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Boat dwellers to be able to claim the £400 energy allowance.


Alway Swilby

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Just now, doratheexplorer said:

Do you have a link?

 

AINA Figures

 

AINA is the industry body in Great Britain for those authorities with statutory or other legal responsibility for the management and operation of navigable inland waterways for navigation and wider uses. Between them, AINA members have responsibility for some 5,658 km of navigable inland waterways.

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8 hours ago, doratheexplorer said:

But would you agree that impoverished areas with low incomes would end up with underfunded councils?

If someone is genuinely broke, they don't pay council tax.  They recieve council tax benefit.

They still do, as council tax benefit does not cover the full amount, how much they are expected to pay depends on the council. In Fenland it is 23% of the bill.

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It sounds like the EA and the Broads Authority together must have more boats than C&RT?

Don't hear much about them on this forum but some people like it that way.

 

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54 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

You understand the financial liability, when you take on a mooring. I understand the setup, when I'm no longer a moorer. I do not think your licence and paid-for mooring give you any right to challenge the arrangement, established after the need for a home mooring was abolished. 

 

You pay for the mooring you have. Considering the costs you're trying to apply to CC'ers, I think it would be fair that they apply to you, and everyone that uses the canal, if it is your wish to be fair. Your own mooring wouldn't count for anything, when you're out and about. 

 

Do you pay anything more than the licence fee? 

 

 

I'm not trying to apply anything, just trying to see it from CRT point of view. I pay rent for a non-CRT mooring to the landowner, and in addition I pay about £800 mooring fee to CRT, who provide nothing but the water and the (offside) bank. If you have a CRT online mooring, this is of course factored in to your mooring charge, but this is the value CRT put on anyone who moors a 40 foot boat anywhere online, on my bit of canal.

It's this added value that I suspect they want CCers to pay, because the only people who currently pay this are those with home moorings. CRT value the facility to moor somewhere on this canal where they provide no facilities, for a 40ft boat, at £800 a year, and now they want CCers to pay it too. It's a change in their argument for the charge, but it's a valid point of view, I think.

Licence is on top, obviously.

  • Greenie 1
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3 hours ago, IanD said:

So please explain -- you've done it, exactly how is it "skewed"?

 

Unless by "the same place" you mean "an overall increase in license fees" -- which is not skewing or even in the consultation, because CART have said this is going to happen anyway, because it has to... 😞

Do the  consultation Ian then you will understand. Dave the marina owner did his and came to the same conclusion as all of us down here. Its skewed to give the results they want, he has had a marina with BW and CRT for possibly longer than you have been on this earth and knows how they do business.

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2 minutes ago, MartynG said:

It sounds like the EA and the Broads Authority together must have more boats than C&RT?

Don't hear much about them on this forum but some people like it that way.

 

Poole Harbour in Dorset has round 10000 boats moored within the harbour limits, that includles swing , bankside and (11 sites) marina moorings. It is the largest natural harbour in the world since Sydney harbour reclaimed so much land from its harbour.

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1 minute ago, nbfiresprite said:

Poole Harbour in Dorset has round 10000 boats moored within the harbour limits, that includles swing , bankside and (11 sites) marina moorings. It is the largest natural harbour in the world since Sydney harbour reclaimed so much land from its harbour.

10 thousand ?

Just now, Arthur Marshall said:

The pursuit of happiness is supposedly a human right. No-one guarantees you'll catch it.

I caught it many yars ago and can't get rid of it for some unknown reason. 

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Just had a look at the online claim form for the £200 alternative fuel payment, there is a catch, as your required to upload at least £200 of invoices with your name and address on. As most just buy one or two bags at a time and don't get a invoice when they buy coal or gas. They not get a rebate.

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17 minutes ago, MartynG said:

It sounds like the EA and the Broads Authority together must have more boats than C&RT?

Don't hear much about them on this forum but some people like it that way.

 

 

Broads authority have ~13,000 boats registered.

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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3 minutes ago, magnetman said:

 

I caught it many years ago and can't get rid of it for some unknown reason. 

Me too. I found not caring about money helped. If I've got it, nice. If I haven't I go without. If I get priced off the cut,  I've had thirty terrific years. Life's too short too care about money, rules and anything except music and people. Cats can be ok though. Not sure about dogs.

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7 minutes ago, nbfiresprite said:

Poole Harbour in Dorset has round 10000 boats moored within the harbour limits, that includles swing , bankside and (11 sites) marina moorings. It is the largest natural harbour in the world since Sydney harbour reclaimed so much land from its harbour.

Does Poole Harbour count as ''inland  waterways''?

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4 minutes ago, nbfiresprite said:

Just had a look at the online claim form for the £200 alternative fuel payment, there is a catch, as your required to upload at least £200 of invoices with your name and address on. As most just buy one or two bags at a time and don't get a invoice when they buy coal or gas. They not get a rebate.

 

Not checked any of these claim forms myself but my coal is bought online via road transport so there were receipts. The coal boats tend to give a receipt if asked. 

