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Switching a combi to "inverter only"


blackrose

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1 minute ago, David Mack said:

And if your electricity really was 100% renewable there would have been no need for the supplier to put up the prices when gas prices increased.

 

 

Well my electricity comes from EDF apparently. So probably 100% nuclear. 

 

Which raises the question in my furry little brain, does nuclear count as 'renewable'? After all, apart from the construction of the plant, no Co2 is being produced along with my leccy. 

 

All this assumes the same as earlier, that the nuclear electrons fed into the grid know to come to my hovel, not next door who might be on a 100% green leccy. 

 

 

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28 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

 

Well my electricity comes from EDF apparently. So probably 100% nuclear. 

 

Which raises the question in my furry little brain, does nuclear count as 'renewable'? After all, apart from the construction of the plant, no Co2 is being produced along with my leccy. 

 

All this assumes the same as earlier, that the nuclear electrons fed into the grid know to come to my hovel, not next door who might be on a 100% green leccy. 

 

 

 

Ah, back to the claims on the EDF. I think they claim that it is zero carbon, which I think is questionable when you start to think about moving the spent fuel rods about. refining them. and returning.

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On 23/01/2023 at 11:58, MtB said:

 

 

Well my electricity comes from EDF apparently. So probably 100% nuclear. 

 

Which raises the question in my furry little brain, does nuclear count as 'renewable'? After all, apart from the construction of the plant, no Co2 is being produced along with my leccy. 

 

All this assumes the same as earlier, that the nuclear electrons fed into the grid know to come to my hovel, not next door who might be on a 100% green leccy. 

 

 

Your electricity comes the same as any other provider, from a mix of all of them... unless you have the special EDF plumbed in cable from sizewell.. :)

Edited by robtheplod
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2 hours ago, robtheplod said:

Your electricity comes the same as any other provider, from a mix of all of them...

 

 

Well yes, blindingly obviously, which was my point. Poking fun at Octopus et al who are allowed tariffs claiming 100% renewable electricity, to which your comment also applies, dunnit!!

 

 

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9 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

 

Well yes, blindingly obviously, which was my point. Poking fun at Octopus et al who are allowed tariffs claiming 100% renewable electricity, to which your comment also applies, dunnit!!

 

 

 

Yes, but saying only paid for to low carbon providers would not make half as good marketing bullshine.

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17 hours ago, robtheplod said:

Your electricity comes the same as any other provider, from a mix of all of them... unless you have the special EDF plumbed in cable from sizewell.. :)

 

Given that mains electricity is alternating current, I suspect the same electrons in the cables within your house simply shuffle backwards and forwards very quickly.

 

This means that everyone's electricity is the same as when the supply was first connected to their house; sourced from high sulphur coal in most cases... :)

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1 minute ago, cuthound said:

 

Given that mains electricity is alternating current, I suspect the same electrons in the cables within your house simply shuffle backwards and forwards very quickly.

 

This means that everyone's electricity is the same as when the supply was first connected to their house; sourced from high sulphur coal in most cases... :)

 

Nope. We discussed this exact point in a thread a few months back. Them lectrons travel at the speed of light up and down the wires and in 1/100 of a second they certainly get as far as back to the power station, easily!

 

 

 

186,000 miles a second is the speed of light, so the electrons will travel 1,860 miles in each half cycle of the AC power supply. 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Nope. We discussed this exact point in a thread a few months back. Them lectrons travel at the speed of light up and down the wires and in 1/100 of a second they certainly get as far as back to the power station, easily!

 

 

 

 

Yes but when the polarity reverses won't you just get the same ones back?

 

How would you identify individual electrons anyway, do thy have serial numbers?

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1 hour ago, cuthound said:

Yes but when the polarity reverses won't you just get the same ones back?

 

 

Not necessarily. Some of them might get sucked away down the wires to a different house. 

 

 

1 hour ago, cuthound said:

How would you identify individual electrons anyway, do thy have serial numbers?

