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Boat dwellers to be able to claim the £400 energy allowance.


Alway Swilby

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3 minutes ago, Ronaldo47 said:

My recollection is that 27MHz CBs were not legal for use  in the UK because that band was reserved for other services such as radio controlled model aircraft and boats.

 

It was the AM radios that were illegal, but as the rest of the world used AM CB radios that was what was available.

Another problem was the the 4th harmonic interferred with the emergency service repeater stations.

 

But I spent most of the time on Sideband.

 

When they legalised the 27MHs CBs they put them onto FM

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6 hours ago, magnetman said:

Interestingly London VTS always use the term "Roger" to confirm. It is not official language for VHF use but the most professional of the bunch use it all the time..

Um, it is official. Meaning is "received ".  Derived from Morse procedure, when letter "R" used.

Defined in International Telecommunications Union Recommendation M1172, as well as International Code of Signals 1969

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That is interesting as when I did my marine VHF course we were told that it was not the correct terminology. It is well used but was described by the trainer as a slang term. 

I did say Roger That to him but he seemed unimpressed. 

 

 

Edited by magnetman
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I think it is related to the fact that Roger is not the correct word for R in the phonetic alphabet. 

 

Interesting to see the Wikipedia arrrticle about it. 

 

Including this 

 

"The term originates from the practice of telegraphers sending an "R" to stand for "received" after successfully getting a message. This was extended into spoken radio during World War II, with the "R" changed to the spelling alphabet equivalent word "Roger".[8][9][10] The modern NATO spelling alphabet uses the word "Romeo" for "R" instead of "Roger", and "Romeo" is sometimes used for the same purpose as "Roger", mainly in Australian maritime operations.[citation needed]

For commercial maritime VHF, "Roger" is discouraged."

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11 hours ago, Ronaldo47 said:

Demonstrating the truth of Dickens' character's observation that "the law is an ass", while it was illegal to use them,  it was not illegal to sell them,  so they were freely available. 

Bit like electric scooters then

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Oh great. Boats on a continuous crossing licence are specifically excluded. I wonder whether that's the end or there might just be another route for us? I presume that's overly optimistic.

 

https://www.gov.uk/apply-energy-bill-support-if-not-automatic

 

image.jpeg.136f6b86474331bb06765da21d78f80c.jpeg

 

Maybe the Alternative Fuel Payment will be different...

Edited by Ewan123
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At least NBTA and CCers now have the clarity they were seeking.

 

Unfortunately, its a bit different than what they promised back on 20th Dec, but at least the answer is now there in black and white

 

"Both the NBTA and Friends, Families and Travellers (FFT) have had intensive discussions with the Department of Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy (BEIS) to ensure that all off-grid households, including itinerant boat, caravan and vehicle dwellers without a fixed address, will be included."

 

https://www.bargee-traveller.org.uk/energy-bills-support-for-off-grid-households-to-go-live-in-january-2023/

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Paul C said:

At least NBTA and CCers now have the clarity they were seeking.

 

Unfortunately, its a bit different than what they promised back on 20th Dec, but at least the answer is now there in black and white

 

"Both the NBTA and Friends, Families and Travellers (FFT) have had intensive discussions with the Department of Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy (BEIS) to ensure that all off-grid households, including itinerant boat, caravan and vehicle dwellers without a fixed address, will be included."

 

https://www.bargee-traveller.org.uk/energy-bills-support-for-off-grid-households-to-go-live-in-january-2023/

 

 

 

 

And yet it doesn't exclude Itinerant travelers who are not on caravan sites / parks.

It would look as if the 'Travellers' who illegally just camp out in Farmers fields, School playing fields, Pub car parks etc  for a few days until evicted and then move on will be able to claim.

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3 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

 

And yet it doesn't exclude Itinerant travelers who are not on caravan sites / parks.

It would look as if the 'Travellers' who illegally just camp out in Farmers fields, School playing fields, Pub car parks etc  for a few days until evicted and then move on will be able to claim.

 

Maybe if they pressed for clarity in the same manner NBTA did, they would be specifically excluded too.

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14 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

 

And yet it doesn't exclude Itinerant travelers who are not on caravan sites / parks.

It would look as if the 'Travellers' who illegally just camp out in Farmers fields, School playing fields, Pub car parks etc  for a few days until evicted and then move on will be able to claim.

Yes it does. That's a "non-permanent caravan or mobile home site".

 

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7 minutes ago, nbfiresprite said:

This leaves the Anglian Revenues Partnership with a problem. If they claim my mooring is not residential, this would mean they will have to refund to me more than £15000 for charging council tax on a non-residential mooring since 2006.

 

Good luck getting the refund.

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3 minutes ago, Paul C said:

 

Good luck getting the refund.

