Engine Flush - yea or nay?

[Tony1]

 

This is just idle curiosity really, but I wondered whether people think this stuff is worthwhile, great, or actually potentially a bad thing? 

I got a 400ml bottle of something called 'engine flush' with my service kit.

This was the stuff:

https://store.ukboatyard.uk/maintenance-silverhook-engine-flush-325-ml

 

After thoroughly warming up the engine, you put the engine flush in and let the engine idle for 5 minutes, then change the oil as normal. 

I've no idea whether it did any good for the engine - and with idling or low revving narrowboat diesels, glazing is the main issue, right?

 

But as a sort of conversation starter, I would be interested in people's thoughts on it, or similar products? 

After all, anything that will help to prevent issues with a narrowboat engine is worth some thought. 

 

Edited January 8, 2023 by Tony1

[Tony Brooks]

If I knew the engine had had regular oil and filter changes at the correct time I can see no reason not to use it. However, if I was unsure I would be very much more careful in case the lack of servicing had deposited a load of greasy muck over the internal parts of the engine. If it has then using the flush might loosen it so it falls off over the next few weeks and block the new oil filter. You won't know if that happens because the filter should have a bypass valve in it to allow oil to bypass a blocked filter.

 

If you are unsure about previous servicing and want to clean the inside of the engine then use the flush and the change the oil filter again a few weeks later, especially if the oil gets black very quickly.

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

I’ve used this.

All sorts on the market

which is best? 🤷‍♀️Dunno

 

[Tony Brooks]

The clue there is "always". Not a lot of danger of blocking the filter.

[Momac]

18 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

After thoroughly warming up the engine, you put the engine flush in and let the engine idle for 5 minutes, then change the oil as normal. 

I've no idea whether it did any good for the engine - and with idling or low revving narrowboat diesels, glazing is the main issue, right

 

For 5 minutes idling ? I hope not and issue.

 

I haven't used any product like that but I do stick with the engine makers  oil change intervals and the correct grade of oil.

[Tony1]

7 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

If I knew the engine had had regular oil and filter changes at the correct time I can see no reason not to use it. However, if I was unsure I would be very much more careful in case the lack of servicing had deposited a load of greasy muck over the internal parts of the engine. If it has then using the flush might loosen it so it falls off over the next few weeks and block the new oil filter. You won't know if that happens because the filter should have a bypass valve in it to allow oil to bypass a blocked filter.

 

If you are unsure about previous servicing and want to clean the inside of the engine then use the flush and the change the oil filter again a few weeks later, especially if the oil gets black very quickly.

 

Thanks Tony- my issue is that although the engine has been serviced on schedule,  with me doing less than 300 engine hours per year, the services are almost a year apart, and that instinctively feels like a long time. 

So my plan this year was to do an extra oil change about a month after the scheduled one, in the hope that it would act as a sort of 'flush'.

My thinking was that an extra oil change couldn't do any harm, and it would only cost maybe £40- so why not give it a try and see if it helped the engine a bit?

With me having just used the flush, and with the once-yearly services, I think another oil change in a few weeks sounds like a good idea. 

 

 

 

4 minutes ago, MartynG said:

For 5 minutes idling ? I hope not and issue.

 

I haven't used any product like that but I do stick with the engine makers  oil change intervals and the correct grade of oil.

 

Apologies Martyn, I didn't say that very clearly.  

My concern was that since I use the engine for battery charging in Nov, Dec, Jan and half of Feb, it is doing a lot of hours at idle, or a bit above- not to mention the 'operational' time when it is idling in locks or bridges etc. 

It is all those hours of idling that I am concerned about that might cause glazing- not the 5 minutes idling with the engine flush. 

 

 

[Momac]

4 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

 

 

My concern was that since I use the engine for battery charging in Nov, Dec, Jan and half of Feb, it is doing a lot of hours at idle,

 

 

Fresh oil and filter when the clocks change October  and  March  perhaps?

 

 

 

[Tony1]

18 minutes ago, MartynG said:

Fresh oil and filter when the clocks change October  and  March  perhaps?

