Which liveaboard is best?

[VincePam]

32 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

Good starting point for water and a lot else try www.tb-training.co.uk in the maintance notes.

 

32 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

Good starting point for water and a lot else try www.tb-training.co.uk in the maintance notes.

Brilliant!

[VincePam]

On 10/01/2023 at 22:38, ditchcrawler said:

First time I went through  three of us sailed out one behind the other on the level, no locking.

Hi Brian

 

do you think a LOA  ft57 - Beam  ft10.50 of about 50,000 lbs is within size to travel around most of England?

 

Thanks

On 09/01/2023 at 21:47, Alan de Enfield said:

 

As I said many post ago- and even attached a map showing why, and how to 'get out'.

I possibly found one as LOA  ft57 - Beam  ft10.50 of about 50,000 lbs is within size to travel around most of England?

[Tony Brooks]

17 minutes ago, VincePam said:

Hi Brian

 

do you think a LOA  ft57 - Beam  ft10.50 of about 50,000 lbs is within size to travel around most of England?

 

Thanks

I possibly found one as LOA  ft57 - Beam  ft10.50 of about 50,000 lbs is within size to travel around most of England?

 

No, unless you are talking about sea voyages. There are canals around the midlands with a 6' 10" beam limit. They split the wide northern from the wide southern waterways.

[VincePam]

56 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

No, unless you are talking about sea voyages. There are canals around the midlands with a 6' 10" beam limit. They split the wide northern from the wide southern waterways.

Thank you Tony. Then 10.50 would allow me to travel in full around the wide southern or 10.20 is the limit and 10.50 is as having a 12ft?

[Tony Brooks]

11 minutes ago, VincePam said:

Thank you Tony. Then 10.50 would allow me to travel in full around the wide southern or 10.20 is the limit and 10.50 is as having a 12ft?

 

Are you ignoring the warnings we gave a long time ago that it is not just the beam, but also the boat profile that matters with bridges and tunnels.

 

The wider a boat is on the inland waterways, the more likely you are to hit problems in tunnels and such like. Also, the more likely you are to suffer handling and water flow past the hull on waterways that can apparently accept the beam. I am afraid that I do not have an encyclopedic knowledge of all the different waterways dimensions and have no intention of looking them all up for you. I am sure, profile willing, a 10.2 ft beam will allow you access to the important parts of the system, but as you go wider the more likely you are to hit problems. I think the Stort has a13ft beam (please check) so a 12ft should be OK PROFILE WILLING, but you may have to transit tunnels with the permission of CaRT so you don't eet another boat, even a narrow boat, coming the other way, and possibly exceptionally early in the morning - like 4 am

[VincePam]

25 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Are you ignoring the warnings we gave a long time ago that it is not just the beam, but also the boat profile that matters with bridges and tunnels.

 

The wider a boat is on the inland waterways, the more likely you are to hit problems in tunnels and such like. Also, the more likely you are to suffer handling and water flow past the hull on waterways that can apparently accept the beam. I am afraid that I do not have an encyclopedic knowledge of all the different waterways dimensions and have no intention of looking them all up for you. I am sure, profile willing, a 10.2 ft beam will allow you access to the important parts of the system, but as you go wider the more likely you are to hit problems. I think the Stort has a13ft beam (please check) so a 12ft should be OK PROFILE WILLING, but you may have to transit tunnels with the permission of CaRT so you don't eet another boat, even a narrow boat, coming the other way, and possibly exceptionally early in the morning - like 4 am

ok. thanks. so really 10.2 is the max I have to stick to

[Alan de Enfield]

40 minutes ago, VincePam said:

ok. thanks. so really 10.2 is the max I have to stick to

 

I think you need to appreciate that anything over standard narrowboat size (6' 10" wide and about 6 ' high) will affect (and limit) where you can go.

 

You need to decide where you will be cruising and then find out the maximum size that can use those waters. Delending on where you want to go you may be able to use a 14' beam boat or are limited to 6' 10".

 

Only you can decide.

 

I think I posted this picture earlier - it shows why a 'tall' narrowboat can fit where a low widebeam cannot.

 

 

 

[Tony Brooks]

48 minutes ago, VincePam said:

ok. thanks. so really 10.2 is the max I have to stick to

 

Almost certainly, a 10' 6" fly bridge cruiser won't pass a lot of bridges, whereas a 31 ft wide bam "narrowboat" or flat floor cruiser might. You need to decide the type of boat you want, then research the waterways you wish to cruise. This may require a visit by car to measure the bridges and tunnels to determine the boat profiles that will fit. As Alan's image shows, you need to consider more than just the beam.