 

 

Probably, but you'd have to look really closely to read them....

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, MtB said:

Them lectrons travel at the speed of light up and down the wires and in 1/100 of a second they certainly get as far as back to the power station, easily!

No they don't.

"Drift velocity, the average speed at which electrons travel in a conductor when subjected to an electric field, is about 1mm per second. It’s the electromagnetic wave rippling through the electrons that propagates at close to the speed of light. The dimensions of the wire and electrical properties like its inductance affect the exact propagation speed, but usually it will be around 90 per cent of the speed of light – about 270,000 km/s."

https://www.sciencefocus.com/science/how-fast-does-electricity-flow/

 

Or as https://www.wtamu.edu/~cbaird/sq/mobile/2014/02/19/what-is-the-speed-of-electricity/

puts it :

"Consider this analogy. A long line of people is waiting to enter a restaurant. Each person fidgets nervously about in their spot in line. The person at the end of the line grows impatient and shoves the person in front of him. In turn, when each person in the line receives a shove from the person behind him, he shoves the person in front of him. The shove will therefore be passed along from person to person, forwards through the line. The shove will reach the restaurant doors long before the last person in line personally makes it to the doors. In this analogy, the people represent the electrons, their arms represent the electromagnetic field, and the shove represents a fluctuation or wave in the electromagnetic field. The speed at which each person fidgets represents the individual electron velocity, the speed at which each person individually progresses through the line represents the electron drift velocity, and the speed at which the shove travels through the line represents the signal velocity. Based on this simple analogy, we would expect the signal velocity to be very fast, the individual velocity to be somewhat fast, and the drift velocity to be slow."

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17 minutes ago, David Mack said:

 

"Consider this analogy. A long line of people is waiting to enter a restaurant. Each person fidgets nervously about in their spot in line. The person at the end of the line grows impatient and shoves the person in front of him. In turn, when each person in the line receives a shove from the person behind him, he shoves the person in front of him. The shove will therefore be passed along from person to person, forwards through the line. The shove will reach the restaurant doors long before the last person in line personally makes it to the doors. In this analogy, the people represent the electrons, their arms represent the electromagnetic field, and the shove represents a fluctuation or wave in the electromagnetic field. The speed at which each person fidgets represents the individual electron velocity, the speed at which each person individually progresses through the line represents the electron drift velocity, and the speed at which the shove travels through the line represents the signal velocity. Based on this simple analogy, we would expect the signal velocity to be very fast, the individual velocity to be somewhat fast, and the drift velocity to be slow."

This is an interesting analogy, there is a similar one involving marbles in a small bore pipe.

 

The question which arises is "why the fluctuation speed cannot exceed the speed of light?".

 

I have never seen a simple analogy which satisfactorily explains this.

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1 hour ago, David Mack said:

No they don't.

"Drift velocity, the average speed at which electrons travel in a conductor when subjected to an electric field, is about 1mm per second. It’s the electromagnetic wave rippling through the electrons that propagates at close to the speed of light. The dimensions of the wire and electrical properties like its inductance affect the exact propagation speed, but usually it will be around 90 per cent of the speed of light – about 270,000 km/s."

https://www.sciencefocus.com/science/how-fast-does-electricity-flow/

 

Or as https://www.wtamu.edu/~cbaird/sq/mobile/2014/02/19/what-is-the-speed-of-electricity/

puts it :

"Consider this analogy. A long line of people is waiting to enter a restaurant. Each person fidgets nervously about in their spot in line. The person at the end of the line grows impatient and shoves the person in front of him. In turn, when each person in the line receives a shove from the person behind him, he shoves the person in front of him. The shove will therefore be passed along from person to person, forwards through the line. The shove will reach the restaurant doors long before the last person in line personally makes it to the doors. In this analogy, the people represent the electrons, their arms represent the electromagnetic field, and the shove represents a fluctuation or wave in the electromagnetic field. The speed at which each person fidgets represents the individual electron velocity, the speed at which each person individually progresses through the line represents the electron drift velocity, and the speed at which the shove travels through the line represents the signal velocity. Based on this simple analogy, we would expect the signal velocity to be very fast, the individual velocity to be somewhat fast, and the drift velocity to be slow."

