Mooring at Llangollen to rise to £20 per night?

[Arthur Marshall]

One of local boaters has posted the following on Facebook. I suspect it's rubbish, but a couple of commenters have said they think it's a very good idea... I've had to reformat it a bit. A lot of it seems to show muddledthinking by someone who doesn't want to move away from the town, but I thought it might be of interest.

 

"Llangollen Basin News  Regarding Closures and mooring. 

TLDR Electric will be switched off Canal will be closed, don't know when 14 day cruising still applies 

Overstaying permitted with permission

Basin had 2 day limit (summer?) Basin Fee to rise to £20 by summer £60 fines for none payers. CRT plan to pursue action over overstayers. 

I have just gotten off of the phone with a CRT licence officer for the Llangollen canal. It conflicts slightly with what Neil has said. More on that.  The closure is going to happen, it is down to a contractor but they cannot say definitely when. The 14 day cruising rules still apply. It is down to the boater to plan around stoppages, and continuous cruising rules of 2 weeks still apply. He said obviously overstays within reason and on request are allowed but only mentioned an extra week. Any overstay will be subject to the normal notices and actions against you.  

Apparently there is a sign that states 2 day limit, £6/day, £60 each day after. I spoke with Neil at the Cafe and he said the rules are 2 days summer at £6/night, 14 days in winter £6/night. The £60 is a fine if you haven't been paying the £60.  CRT will lock the Bollards and turn the power off, this is a contractor and they cannot say exactly when this will happen. There is currently no plan to keep the power on. I don't know if this affects the linear moorings, only the basis as far as I know. 

CRT licence officer went on to say that the price of the Basin is expected to rise to £20/night by summer, too cheap.  Also, CRT have some issues with vandalism around the Basin, they do not assume or even accusing boaters, they don't believe boaters are to blame.  CRT have an issue at the Basin with boaters who have overstayed the permitted 2 day/14 days and seek to rectify and pursue any overstayers as some have stayed for more than 2 weeks, some more than 3 weeks.  Neil at the cafe said he's not from CRT, only manages the fee collection and clarified the rules, but again, he isn't from CRT and the CRT officer may also be wrong.   Therefore, given there is little place to Moore up and move to, many of us may have leave the area to avoid overstaying."

[Hudds Lad]

This is why we can’t have nice things on the canals, always some that take the mick and ruin it for everyone  

 

Was always surprised the electric wasn't tied to the ticket with some sort of token or key, so you had to pay to get access.

No doubt get farmed out to some sort of parking enforcement type company.

[ditchcrawler]

I havent moored there since they introduced payment, I always moor near the lift bridge

Edited January 3, 2023 by ditchcrawler

[pearley]

Is it still only £6? Hardly keeping up with inflation.

[Arthur Marshall]

1 minute ago, pearley said:

Is it still only £6? Hardly keeping up with inflation.

It started at a fiver, so has gone up 20% already! I think a tenner would be acceptable, but I have heard that a few electric boats have moored there to recharge, and that may have cost a bit (if true - I wouldn't have thought there were that many about yet). I suspect it's mostly down the the "free" electricty provided. There must still be a fair few of us who don't use it at all though. Might be more sensible just to turn the power off.

[Alan de Enfield]

5 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

Might be more sensible just to turn the power off.

 

Or adapt the bollards to 'cards'.

 

Our Marina has bollards that have card slots. You can put any amount of value (£100s if you wish) onto your dedicated card, when you moor up you put the card into the bollard and it 'dumps' all of the value onto the bollard, when you come to leave, you put your card back into the bollard and the card is 'reloaded' with all the unused value. So, no one can use your electric whilst you are away.

The  more electric you use the more you 'pay' (as is surely the right way), so a leccy boat charging overnight will pay for what he uses.

 

The card can be re-charged (topped up) ad infinitum.

 

It is very different to the C&RT card system (as used on the Trent and elsewhere) where everytime you put your card into the bollard it automatically deducts 1 unit (or £1 or whatever) from the credit just for the 'benefit' of plugging in.

[Hudds Lad]

7 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

…but I have heard that a few electric boats have moored there to recharge, and that may have cost a bit (if true - I wouldn't have thought there were that many about yet)…

Theres one there right now  I only know this as he has a live-ish webcam and watched him get water at Trevor yesterday then turn and head back to the bollards just outside town whilst i had me lunch.

 

https://youtube.com/@PinkHatMan if you’re interested, which you’re probably not.

[Arthur Marshall]

35 minutes ago, Hudds Lad said:

Theres one there right now  I only know this as he has a live-ish webcam and watched him get water at Trevor yesterday then turn and head back to the bollards just outside town whilst i had me lunch.

 

https://youtube.com/@PinkHatMan if you’re interested, which you’re probably not.

The implication from the post is that there have been a lot of boaters milking the system and overstaying, including the bloke who posted, who seems to resent having to move at all. I can remember many years ago the Llangollen was stuffed with ramshackle liveaboards and maybe the cycle's been repeated!

[Hudds Lad]

2 hours ago, Arthur Marshall said:

The implication from the post is that there have been a lot of boaters milking the system and overstaying, including the bloke who posted, who seems to resent having to move at all. I can remember many years ago the Llangollen was stuffed with ramshackle liveaboards and maybe the cycle's been repeated!

Certainly seem the World and his Vlog have headed there for the past winter or two.

Having only ever overnighted in the basin i can’t speak to overstayers, but the times we were there i have definitely witnessed boats arrive at dusk and plug in before nipping off early doors before the shop opens.

[Deep]

I think that Pinkhatman video must win the prize for the worst YouTube narrowboat video, unless of course you know otherwise.

[Alway Swilby]

1 hour ago, Deep said:

I think that Pinkhatman video must win the prize for the worst YouTube narrowboat video, unless of course you know otherwise.