[VincePam]

14 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Almost certainly, a 10' 6" fly bridge cruiser won't pass a lot of bridges, whereas a 31 ft wide bam "narrowboat" or flat floor cruiser might. You need to decide the type of boat you want, then research the waterways you wish to cruise. This may require a visit by car to measure the bridges and tunnels to determine the boat profiles that will fit. As Alan's image shows, you need to consider more than just the beam.

Hi. I got that right. I am restricting the search to narrow boats only because of that, avoiding if possible vertical lateral sides. I have already purged my searches of other kinds so that bridges are not a problem. 

22 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

I think you need to appreciate that anything over standard narrowboat size (6' 10" wide and about 6 ' high) will affect (and limit) where you can go.

 

You need to decide where you will be cruising and then find out the maximum size that can use those waters. Delending on where you want to go you may be able to use a 14' beam boat or are limited to 6' 10".

 

Only you can decide.

 

I think I posted this picture earlier - it shows why a 'tall' narrowboat can fit where a low widebeam cannot.

 

 

 

Hi and thanks. I have this clear from your previous posts. My concern now is only to understand the "wide beam" limit if strictly 10.20" or 10.50" is a possibility. I still remember well previous posts about leaving enough space for the fenders, as the 6.10" won't make the cut in terms of minimum living space

 

Edited January 28, 2023 by VincePam

[MtB]

1 hour ago, VincePam said:

 

Hi and thanks. I have this clear from your previous posts. My concern now is only to understand the "wide beam" limit if strictly 10.20" or 10.50" is a possibility. I still remember well previous posts about leaving enough space for the fenders, as the 6.10" won't make the cut in terms of minimum living space

 

 

 

Point of order...

 

You are using 'non-preferred' dimensions here. Taken literally, 10.20" is 259mm and 10.50" is 267mm and boats these widths will be firmly in the 'model boat' territory. 

 

If you mean 10ft 20in then again this is nonsense, because there are 12" to the foot so 10ft 20in is actually 11ft 8in. 

 

Or if you really do mean 10.2 feet or 10.5 feet, the normal way of expressing these sizes in boat-speak would be 10ft 2.4in and 10ft 6in. 

 

 

 

[Tony Brooks]

13 hours ago, VincePam said:

Hi. I got that right. I am restricting the search to narrow boats only because of that, avoiding if possible vertical lateral sides. I have already purged my searches of other kinds so that bridges are not a problem. 

Hi and thanks. I have this clear from your previous posts. My concern now is only to understand the "wide beam" limit if strictly 10.20" or 10.50" is a possibility. I still remember well previous posts about leaving enough space for the fenders, as the 6.10" won't make the cut in terms of minimum living space

 

 

Fenders can, and ma y would say should, be lifted while underway, so if you came to a narrow lock you would simply not drop them. a wide beam narrowboat will usually have rubbing strakes, so unless you are trying to protect a boat sharing a lock with you, fenders can still be left up. The fender thing in my view only becomes an issue with GRP or wooden hulls.

[Alan de Enfield]

13 hours ago, VincePam said:

Hi. I got that right. I am restricting the search to narrow boats only because of that, avoiding if possible vertical lateral sides. I have already purged my searches of other kinds so that bridges are not a problem. 

 

13 hours ago, VincePam said:

Hi and thanks. I have this clear from your previous posts. My concern now is only to understand the "wide beam" limit if strictly 10.20" or 10.50" is a possibility. I still remember well previous posts about leaving enough space for the fenders, as the 6.10" won't make the cut in terms of minimum living space

 

 

 

To summarise - you are now resticting your searches to 'narrowboats' but a boat of 6'10" is not suitable for you.

 

If I may suggest,

I think that if you intend to (must) buy a wide boat and want to widely cruise then maybe the canal system is not going to be suitable for you, have you considered other options ?

[Tony Brooks]

I think that the OP has not got his head around the term "wide beam narrowboat" so think the single word/phrase "narrowboat" on its own means both wide beam and narrow beam - any misunderstanding could be prevented by the use of "wide beam narrowboat" if that is what he means. If it is he needs to tell us, but I fear he is not up to doing the research he needs to ensure himself any particular boat will fit the whole wide beam system.

[Alan de Enfield]

28 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

I think that the OP has not got his head around the term "wide beam narrowboat" so think the single word/phrase "narrowboat" on its own means both wide beam and narrow beam - any misunderstanding could be prevented by the use of "wide beam narrowboat" if that is what he means. If it is he needs to tell us, but I fear he is not up to doing the research he needs to ensure himself any particular boat will fit the whole wide beam system.