 

 

 

 

To be honest, my recent thinking is the same.

Why not do two oil changes per year? The schedule says one per year would suffice if you run it for less than 250 hours, but £40 seems such a small price, and a year seems such a long time- and especially when you consider how absolutely essential the engine is to living aboard, and how much it costs to repair or replace. 

I think the next change will be end of Jan, to get rid of any residual crap loosened by the engine flush. And after that I'll see how the hours go. I'm torn between wanting to stay in the northwest for family reasons, and wanting to cruise further south (or maybe onto the L+L) for a change of scenery. So I'm not sure how far or fast the engine hours will increase this year.

But I do like the idea of 6 monthly oil changes, rather than annual, and if I end up keeping the boat for another decade, I might see some benefits in the longer term. 

 

 

Edited January 8, 2023 by Tony1

[dmr]

I did read (on another forum) about a farmer who Never changed the oil on his tractor and still got a reasonable life out of it. He concluded that the money saved on servicing was well worth any reduction in tractor life.

A high risk stratergy 😀

[Laurie Booth]

2 hours ago, Tony1 said:

 

This is just idle curiosity really, but I wondered whether people think this stuff is worthwhile, great, or actually potentially a bad thing? 

I got a 400ml bottle of something called 'engine flush' with my service kit.

This was the stuff:

https://store.ukboatyard.uk/maintenance-silverhook-engine-flush-325-ml

 

After thoroughly warming up the engine, you put the engine flush in and let the engine idle for 5 minutes, then change the oil as normal. 

I've no idea whether it did any good for the engine - and with idling or low revving narrowboat diesels, glazing is the main issue, right?

 

But as a sort of conversation starter, I would be interested in people's thoughts on it, or similar products? 

After all, anything that will help to prevent issues with a narrowboat engine is worth some thought. 

 

I use engine flush and oil change every 100 engine hours.

 

[Tony1]

34 minutes ago, Laurie Booth said:

I use engine flush and oil change every 100 engine hours.

 

 

Is your recommended service interval 100 hours, or is that your own initiative? 

 

[Laurie Booth]

17 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

 

Is your recommended service interval 100 hours, or is that your own initiative? 

 

It is the recommended service for the engine.

 

[zenataomm]

My experience is that it all depends on service history.

The only time I ever used one was on a Rover 3500 TC I'd owned all month, the flush came free with an oil and filter kit.

 

I followed the instructions to the letter, the old oil came out like treacle.

Upon starting after the short service, the dipstick launched like an ICBM, I observed the arc it traced as it bounced off the wall and rolled to a rest under the car.

On my hands and knees I was thrilled to note a couple of litres of new oil was joyously spraying itself from oodles of places.  I couldn't tell exactly why as the scene was disappearing inside a fog of blue smoke.

An idea suggested itself when I shone a torch down the oil filler, I was looking for blockages at the top end, but instead found torch light around the sump.

 

I've never felt the urge to repeat the exercise.

[DandV]

3 hours ago, Tony1 said:

 

To be honest, my recent thinking is the same.

Why not do two oil changes per year? The schedule says one per year would suffice if you run it for less than 250 hours, but £40 seems such a small price, and a year seems such a long time- and especially when you consider how absolutely essential the engine is to living aboard, and how much it costs to repair or replace. 

I think the next change will be end of Jan, to get rid of any residual crap loosened by the engine flush. And after that I'll see how the hours go. I'm torn between wanting to stay in the northwest for family reasons, and wanting to cruise further south (or maybe onto the L+L) for a change of scenery. So I'm not sure how far or fast the engine hours will increase this year.

But I do like the idea of 6 monthly oil changes, rather than annual, and if I end up keeping the boat for another decade, I might see some benefits in the longer term. 

 

 

Like you,  I think spending more on the oil for another change per year is better then buying a can of miracle cleaner.

The engine manufacturer is by far the best source of advice, perhaps tempered by any advice given by the reputable blender of the recommended oil you are using.

[Tony Brooks]

8 hours ago, Laurie Booth said:

I use engine flush and oil change every 100 engine hours.