All it is is a "View from the front of my boat" video. No commentry or editing and all filmed from a static camera at the bow. Looks like there isn't any attempt to "Vlog".

[Midnight]

On 04/01/2023 at 05:47, Hudds Lad said:

Certainly seem the World and his Vlog have headed there for the past winter or two.

Having only ever overnighted in the basin i can’t speak to overstayers, but the times we were there i have definitely witnessed boats arrive at dusk and plug in before nipping off early doors before the shop opens.

Bloke on Facebook saying how they stayed 3 weeks in the basin "We stayed 3 weeks there, as did many at £6 per day. Happy we did it when we did because it won't be £6 per day next year." 
I can't think why charges are going up can you? 
My thoughts are that the electric should be on a card reader, but even at £20 a night with electric included it's still better value than some marinas.

 

 

[Tonka]

Problem is, if you charge for electric a lot of the boaters will not pay and run their engines to re-charge their batteries and get hot water. The houses close to the basin will complain. This is why the electric was put in.

[Tony1]

As Tonka says, the electricity is kind of essential- it prevents lots of noise from gennies and engines, which I think would lead to noise complaints. The local residents are pretty close by up the hill. 

If people start running the louder type of gennies, especially in the evenings, I reckon the use of any gennies would very quickly be banned. 

It might not be worth the cost of installing meters and a card system, as the majority of boaters use a modest amount each day- although I'm sure most of them run their immersion heaters for an hour or two during the day. 

Perhaps the cost of the electricity could just be included in the mooring charge, so that it roughly covers the annual cost? That may have to change in a few years as electric boat numbers start to increase.

My impression was that there were a few folks who had been there a while, and were planning on staying a while longer, and I don't think there is much enforcement in late December and january, so I would guess a few were not paying the daily charge.

It wouldn't take much to do some enforcement. Just a quick stroll around every afternoon, and either knock, email, or place a sticker on any boats that are not on the visiting 'register', asking them to call the office and arrange payment.

Personally I think £20 a night is a bit steep, but it would certainly reduce boat numbers a bit, and the moorings near the lift bridge would be permanently full.

 

Edited January 7, 2023 by Tony1

[ditchcrawler]

Is there any official word they plan to charge £20 or just what someone said to someone else who he may have considered a piss taker?

[TheBiscuits]

58 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

Perhaps the cost of the electricity could just be included in the mooring charge, so that it roughly covers the annual cost?

 

That could well be where the £20 figure comes from!  Business electricity rates have gone stupid recently.

 

Spotted elsewhere this week:

[Momac]

On 04/01/2023 at 10:54, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Or adapt the bollards to 'cards'.

 

We have a different system where you have an account  and you can connect to any  shore power out let in the marina using a card or a phone app.

C&RT could have the same system that would work nationally. But its a big investment and probably will never happen.

[StephenA]

14 minutes ago, MartynG said:

We have a different system where you have an account  and you can connect to any  shore power out let in the marina using a card or a phone app.

C&RT could have the same system that would work nationally. But its a big investment and probably will never happen.

 

CRT already use MeterMacs but that would mean all boaters, including hire boaters, to have an account.

[Lady M]

Not all boaters, only those who need to 'plug in' to avoid engine running.

[Naughty Cal]

18 minutes ago, StephenA said:

 

CRT already use MeterMacs but that would mean all boaters, including hire boaters, to have an account.

We asked CRT for years if we could set up an account after they changed the bollards on the Witham and Trent to the MeterMac system. 

 

They said no. Only moorers on CRT moorings could have them. So they changed the bollards on the visitors moorings with prepaid cards that all could buy to a system where only CRT moorers could use them.

 

Wasn't really an issue for us as we didn't need electric. But some boaters who did were not happy.

[Jon57]

2 hours ago, ditchcrawler said:

Is there any official word they plan to charge £20 or just what someone said to someone else who he may have considered a piss taker?

Probably. I’ll start one. Liverpool to be next £30 a night.😱😱

[Alan de Enfield]

4 minutes ago, Jon57 said:

Probably. I’ll start one. Liverpool to be next £30 a night.😱😱

 

We regulary expect to pay £30+ per night at coastal marinas, but you do get a lot for your money.

At Plymouth it is £45 per night but you get unlimited electric, water tap at your mooring, free washing machine usage and a dedicated bathroom (shower, bath, toilet and basin) for your sole use. On site chandlery, Pub and restaurant.

[Momac]

14 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

We asked CRT for years if we could set up an account after they changed the bollards on the Witham and Trent to the MeterMac system. 

 

They said no. Only moorers on CRT moorings could have them.

Is that the system they have at West Stockwith ?

I asked  about connecting but was refused for the same reason. It's not like we  expected the energy for free and there are re more than ample numbers of bollards.

 

As far as I know the bollards at Cromwell and Newark remain the old card payment type.  

 

[jam]

On 04/01/2023 at 13:47, Hudds Lad said:

Having only ever overnighted in the basin i can’t speak to overstayers, but the times we were there i have definitely witnessed boats arrive at dusk and plug in before nipping off early doors before the shop opens.

They must be nipping off very early. Apparently the guy at the office and his staff start around 6am in peak season with the first job to visit the moorings.

[Midnight]

1 hour ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

We regulary expect to pay £30+ per night at coastal marinas, but you do get a lot for your money.

At Plymouth it is £45 per night but you get unlimited electric, water tap at your mooring, free washing machine usage and a dedicated bathroom (shower, bath, toilet and basin) for your sole use. On site chandlery, Pub and restaurant.

We paid £26 a night with no electric last year on the Great Ouse so £20 a night including electric is good value and would deter the piss-takers who seem to be part of the problem here. It's a common trend with some CCer's who after awhile don't want to CC.