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Best area to be based in while looking for Narrowboat


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20 hours ago, enigmatic said:

The hope when you make an offer subject to survey is that you don't need to look at any other boats!

 

I understand some private sellers will reject offers made subject to survey (and in this market, that'll even include boats that would get good survey reports!) but I'd assume most brokers want the extra revenue....

 

Like Tony I'd ask "what extra revenue?"

 

If I were a broker I'd far rather sell a boat in 24 hours to a buyer not requiring a survey. That way I get my commission immediately then I can get on with selling another boat tomorrow.

 

Far better than waiting six weeks for each of my boats under offer to get surveyed before I get paid. 

4 minutes ago, MartynG said:

And a national insurance number is required 

 

 

Good point. 

 

Do you need an address to have a NI number? 

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5 minutes ago, MtB said:

Do you need an address to have a NI number? 

You need the correct citizenship/visa or other right to work here, while an address may not be a formal requirement i imagine it will make dealing with the bureaucrats a lot less painful.

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39 minutes ago, MartynG said:

Yes but it shows the government are  serious about prosecuting offenders.

........

Errrr, how do you work that out, it is just a list of penalties, it doesn't give any information about how strictly/seriously the rules are enforced or the penalties applied.

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1 hour ago, Barneyp said:

Getting an "official" residential mooring that you can actually use for banks etc could be difficult and expensive. I would try to make arrangements with a freind or family member to use their address. 

 Yes they’re expensive but not impossible to find. Most CC’ers that are shuffling along a small stretch and not really CCing would jump at the chance of having one. The fact is they can’t afford one rather then they don’t want one. Boating is not cheap anymore especially if you want a Marina mooring, job and a quality of life on the water. If you haven’t got a good monthly income or decent savings, CCing boat life can be crap.

Edited by PD1964
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6 minutes ago, PD1964 said:

 Yes they’re expensive but not impossible to find. Most CC’ers that are shuffling along a small stretch and not really CCing would jump at the chance of having one. The fact is they can’t afford one rather then they don’t want one. Boating is not cheap anymore especially if you want a Marina mooring, job and a quality of life on the water. If you haven’t got a good monthly income or decent savings, CCing boat life can be crap.

 

When we had a mooring with BWML (now Aquavista) there was very little difference in price between a leisure mooring and a 'proper' (legal) residential mooring. The cost difference was pretty much just their portion (%) of the composite marina council tax (which worked out to be considerable lower than the A-Band CT) The only criteria is that they had to change mooring position with the boat next to them twice a year.

In addition, residential moorers got free pump-outs and a number of 'free' washing machine tokens, a shed, and a guaranteed parking space, as well as a mailbox & the use of the address for mail, car registrations etc etc.

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3 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

When we had a mooring with BWML (now Aquavista) there was very little difference in price between a leisure mooring and a 'proper' (legal) residential mooring. The cost difference was pretty much just their portion (%) of the composite marina council tax (which worked out to be considerable lower than the A-Band CT) The only criteria is that they had to change mooring position with the boat next to them twice a year.

In addition, residential moorers got free pump-outs and a number of 'free' washing machine tokens, a shed, and a guaranteed parking space, as well as a mailbox & the use of the address for mail, car registrations etc etc.

Will all depend on the OP’s finance’s, as I said I would get a residential mooring first and get established if they need to work before going CCing, rather then the other way around.

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2 minutes ago, PD1964 said:

Will all depend on the OP’s finance’s, as I said I would get a residential mooring first and get established if they need to work before going CCing, rather then the other way around.

 

I agree. 

Get sorted, get your ID (NI) numbers sorted out, make sure the boat is capable and reliable, find your part time job, register with the NHS / Doctor etc etc, then, cut the umbilical and float off into the sunset

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25 minutes ago, Barneyp said:

Errrr, how do you work that out, it is just a list of penalties, it doesn't give any information about how strictly/seriously the rules are enforced or the penalties applied.

I am fairly sure, if caught by the police for driving without insurance , you are not simply waved on your way.

Do you think its okay to drive without insurance?

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2 hours ago, MartynG said:

I am fairly sure, if caught by the police for driving without insurance , you are not simply waved on your way.

Do you think its okay to drive without insurance?

No, and I didn't say or imply that.

 

The document you posted lists the penalties for using false information to obtain car insurance.

 

The police will want to know that the car is covered by an insurance policy, this is often done by ANPR cameras, if they take the time to stop the car they will check the person driving is covered by the policy. And I think they would and should prosecute if insurance wasn't in place.