 

 

If that is a Lister with hydraulic valve lifters I think you are very wise as long as you keep to the oil change intervals. It is using it in an engine that you have no service fotr that gives me some concern, as illustrated by Zanattaomm

[Laurie Booth]

2 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

If that is a Lister with hydraulic valve lifters I think you are very wise as long as you keep to the oil change intervals. It is using it in an engine that you have no service fotr that gives me some concern, as illustrated by Zanattaomm

It's an Mitsubishi  Inlander 60. I have owned the boat 27 years and have done the 100 hour service with engine flush every 100 hours (give or take a few hours)  The boat is a 1989 Springer Tug.

[cuthound]

14 hours ago, dmr said:

I did read (on another forum) about a farmer who Never changed the oil on his tractor and still got a reasonable life out of it. He concluded that the money saved on servicing was well worth any reduction in tractor life.

A high risk stratergy 😀

 

When I worked for BT I led a team reviewing maintenance periodicity.

 

In most cases the standby generators used to do very few hours if there were no mains failures.

 

After using oil analysis we gradually extended the oil change period from yearly or 250 hours (whichever came first) to 6 yearly or 250 hours with no adverse results from the oil analysis.

 

The generator engines did use crankcase heaters to allow full load to be applied as soon as they had started, so oil contamination from condensation was never an issue. 

 

Edited January 9, 2023 by cuthound
Missing letter

[ditchcrawler]

51 minutes ago, cuthound said:

 

When I worked for BT I led a team reviewing maintenance periodicity.

 

In most cases the standby generators used to do very few hours if there were no mains failures.

 

After using oil analysis we gradually extended the oil change period from yearly or 250 hours (whichever came first) to 6 yearly or 250 hours with no adverse results from the oil analysis.

 

The generator engines did use crankcase heaters to allow full load to be applied as son as they had started, so oil contamination from condensation was never an issue. 

 

Did you use pre lube pumps as well to oil circulation before starting

[cuthound]

46 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

Did you use pre lube pumps as well to oil circulation before starting

 

Only on the larger generators 2.7MW and above), which were  based on marine engines.

 

The smaller ones (10kVA to 2000kVA) based on automotive engines didn't use pre-lubrication.

[Tony1]

1 hour ago, cuthound said:

 

When I worked for BT I led a team reviewing maintenance periodicity.

 

In most cases the standby generators used to do very few hours if there were no mains failures.

 

After using oil analysis we gradually extended the oil change period from yearly or 250 hours (whichever came first) to 6 yearly or 250 hours with no adverse results from the oil analysis.

 

The generator engines did use crankcase heaters to allow full load to be applied as son as they had started, so oil contamination from condensation was never an issue. 

 

 

My boat had only done 650 hours in less than 5 years before I bought it, as it was a holiday/part time boat, and the owner had misread the service instructions.

He had stuck to the recommended 200 hours regardless of the time elapsed- so when I got it, it had been I think 15 months or more since the last service, although still not quite 200 hours run in that time. 

I'm not sure if this was related, but it did produce a fair bit of whiteish smoke for about 4 or 5 seconds upon starting up in the mornings. 

I had it serviced about 2 weeks in, and that reduced the smoke issue.

It does still produce a bit of smoke on startup for maybe 3 seconds, and especially in winter- but I've been told that's not unusual for a Kioti. 

But I dont intend to ever exceed the 12 month max service time that they give, regardless of engine hours run.

I spoke to a guy the other day who had an injury and wasnt able to get in and service his engine, and he had been let down by a succession of canal tradesmen who were supposed to do the service. I may have misheard, but I think he said it was over 700 hours since the last service.

I looked horrified and said I wouldn't even dare to start my engine if it had been that long overdue, but thankfully he got it sorted a day or so later. 

 

 

 

Edited January 9, 2023 by Tony1

[TheBiscuits]

10 hours ago, Laurie Booth said:

I have owned the boat 27 years and have done the 100 hour service with engine flush every 100 hours

 

Twice then? 😁