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MAIB publish report into 'tragic and avoidable' Haverfordwest paddleboard deaths


booke23

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I've just finished reading this report.

 

To summarise, this was a 'guided' paddleboard tour carried out by what appeared to the inexperienced participants as a professional paddle board tour outfit, but was in fact not.

 

The tour leaders took the group over the weir where upon they all fell into the water and some became trapped against the weir wall due to hydraulic forces whereupon four drowned, including one of the tour leaders who was attempting to effect a rescue. 

 

The local Kayak club regularly used the area and their guidance on the weir was 'At high water levels the town weir becomes extremely dangerous with high potential for loss of life. The right hand side can be exceptionally dangerous' And that it should be portaged....there are steps just before the weir to easily do this. The tour leaders were not aware of this guidance from the Haverfordwest Kayak club. In any case I'm not sure a SUP is a suitable craft to take over a weir in any circumstances. 

 

It's always terrible reading these sorts of report, but I find this one particularly tragic and frustrating.  

Edited by booke23
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There was a short piece on this on the BBC lunch time news. To be honest your summary above was far more informative.  Finished with the usual call for 'more regulation' .... and the news that someone might be charged with negligence.

 

Agree with you sad and tragic. 

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It could be a Darwin thing. Surely people can see that going out on a paddle board on anything other than a calm and quiet waterway in nice weather is a risky activity. You are standing up. I know one can sit down but generally its a standing up thing. Clue is in the name. If you come off it you are in the water. You don't want to be in the water at the best of times but certainly not in October.

 

Unless you have really good core strength and balance (skateboarder etc) you will probably have difficulties with this activity. Stick with nice warm weather so when you fall in you don't die. Even in nice warm weather people still get into serious difficulties. The cold shock is quite hard on people who are not used to it.

 

Maybe a bit simplistic but people really do need to be encouraged to do their own risk assessments. I think in this case some of the group figured it out.

 

Water safety is an interesting topic but the end of October paddleboarding on a small river where there is an unprotected weir after it has been raining? Really?
 

Do people not know what rain is and what it does?

 

Maybe they don't !

 

Tour company should be taken out and shot and hauled over the coals.

 

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11 minutes ago, magnetman said:

It could be a Darwin thing. Surely people can see that going out on a paddle board on anything other than a calm and quiet waterway in nice weather is a risky activity. You are standing up. I know one can sit down but generally its a standing up thing. Clue is in the name. If you come off it you are in the water. You don't want to be in the water at the best of times but certainly not in October.

 

Unless you have really good core strength and balance (skateboarder etc) you will probably have difficulties with this activity. Stick with nice warm weather so when you fall in you don't die. Even in nice warm weather people still get into serious difficulties. The cold shock is quite hard on people who are not used to it.

 

Maybe a bit simplistic but people really do need to be encouraged to do their own risk assessments. I think in this case some of the group figured it out.

 

Water safety is an interesting topic but the end of October paddleboarding on a small river where there is an unprotected weir after it has been raining? Really?
 

Do people not know what rain is and what it does?

 

Maybe they don't !

 

Tour company should be taken out and shot and hauled over the coals.

 

Near me on the River Dee you can do Whitewater Paddleboarding. A lot of the problem is bought on by the British Canoe Union who I understand control the sport. Stand up Paddleboarding and Canoeing have instructors. What the instructors and sometimes the companies fail to tell you is that their are different grades of instructors. For instance you have flat water instructors suitable for lakes and moving water instructors who are then subdivided again into different grades of moving water. I have not read the report but what grade of instructor were they who ran this trip. The public probably thought that the people were competent to run it as they were an instructor.

Edited by Tonka
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18 minutes ago, magnetman said:

White water SUP? Is shooting weirs on rivers normal? Thats too dangerous.

 

 

Yes they do it on the rapids at Mile End Mill upstream of Llangollen. You can shoot weirs in a canoe and kayak. It depends on the design of the weir. If they closed in sides then you get a stopper produced in high flow which will drag you back in. There is a well known one at Dorking on the River Mole. Best to get out and inspect the weir first before proceeding. 

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Yes I'd be happy to shoot a weir in a canoe or kayak but a SUP is a completely different animal.

 

Too dodgy.

 

The whole marketing thing around SUP and the fact you can put it in the boot of the car in a few minutes after use means it will attract a whole new group of users.

 

I can see a situation where we will get idiot signs everywhere with pictures of SUP and warnings about this and that.

 

Nice on a summers day but shooting weirs? no thanks.

 

 

Maybe they should have some of these notices around just so people understand what to do.

 

 

humor-minimalism-typography-yellow-background-wallpaper-preview.jpg

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4 minutes ago, magnetman said:

Yes I'd be happy to shoot a weir in a canoe or kayak but a SUP is a completely different animal.

 

Too dodgy.

 

The whole marketing thing around SUP and the fact you can put it in the boot of the car in a few minutes after use means it will attract a whole new group of users.

 

I can see a situation where we will get idiot signs everywhere with pictures of SUP and warnings about this and that.

 

Nice on a summers day but shooting weirs? no thanks.

 

 

Maybe they should have some of these notices around just so people understand what to do.