 

Good point.

 

Maybe this will help.

The UK is the only place in the world who woud consider making boats 7 feet wide - it was simply because it cost a lot more effort and money to make the canals wider.

 

 

Legally a narrowboat is less than 7'6" wide, but due to various reasons the 'standard' narrowboat width has been at 6' 10" for many years.

A widebeam boat is legally one that is wider than 7' 6" and many widebeam boats that are designed as a widebeam (a typical boat shaped boat, Dutch barges etc etc) are a beauty to behold.

 

Now we have a situation where people are moving out of houses and cannot afford a 'proper' wide beam boat, and a narrowboat is too 'narrow' so a new range of boats has sprung up which are generally called widebeam-narrowboats. These are basically a narrowboat cut in half and a section of steel inserted to make the boat wider. This makes them (generally) look ugly and out of proportion - almost as if an elephant has sat on a narrow boat and squashed it.

 

Your boating options are :

 

1) If you need a lot of room and are planning to have a floating house / flat, then you will either need a'widebeam', or, a 'widebeam narrowboat'. Either of which will curtail the use of all of the waterways - the wider you go the more the waterways available to you will reduce.

 

2) If you want to widely cruise on the canals you need to 'narrowboat'

 

3) If you are prepared to have your boat lifted out and taken on a truck to cross the 'narrow' parts of the canal system then you can can have a 'widebeam narrowboat', but the wider it is the more often you will have to hire a crane and a truck.

 

 

1st Picture -To show you the difference between a widebeam (mine is 14 feet) and a narrowboat here they are moored side by side. All of the dimensions are greater Height above the water, depth of the boat in the water and boat width.

 

Both boats are the same length.

 

 

2nd picture shows me moored up behind a narrowboat, again you can see the difference in sizes.

 

 

Edited January 29, 2023 by Alan de Enfield

[VincePam]

6 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Good point.

 

Maybe this will help.

The UK is the only place in the world who woud consider making boats 7 feet wide - it was simply because it cost a lot more effort and money to make the canals wider.

 

 

Legally a narrowboat is less than 7'6" wide, but due to various reasons the 'standard' narrowboat width has been at 6' 10" for many years.

A widebeam boat is legally one that is wider than 7' 6" and many widebeam boats that are designed as a widebeam (a typical boat shaped boat, Dutch barges etc etc) are a beauty to behold.

 

Now we have a situation where people are moving out of houses and cannot afford a 'proper' wide beam boat, and a narrowboat is too 'narrow' so a new range of boats has sprung up which are generally called widebeam-narrowboats. These are basically a narrowboat cut in half and a section of steel inserted to make the boat wider. This makes them (generally) look ugly and out of proportion - almost as if an elephant has sat on a narrow boat and squashed it.

 

Your boating options are :

 

1) If you need a lot of room and are planning to have a floating house / flat, then you will either need a'widebeam', or, a 'widebeam narrowboat'. Either of which will curtail the use of all of the waterways - the wider you go the more the waterways available to you will reduce.

 

2) If you want to widely cruise on the canals you need to 'narrowboat'

 

3) If you are prepared to have your boat lifted out and taken on a truck to cross the 'narrow' parts of the canal system then you can can have a 'widebeam narrowboat', but the wider it is the more often you will have to hire a crane and a truck.

 

 

1st Picture -To show you the difference between a widebeam (mine is 14 feet) and a narrowboat here they are moored side by side. All of the dimensions are greater Height above the water, depth of the boat in the water and boat width.

 

Both boats are the same length.

 

 

2nd picture shows me moored up behind a narrowboat, again you can see the difference in sizes.

 

 

 

Thanks all and apologies for my yet not up to standard language. Yes by wide beam I mean wider than 6' 10" and I got that above 10' 2" is really almost restricted to a very small area in terms of ability to travel around.  up to 10'2" I have to accept that I cannot move east to west passed Northampton, so if I want to be able to visit all round I have to keep it to 6' 10" but longer. I started viewing a few and I am now getting closer to accepting a 6' 10" proper narrowboat but 60 to 70 ft long, which appears to enable me not to have restrictions in moving around and have enough room aboard. If it does not work then I will go back to my home in Cambridge, we'll see. 

I am now trying to address layouts and trying to figure out pros-cons of traditional, semi, reverse etc. as well as heating, electrics and heads matters. Getting there and started looking for one.  Thanks all for the tips and informative notes as I new nothing and hopefully will soon find the right one.