 

When the police check a car or driver is insured they are unlikely to investigate if the policy was obtained by fraud, once issued the third party element (the bit the law requires) is valid until it is expired or cancelled.

 

If the policy was obtained by supplying false information and the insurance company find out they will obviously cancel the policy, and may take action against the policy holder - probably refusing to deal with them again.

 

The point I was replying to was you saying that the documents you posted showed it was being taken seriously by the authorities. I was questioning that as the documents only show the penalties, they give no idea how many if any prosecutions there are for those offences. 

 

Having a stiff penalty for an offence doesn't mean it is being taken seriously, enforcing the law and applying the penalties would be taking it seriously.

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23 minutes ago, Barneyp said:

No, and I didn't say or imply that.

 

The document you posted lists the penalties for using false information to obtain car insurance.

 

The police will want to know that the car is covered by an insurance policy, this is often done by ANPR cameras, if they take the time to stop the car they will check the person driving is covered by the policy. And I think they would and should prosecute if insurance wasn't in place.

 

When the police check a car or driver is insured they are unlikely to investigate if the policy was obtained by fraud, once issued the third party element (the bit the law requires) is valid until it is expired or cancelled.

 

If the policy was obtained by supplying false information and the insurance company find out they will obviously cancel the policy, and may take action against the policy holder - probably refusing to deal with them again.

 

The point I was replying to was you saying that the documents you posted showed it was being taken seriously by the authorities. I was questioning that as the documents only show the penalties, they give no idea how many if any prosecutions there are for those offences. 

 

Having a stiff penalty for an offence doesn't mean it is being taken seriously, enforcing the law and applying the penalties would be taking it seriously.

What’s all this got to do with the OP?

Nothing really.

Everyone can advise the OP to use a relation, make address up, but if he wants work, credit rating, Doctor/Dentist and normality he’s best having a residential mooring and an address in his own name to start with. 

  

Edited by PD1964
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33 minutes ago, PD1964 said:

What’s all this got to do with the OP?

Nothing really.

Everyone can advise the OP to use a relation, make address up, but if he wants work, credit rating, Doctor/Dentist and normality he’s best having a residential mooring and an address in his own name to start with. 

  

Its got nothing to do with original poster or the content of their post. It is part of a conversation that has moved on.

The point about having a residential mooring to start with or using a relatives address is also not do to.with the original question asked, again it's a conversation that has moved on.

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7 minutes ago, Barneyp said:

Its got nothing to do with original poster or the content of their post. It is part of a conversation that has moved on.

The point about having a residential mooring to start with or using a relatives address is also not do to.with the original question asked, again it's a conversation that has moved on.

I take it you have no experience of living on a boat without a permanent address then?

 Often becomes a pain for the relative getting mail sent to them and for them to forward it on, especially if your a fair distance away.

  That’s why the OP would be better off starting with a residential mooring, instead of doing CCing then getting a mooring as he says.

  

  

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54 minutes ago, PD1964 said:

I take it you have no experience of living on a boat without a permanent address then?

 Often becomes a pain for the relative getting mail sent to them and for them to forward it on, especially if your a fair distance away.

  That’s why the OP would be better off starting with a residential mooring, instead of doing CCing then getting a mooring as he says.

  

  

You do realise that you quoted my post which was about car insurance, and not about permanent addresses or live aboard moorings.

 

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4 hours ago, MtB said:

Like Tony I'd ask "what extra revenue?"

 

If I were a broker I'd far rather sell a boat in 24 hours to a buyer not requiring a survey. That way I get my commission immediately then I can get on with selling another boat tomorrow.

Extra revenue from slipway/craneage fees and often for additional work/items the surveyor says are necessary or recommended 

 

If someone wants to pay a deposit (quite possibly for the full amount of your commission) and slipway fees into your account in ten minutes and subject to a survey which will likely generate additional paid work for you (at a premium if you're busy), I'm not sure waiting until tomorrow or maybe next weekend to see if someone wants to pay the deposit without the slipway fees or likely extras is worthwhile for the broker. It's not like brokerages have so many boats they're running out of space!

 

Anyway, I spoke to a good dozen brokers in summer 2020 when boats were selling really quickly, and not only did all of them expect to accommodate a survey if I wanted them but most of them said they'd "always recommend" buyers should find themselves a surveyor (including the one I actually bought my boat off, who had a busy dry dock rather than a slipway and actually owned the boat and so picked up the tab for the work instead of profiting from it!). Prices have gone up since then, but I'm not sure brokers have completely changed their process as well, especially not in ways which would tend to reduce the margins they make on boats at a time their brokerage is half empty.

