decrease much in value, age may not be a good way of deciding a decreasing charge. I really don't think there is one.

People who can afford it, and who like it, will always mess about in boats while there's something to mess about on. And most of them still wave as they pass, however rich they are (virtually all of them more than me, that's for sure).

 

If anything older than 25 years is a flat rate you wouldn't have a problem anyway, all CART need to know would be "pre-1998"...

 

Boats certainly do decrease in value with age, nobody buying a 20-year-old boat would be able to afford one if they cost the same as a new one... 🙂

 

Like I keep saying, rejecting the good because it's not perfect isn't sensible, there'll *never* be any perfect system -- the question is whether it's better than what we have now.

 

I'd say a system where someone on a 25-year-old boat pays half the license fee of someone on a brand new boat is better than them paying the same, for the reasons given above -- nothing to do with usage of water or locks or anything else, it's a proxy for ability to pay. But I'm sure others will disagree, especially if it costs them more money... 😉

Edited February 21, 2023 by IanD

[Cheshire cat]

I took the train from Manchester to Leeds on Sunday. I was pleasantly suprised by just how many boats there are on the Rochdale. Many more than I was expecting.

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

Yes, I still disagree although it won’t cost me any more money and it’d be no skin off my nose so to speak if the wealthy pay more on their license. 
As I’ve said before if the wealthy are feeling charitable they can donate directly to CRT coffers.

 

 

[Jon57]

Just now, Cheshire cat said:

I took the train from Manchester to Leeds on Sunday. I was pleasantly suprised by just how many boats there are on the Rochdale. Many more than I was expecting.

Finally saw the light and came to civilisation 🤣🤣👍

[IanD]

2 minutes ago, Cheshire cat said:

I took the train from Manchester to Leeds on Sunday. I was pleasantly suprised by just how many boats there are on the Rochdale. Many more than I was expecting.

Were they all afloat on the water, or were some upside down and on fire on the mud? 😉

[matty40s]

2 hours ago, Goliath said:

Stoodley Pike is an accessible walk.

 

Do you have to get off the boat though?

[TheBiscuits]

Last time we discussed licence pricing by value I suggested insured value would be an easy starting point, especially as CRT already have permission to check insurance details.

[IanD]

1 minute ago, TheBiscuits said:

Last time we discussed licence pricing by value I suggested insured value would be an easy starting point, especially as CRT already have permission to check insurance details.

Last time I suggested that it was shot down in flames by the usual suspects... 😞

[MtB]

Just now, IanD said:

Last time I suggested that it was shot down in flames by the usual suspects... 😞

 

Yeah. How about measuring the length of a boat and just charging according to how long it is. We could even have a chart to look it up on. 

 

I expect this simple idea will get shot down in flames too. 

 

 

[IanD]

2 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Yeah. How about measuring the length of a boat and just charging according to how long it is. We could even have a chart to look it up on. 

 

I expect this simple idea will get shot down in flames too. 

 

 

Yeah. How about measuring the width of a boat and just charging according to how wide it is. We could even have a chart to look it up on. 

 

I expect this simple idea will get shot down in flames too. 

 

There seems to be a theme here... 😞

Edited February 21, 2023 by IanD

[Jon57]

How about a black box or whatever colour 😬pay per mile and lock 🥴

[MtB]

1 minute ago, IanD said:

Yeah. How about measuring the width of a boat and just charging according to how wide it is. We could even have a chart to look it up on. 

 

I expect this simple idea will get shot down in flames too. 

 

No that would be GROSSLY UNFAIR!!!!!

 

Apparently....

 

 

 

[magnetman]

Volume. Gauge the draught and charge based on that and the length x width. 

 

Could help pay for more dredging.

Just now, Jon57 said:

How about a black box or whatever colour 😬pay per mile and lock 🥴

I tolled you already this was the answer. 

[MtB]

Just now, magnetman said:

Volume. Gauge the draught and charge based on that and the length x width. 

 

 

Otherwise known as displacement in the world of shipping. 

 

 

 

[ditchcrawler]

2 hours ago, Goliath said:

yes I think CRT accepts what you give them

 

 

Just like the length, never seen a checker on the towpath with a tape measure, just an Ipad

[Jon57]

Just now, magnetman said:

Volume. Gauge the draught and charge based on that and the length x width. 

 

Could help pay for more dredging.

Yes them with a deep draughted  Boat getting a reduction for doing the dredging foc.

[magnetman]

Just now, MtB said:

 

Otherwise known as displacement in the world of shipping. 

 

 

 

I was thinking about canal boats. 

 

Most (not all) have vertical sides below the water so it would be easy to gauge the volume without complicated equations or a travel hoist to weigh it with. 

 

 

[IanD]

1 minute ago, Jon57 said:

How about a black box or whatever colour 😬pay per mile and lock 🥴

Which of course would encourage people to squat in one place and never move, and penalises people who actually use the canals -- well, for navigation, like the name suggests.

 

I expect this would be popular with the first group and *very* unpopular with the second group -- which presumably includes most of the boaters (on CWDF and elsewhere) with any interest in or commitment to the canals... 😞

[magnetman]

1 minute ago, IanD said:

Which of course would encourage people to squat in one place and never move, and penalises people who actually use the canals -- well, for navigation, like the name suggests.

 

I expect this would be popular with the first group and *very* unpopular with the second group -- which presumably includes most of the boaters (on CWDF and elsewhere) with any interest in or commitment to the canals... 😞

Yes but a toll would be charged as long as you were on the water in a certain area not just how often you used moveable structures. 

[Jon57]

1 minute ago, IanD said:

Which of course would encourage people to squat in one place and never move, and penalises people who actually use the canals -- well, for navigation, like the name suggests.

 

I expect this would be popular with the first group and *very* unpopular with the second group -- which presumably includes most of the boaters (on CWDF and elsewhere) with any interest in or commitment to the canals... 😞

Even them in a marina 🤭standard licence fee plus pay as you go fee👍