 

 

I knew that really.... :) 

 

The other thread discussing it progressed along similar lines!

 

 

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On 23/01/2023 at 11:58, MtB said:

Well my electricity comes from EDF apparently. So probably 100% nuclear. 

 

Which raises the question in my furry little brain, does nuclear count as 'renewable'? After all, apart from the construction of the plant, no Co2 is being produced along with my leccy. 

 

You're confusing two different things here. In terms of climate change nuclear energy production does not release greenhouse gases. However, by most definitions low carbon/low GHG emissions doesn't necessarily equate to being renewable. 

 

'Renewable' energy refers to energy from sources that are constantly replenished - like the water for hydroelectric dams that is topped up by the rain, or the sunlight that reappears every day for solar panels. Because nuclear power uses up radioactive fuel, it is not renewable in the same way.

 

Quote from Natural History Museum website.

Edited by blackrose
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1 hour ago, blackrose said:

 

You're confusing two different things here. In terms of climate change nuclear energy production does not release greenhouse gases. However, by most definitions low carbon/low GHG emissions doesn't necessarily equate to being renewable. 

 

'Renewable' energy refers to energy from sources that are constantly replenished - like the water for hydroelectric dams that is topped up by the rain, or the sunlight that reappears every day for solar panels. Because nuclear power uses up radioactive fuel, it is not renewable in the same way.

 

Quote from Natural History Museum website.

But so called renewable energy -hydroelectric, solar, wind - does not come from a source that is constantly replenished. It comes fundamentally from the sun, and the sun has a limited life and will run out of fuel in a few (billion) years.

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55 minutes ago, nicknorman said:

But so called renewable energy -hydroelectric, solar, wind - does not come from a source that is constantly replenished. It comes fundamentally from the sun, and the sun has a limited life and will run out of fuel in a few (billion) years.

 

And the energy for tidal power of course, comes from the motion of the moon. 

 

So eventually its orbit will slow down and it will crash into us... I think!!

 

Although I think it will do that anyway, regardless of whether we build tidal lagoons all over the place....

 

 

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4 hours ago, MtB said:

 

And the energy for tidal power of course, comes from the motion of the moon. 

 

So eventually its orbit will slow down and it will crash into us... I think!!

 

Although I think it will do that anyway, regardless of whether we build tidal lagoons all over the place....

 

 

 

Yes tidal power does affect planets and moons. Which is why the moon's rotational speed is the same as the planet's so that it always presents the same face to the earth. The energy has to come from somewhere and as you say, ultimately it comes from the moon's orbital kinetic energy. Although if it slows down and moves to a lower orbit, setting up habitations on the moon would be easier (closer).

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10 hours ago, frahkn said:

This is an interesting analogy, there is a similar one involving marbles in a small bore pipe.

 

The question which arises is "why the fluctuation speed cannot exceed the speed of light?".

 

I have never seen a simple analogy which satisfactorily explains this.

Because simple analogies and relativity don't mix... 😉

 

If you think that's bad, try quantum physics...

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38 minutes ago, IanD said:

Because simple analogies and relativity don't mix... 😉

 

If you think that's bad, try quantum physics...

 

Ass my dear old departed Dad used to say about quantum physics, "If you think you understand this point I am making about quantum physics, I can't have explained it properly.

 

I always imagined he nicked that from someone famous....

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, MtB said:

 

Ass my dear old departed Dad used to say about quantum physics, "If you think you understand this point I am making about quantum physics, I can't have explained it properly.

 

I always imagined he nicked that from someone famous....

 

 

 

 

 

Yep, Richard Feynman.

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