 

And if I do use a broker when I come to sell my boat, I certainly wouldn't be interested in a broker that doesn't bother letting me know about offers today because someone else might make an offer, possibly for less, without a survey tomorrow ...

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38 minutes ago, enigmatic said:

Extra revenue from slipway/craneage fees and often for additional work/items the surveyor says are necessary or recommended 

 

If someone wants to pay a deposit (quite possibly for the full amount of your commission) and slipway fees into your account in ten minutes and subject to a survey which will likely generate additional paid work for you (at a premium if you're busy), I'm not sure waiting until tomorrow or maybe next weekend to see if someone wants to pay the deposit without the slipway fees or likely extras is worthwhile for the broker. It's not like brokerages have so many boats they're running out of space!

 

Anyway, I spoke to a good dozen brokers in summer 2020 when boats were selling really quickly, and not only did all of them expect to accommodate a survey if I wanted them but most of them said they'd "always recommend" buyers should find themselves a surveyor (including the one I actually bought my boat off, who had a busy dry dock rather than a slipway and actually owned the boat and so picked up the tab for the work instead of profiting from it!). Prices have gone up since then, but I'm not sure brokers have completely changed their process as well, especially not in ways which would tend to reduce the margins they make on boats at a time their brokerage is half empty.

 

And if I do use a broker when I come to sell my boat, I certainly wouldn't be interested in a broker that doesn't bother letting me know about offers today because someone else might make an offer, possibly for less, without a survey tomorrow ...

 

 

GFY!

 

(That stands for 'Good For You'... in case anyone was wondering :giggles: )

 

 

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1 hour ago, enigmatic said:

and actually owned the boat and so picked up the tab for the work instead of profiting from it!

If he actually owned the boat you bought, then as far as your purchase is concerned he isn't a broker.  You have bought from a business, and that gives you more rights as a consumer.

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Just now, David Mack said:

If he actually owned the boat you bought, then as far as your purchase is concerned he isn't a broker.  You have bought from a business, and that gives you more rights as a consumer.

I'm aware I had more legal rights as the brokerage firm was the legal owner, so (unlike normally) they could have had issues if they sold me a leaky sieve even if I hadn't surveyed it.

 

Doubt I'd have had much legal comeback for most of the things the surveyor picked up though (non BSS compliant wiring, seized regulators on cooker, swapping gearbox for one with a more suitable ratio) though. Presumably a cost of business they live with because they make a big enough margin on the trade-in

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3 hours ago, enigmatic said:

I'm aware I had more legal rights as the brokerage firm was the legal owner, so (unlike normally) they could have had issues if they sold me a leaky sieve even if I hadn't surveyed it.

 

 

 

I read your statement :

 

 .......buyers should find themselves a surveyor (including the one I actually bought my boat off, who had a busy dry dock rather than a slipway and actually owned the boat and so picked up the tab for the work instead of profiting from it!)

 

as meaning the boat belonged to the surveyor you used.

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20 hours ago, PD1964 said:

  I would get an official residential mooring first, as the permanent address thing could turn out a bigger issue then you think, especially when trying to get a job or any form of credit. Better to get established first than later. Then decide if you want to Continuous Cruise.
 Everything is getting harder to do on the Canals, as lots of people have had the same idea as yourselves and are realising it’s not as plane sailing as they thought. You want an easy transition into “living the dream” not a nightmare.

@PD1964 That's a valid point. I never considered setup time & the bureaucratic issues around a residential address. "Residential mooring first" is going on the list!

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On 01/01/2023 at 10:53, peterboat said:

Not true we go to pubs with our campervan park for the night for free, there's a book for it and an app I believe?

 

Briststops and SearchforSites.

 

However:

A lot of pubs are charging now, or expect you to eat which can be a quick way to spend £50 or more for a 'free' pitch.

Very few pubs have water or waste disposal. 

Very few pubs have EHU. 

 

So true enough for the OP to have to be aware given his travels will be dictated by where the boats are rather than heading for cheap stopovers. 

 

 

 

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32 minutes ago, twbm said:

 

Briststops and SearchforSites.

 

However:

A lot of pubs are charging now, or expect you to eat which can be a quick way to spend £50 or more for a 'free' pitch.

Very few pubs have water or waste disposal. 

Very few pubs have EHU. 

 

So true enough for the OP to have to be aware given his travels will be dictated by where the boats are rather than heading for cheap stopovers. 

 

 

 

We have used them a few times, we did buy food and drinks but would have done that anyway, however in one the owner told us to park up and that was it, he locked up and disappeared nothing required. 

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