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Digging your own canal arm


harrybsmith

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Before you ask, yes I believe I am certifiable... 

 

My parents bought a scrappy bit of land that borders the route of a former canal (that's currently under restoration) a few years ago. It was really cheap, and their idea was to look to develop it into housing. It's become clear that (because of local plan revisions) there isn't going to be the possibility to get planning permission for housing on it any time soon as it would require a change of use (it was a play area, play area has moved somewhere better). 

 

I'm wondering if I can dig my own canal arm on it (to the canal that is not yet adopted by CRT nor is likely to be in the next 10 years), stick a boat on it and use it as a leisure mooring? 

 

At what point does a "small pond" become a canal, what factors may I have missed in doing this, any thoughts? 

 

 

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Maybe, talk to the Restoration Society about whether you can connect up eventually. Even volunteer some time with them.

No idea whether you need change of use from amenity play area to private pond, boat play area. Perhaps enhancing the biodiversity with a water bird  sanctuary. Twithers paradise  with boat viewing platform.

 

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Unless your parents bought a very long strip of land I don't see how a digging a trench which then fills with water can be termed 'canal'. However the creation of a pond by machinery is considered an engineering operation under the Town and Country Planning Act 1990 (as amended) which may require planning permission.

It may also depend upon whether or not there are any protections given to the 'former canal', but I can't see that CRT can have any say in the matter.

 

Tam

Edited by Tam & Di
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Restored or not the canal you want to connect to will have an owner who you will need to talk to, this will not necessarily be the restoration society. There is also a good chance that you will need planning permission.

Edited by Tim Lewis
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2 minutes ago, Tam & Di said:

Unless your parents bought a very long strip of land I don't see how a digging a trench which then fills with water can be termed 'canal'. However the creation of a pond by machinery is considered an engineering operation under the Town and Country Planning Act 1990 (as amended) which may require planning permission.

 

Tam

Dig it by hand and no planning permission required? Really?

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There are no doubt numerous factors to consider.

An excavation will not necessary fill up with water naturally .  For example a puddle clay  or other liner may be required .

Will the excavation be a suitable distance from neighbouring property?

What would be the plan for the excavated material ? Is it contaminated ? 

What other environmental impacts need to be considered?

 

 

 

 

 

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25 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Newts.

Most local planning departments are staffed entirely by large newts now. They were cheaper to hire than humans and if they wear masks and hide their tails, they are nearly indistinguishable from regular people. Hence the concern they have over their habitats.

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36 minutes ago, Tim Lewis said:

Restored or not the canal you want to connect to will have an owner who you will need to talk to, this will not necessarily be the restoration society. There is also a good chance that you will need planning permission.

I can guarantee that it will need planning permission.  The OP can DM me if he wants more advice on this.  Alternatively theirs a very knowledgable planner at his mooring (Nicki/Odana).

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My father in law owned a fair old length of a canal in surrey including 3 bridges.

It was being restored right near him.

We used to talk about restoration, he joined the society, he granted access.

We dreamed of mooring on his land. ( 1990)

He died in 2007. Its still derelict.

Hmrc ended up with the estate.

Theres an industrial park on the farm.

Building canals was fast restoring them not so

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6 hours ago, Dave_P said:

I can guarantee that it will need planning permission.  The OP can DM me if he wants more advice on this.  Alternatively theirs a very knowledgable planner at his mooring (Nicki/Odana).

 

First port of call was to text Nicki about it... (we're neighbours)

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8 hours ago, Peanut said:

Maybe, talk to the Restoration Society about whether you can connect up eventually. Even volunteer some time with them.

No idea whether you need change of use from amenity play area to private pond, boat play area. Perhaps enhancing the biodiversity with a water bird  sanctuary. Twithers paradise  with boat viewing platform.

 

 

Definitely will be talking to them, bit of a change in life circumstances means I should have more time to be able to volunteer with them too

 

7 hours ago, Tam & Di said:

Unless your parents bought a very long strip of land I don't see how a digging a trench which then fills with water can be termed 'canal'. However the creation of a pond by machinery is considered an engineering operation under the Town and Country Planning Act 1990 (as amended) which may require planning permission.

It may also depend upon whether or not there are any protections given to the 'former canal', but I can't see that CRT can have any say in the matter.

 

Tam

 

I'm not sure there are protections on the former canal, nor would I actually need to breach through to it initially anyway 

 

7 hours ago, MartynG said:

There are no doubt numerous factors to consider.

An excavation will not necessary fill up with water naturally .  For example a puddle clay  or other liner may be required .

Will the excavation be a suitable distance from neighbouring property?

What would be the plan for the excavated material ? Is it contaminated ? 

What other environmental impacts need to be considered?

 

 

 

 

 

 

All of this is exactly the type of stuff I was after, thanks, this is all stuff I can mull over as I definitely don't have immediate answers 

 

Thanks all for your replies, if anything happens I'll make sure I update you...

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Main thing to be aware of is that if it shares water with the canal (when the canal exists again), the navigation authority will probably want to charge you for it, whether it's the CRT or not. Charges for water use, charges for access, marina fees if boats are permanently moored there even if there's just one boat and it's the landowners'.

 

Being there first and being involved with the restoration project might, of course, be an opportunity to join the many mostly historic arms and wharves with exceptions grandfathered in...

 

 

On 15/12/2022 at 14:09, Tracy D'arth said:

Dig it by hand and no planning permission required? Really?

I guess you might also need it if you need a team of navvies to dig it :D 

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Have you thought about making it at first as a fishing pool, stock it with fish and then charge fisherman to use the facility. When, and if, the canal gets built other opportunities might become available. As for waterway buildings you might get permission for a HMO where the local authority will assist with funds and then when the canal gets built these buildings could have a more valuable and another purpose.

 

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2 hours ago, Heartland said:

Have you thought about making it at first as a fishing pool, stock it with fish and then charge fisherman to use the facility. When, and if, the canal gets built other opportunities might become available. As for waterway buildings you might get permission for a HMO where the local authority will assist with funds and then when the canal gets built these buildings could have a more valuable and another purpose.

 

https://www.savills.co.uk/blog/article/248260/rural-property/key-considerations-for-establishing-a-recreational-fishery.aspx

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2 hours ago, ditchcrawler said:

 

Good link, thanks.

 

"The movement of earth (or engineering works) to form the essential ponds and lakes will constitute development"

 

Doesn't specify it has to be by use of machinery to count as development. Or maybe the author assumes all "movement of earth" would be by machine.

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