 

 

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3 hours ago, Higgs said:

 

 

Fine. I've had my boat 20 years, the licence fee has doubled in 20 years. Tell me it will double in twenty years, or 10 - no problem. 

 

My fuel has gone up at a similar rate to everyone's. Coal, last year - £12.50. this year, as much as £23.00, for the same. Not normal, for a reason, I know. So, normal is something most people can cope with, abnormal isn't.

 

 

 

 

How many bags per year do you burn? Diesel and gas? Yearly figures for all fuels would offer a true/fair comparison.

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39 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

I'm not trying to apply anything, just trying to see it from CRT point of view. I pay rent for a non-CRT mooring to the landowner, and in addition I pay about £800 mooring fee to CRT, who provide nothing but the water and the (offside) bank. If you have a CRT online mooring, this is of course factored in to your mooring charge, but this is the value CRT put on anyone who moors a 40 foot boat anywhere online, on my bit of canal.

It's this added value that I suspect they want CCers to pay, because the only people who currently pay this are those with home moorings. CRT value the facility to moor somewhere on this canal where they provide no facilities, for a 40ft boat, at £800 a year, and now they want CCers to pay it too. It's a change in their argument for the charge, but it's a valid point of view, I think.

Licence is on top, obviously.

 

The suggestion is, that CC'ers pay for 365 days a year mooring? That's a moveable 'home' mooring. They just want to bend the law. Like they do in marinas. You would be happy to comply with this suggestion that treats any mooring as extra, along the towpath?

 

 

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It does make an awful lot of sense to charge per day for mooring especially on a system which apparently has a major funding problem.

 

Not needing to pay for a mooring is basically a loophole. These are always subject to being closed so anyone taking advantage of them should just be glad while it is an option and dealt with it if things change. 

 

Planning your life around loopholes is risky. 

 

 

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1 minute ago, Paul C said:

How many bags per year do you burn? Diesel and gas? Yearly figures for all fuels would offer a true/fair comparison.

 

I pay for what I need to pay for. I try to offset some of the rise, by collecting wood. I use about 50/50, wood/coal. I would increase the use of wood, with any rises in price. I have spent £585 on coal, £250 on diesel, and about £160 on gas. 6 months-ish.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

I pay for what I need to pay for. I try to offset some of the rise, by collecting wood. I use about 50/50, wood/coal. I would increase the use of wood, with any rises in price. I have spent £585 on coal, £250 on diesel, and about £160 on gas. 6 months-ish.

 

 

Thanks

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11 minutes ago, magnetman said:

It does make an awful lot of sense to charge per day for mooring especially on a system which apparently has a major funding problem.

 

Not needing to pay for a mooring is basically a loophole. These are always subject to being closed so anyone taking advantage of them should just be glad while it is an option and dealt with it if things change. 

 

Planning your life around loopholes is risky. 

 

 

 

Home moorings used to be the norm, was required. Now it is not the norm. Charging for a mooring space, when out navigating the waterway, has not been a norm. Charging people for a licence they don't use, don't require, is the norm. CRT use their own loopholes to leach money.

 

 

Edited by Higgs
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13 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

The suggestion is, that CC'ers pay for 365 days a year mooring? That's a moveable 'home' mooring. They just want to bend the law. Like they do in marinas. You would be happy to comply with this suggestion that treats any mooring as extra, along the towpath?

 

 


 

It’s a mooring but not a home mooring, which has a distinct difference in that you can leave the boat there for an extended period of time.

1 minute ago, Higgs said:

 

Home moorings used to be the norm. Now it is not the norm. Charging for a mooring space, when out navigating the waterway, has not been a norm. Charging people for a licence they don't use, don't require, is the norm. CRT use their own loopholes to leach money.

 

 


It’s always been normal to continue to pay for a home mooring if away for short periods of time.

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5 minutes ago, Paul C said:


 

It’s a mooring but not a home mooring, which has a distinct difference in that you can leave the boat there for an extended period of time.

 

The implication would be, CC'ers would need a 365 day mooring, all be it, a long mooring. But I can't see why it would exclude home moorers paying, when they're out cruising. The principle is, the use of the towpath.

 

 

Edited by Higgs
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People declaring no home mooring would not have a mooring. All they would be doing is paying to use the towpath for mooring as a service. 

 

Casual mooring will always be different to long term contract mooring. 

 

Whether the CRT would want to charge other waterway users for this is presumably up to the board. 

 

Not sure where towpath long term moorings would stand on this but the status of these has always been a bit of a grey area especially when used for residential purposes. 

 

Edited by magnetman
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3 minutes ago, magnetman said:

People declaring no home mooring would not have a mooring. All they would be doing is paying to use the towpath for mooring a service. 

 

Whether the CRT would want to charge other waterway users for this is presumably up to the board. 

 

Not sure where towpath long term moorings would stand on this but the status of these has always been a bit of a grey area especially when used for residential purposes. 

 

 

If people are on the cut, they're using the towpath, regardless of whether they have 'home mooring'. 

 

 

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