I would think they would have no choice but to refund me. If they send me a letter stating that I cannot have the £400 energy rebate because they have classed the mooring as non-residential. This letter would contradict all the letters sent by them before on the subject on the mooring being classed as residential for council tax. There cannot have both ways, its either zoned for council tax or not, that is what the bench will tell them.  

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17 minutes ago, nbfiresprite said:

 

I would think they would have no choice but to refund me. If they send me a letter stating that I cannot have the £400 energy rebate because they have classed the mooring as non-residential. This letter would contradict all the letters sent by them before on the subject on the mooring being classed as residential for council tax. There cannot have both ways, its either zoned for council tax or not, that is what the bench will tell them.  

ok let us know how you get on.

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1 hour ago, Alan de Enfield said:

And yet it doesn't exclude Itinerant travelers who are not on caravan sites / parks.

It would look as if the 'Travellers' who illegally just camp out in Farmers fields, School playing fields, Pub car parks etc  for a few days until evicted and then move on will be able to claim.

 

Think the listed exclusions are just the groups of people that ask them about it the most (and will have the paperwork to prove they live there)

 

They've put "on a permanent Gypsy or Traveller site" on the list of people who are included...

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54 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

Yes it does. That's a "non-permanent caravan or mobile home site".

 

 

I guess it depends on how you interpret the statement - the term specifically states 'caravan site' - how can a pub car park be a "non permanent caravan site" to be a caravan site the premises has to be inspected and licenced by the Local Authority if it is not then it is not a caravan site.

 

As detailed in the Caravan Sites Act 1968 (We had to go thru 'hoops' to get registered as a non residential caravan site)

 

Had the definition said something like "parking a caravan on unlicenced land and regularly moving" I'd agree.

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1 hour ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

I guess it depends on how you interpret the statement - the term specifically states 'caravan site' - how can a pub car park be a "non permanent caravan site" to be a caravan site the premises has to be inspected and licenced by the Local Authority if it is not then it is not a caravan site.

 

As detailed in the Caravan Sites Act 1968 (We had to go thru 'hoops' to get registered as a non residential caravan site)

 

Had the definition said something like "parking a caravan on unlicenced land and regularly moving" I'd agree.

I think they'll define it just a site or place. They certainly won't pay.

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It's as I said on p26: eligibility is tied to a residential address, as that is the only way a Local Authority can control it.

 

Anyone with a CC, i.e. non-home mooring, licence has to be excluded as they don't have an address, and there would be no way of stopping them from claiming in multiple LAs every few days.  They are in the same position as Travellers using 'transit' (i.e. non-permanent) sites.  Similarly, anyone with a non-residential home mooring (or park home) will be excluded, as the assumption will be that they are claiming for their residential address (or received the automatic rebate) and share their time between those locations.

 

If you have a residential mooring, paying council tax, you should be eligible.

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19 minutes ago, Cheese said:

It's as I said on p26: eligibility is tied to a residential address, as that is the only way a Local Authority can control it.

 

I'm fascinated to find out how I might get the grant in my hovel. I'm bemused as to how anyone in authority will know I have oil heating.

 

I buy a tankful of oil two or three times a year from whichever supplier is cheapest on the day, so how on earth will anyone handing out the grants know I do this, even though I have the residential address you mention. 

 

 

 

 

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I think it will be that you make a claim to your Local Authority.  They check that you pay Council Tax, and that your property is not connected to mains electricity/ gas (so you didn't get the automatic rebate).  They pay you, and record that a payment has been made for that address - so it isn't paid twice.

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48 minutes ago, Cheese said:

It's as I said on p26: eligibility is tied to a residential address, as that is the only way a Local Authority can control it.

 

Anyone with a CC, i.e. non-home mooring, licence has to be excluded as they don't have an address, and there would be no way of stopping them from claiming in multiple LAs every few days.  They are in the same position as Travellers using 'transit' (i.e. non-permanent) sites.  Similarly, anyone with a non-residential home mooring (or park home) will be excluded, as the assumption will be that they are claiming for their residential address (or received the automatic rebate) and share their time between those locations.

 

If you have a residential mooring, paying council tax, you should be eligible.

 

That's where it will prove interesting in my case as it will with others in my marina, as planning list my mooring as non-residential, yet Council tax is charged on it.

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10 minutes ago, Cheese said:

I think it will be that you make a claim to your Local Authority.  They check that you pay Council Tax, and that your property is not connected to mains electricity/ gas (so you didn't get the automatic rebate).  They pay you, and record that a payment has been made for that address - so it isn't paid twice.

 

 

According to the emails received from my oil suppliers I don't need to claim.

 

The government checks every house / dwelling / Hovel that has an electricty account and checks to see if that post code is within an area where mains gas is available. If it is not available then you automaticcaly get the grant.

 

You only need make an application if you are one of the 'non-standard' users (residential caravan, or boat on a residential site/mooring, or someone who has neither 'mains electricity or mains gas')

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