 

 

humor-minimalism-typography-yellow-background-wallpaper-preview.jpg

you must have a big car if you can get a SUP in the boot. They are rigid like surfboards. What you are referring to is a iSUP which stand for inflatable stand up paddleboard 

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Personally speaking, I think stand up paddle boarding is ridiculous. It has only got popular because it looks cool leaned up against a VW van on Instagram. A totally unsuitable craft to deal with even the slightest abnormal situation on the water....you might as well be on a Lilo. But I, like most members of this forum speak with the benefit of many years experience on the water and know how it can bite.

 

You can't expect people with no water experience to know this, and when they book a tour with a 'professional' outfit you don't expect them to lead you into a very dangerous situation and get you killed.

 

18 minutes ago, Goliath said:

After reading the report, I find it hard to believe the tour leaders weren’t found negligent. 
 

or did I miss something?
 


 

It never needed to happen. 

 

The assistant tour guide was killed when trying to rescue the people stuck, and the main tour leader and owner of the business was arrested a week later and charged with gross negligence manslaughter. It wasn't mentioned in the report as the MAIB only stick to the circumstances of the accident and don't directly apportion blame.....although they came as close as I've seen to doing so on this occasion. 

 

 

 

 

 

    

Edited by booke23
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23 minutes ago, Tonka said:

you must have a big car if you can get a SUP in the boot. They are rigid like surfboards. What you are referring to is a iSUP which stand for inflatable stand up paddleboard 

 

People do think they are rigid but they actually aren't. They are highly inflated giving the impression of rigidity. This means you can put them in the car. This completely alters the story of who can access the water, their competence, their motivation and their ability to understand what going on open water means in the real world.

 

From the MAIB report (lazy copy and paste)

 

 

1.1 PARTICULARS OF STAND UP PADDLEBOARD
VESSEL PARTICULARS
Vessel’s name Not applicable
Flag UK
Certifying Authority Not applicable
Hull identification number Not applicable
Type Stand up paddleboard
Registered owner Privately owned
Manager(s) Not applicable
Construction Inflatable stand up paddleboard

 

 

I like the way MAIB stands for Messing About In Boats.

 

I wonder if this was an accident.

 

 

(my bold and underline for clarity as to terminology)

Edited by magnetman
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4 minutes ago, magnetman said:

 

People do think they are rigid but they actually aren't. They are highly inflated giving the impression of rigidity.

 

From the MAIB report (lazy copy and paste)

 

 

1.1 PARTICULARS OF STAND UP PADDLEBOARD
VESSEL PARTICULARS
Vessel’s name Not applicable
Flag UK
Certifying Authority Not applicable
Hull identification number Not applicable
Type Stand up paddleboard
Registered owner Privately owned
Manager(s) Not applicable
Construction Inflatable stand up paddleboard

 

 

No i mean rigid as in 

Rigid Hard Composite Paddle Boards

At Fatstick we offer a great looking range of hard (Composite) paddle boards for all levels of paddler experience. Our rigid paddle boards are hand made and offer stunning wood/bamboo finishing and carbon construction. At Fatstick we take our environmental impact seriously, for every board purchased we will plant a tree on your behalf.

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I know what you are referring to but I was referring to the SUP in the MAIB report which is the subject of the thread.

 

You can get these in any car you like because they are inflatable.

 

 

It is a completely different story when the 'boat' you are on goes back in the car after use. I personally think this is a huge subject and I wish they wouldn't talk so loud and keep looking in the windows.

 

Where is my 12 bore?
 

Actually where is my 4 bore?

Edited by magnetman
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8 minutes ago, booke23 said:

Personally speaking, I think stand up paddle boarding is ridiculous. It has only got popular because it looks cool leaned up against a VW van on Instagram. A totally unsuitable craft to deal with even the slightest abnormal situation on the water....you might as well be on a Lilo. But I, like most members of this forum speak with the benefit of many years experience on the water and know how it can bite.

 

You can't expect people with no water experience to know this, and when they book a tour with a 'professional' outfit you don't expect them to lead you into a very dangerous situation and get you killed.

 

 

The assistant tour guide was killed when trying to rescue the people stuck, and the main tour leader and owner of the business was arrested a week later and charged with gross negligence manslaughter. It wasn't mentioned in the report as the MAIB only stick to the circumstances of the accident and don't directly apportion blame.....although they came as close as I've seen to doing so on this occasion. 

 

 

 

 

 

    

Yes the report says how one tour leader died attempting to save them. 
And yes it did read as a damning report on the guides. 
And without direct blame. 
 

Do we know if the other guide ever got done for it?

 

There’s a section in the report that describes drowning in cold water.  

Very sad. 

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2 minutes ago, magnetman said:

I know what you are referring to but I was referring to the SUP in the MAIB report which is the subject of the thread.

 

You can get these in any car you like because they are inflatable.

 

 

Please listen an isup is the inflatable stand up paddleboard which you can get in the boot of your car, But you said you can get a SUP in the boot of your car which is a rigid non inflatable board which you might get in your car if you drive a hearse. 

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1 minute ago, Tonka said:

Please listen an isup is the inflatable stand up paddleboard which you can get in the boot of your car, But you said you can get a SUP in the boot of your car which is a rigid non inflatable board which you might get in your car if you drive a hearse. 

 

 

MAIB report

 

1.1 PARTICULARS OF STAND UP PADDLEBOARD
VESSEL PARTICULARS
Vessel’s name Not applicable
Flag UK
Certifying Authority Not applicable
Hull identification number Not applicable
Type Stand up paddleboard
Registered owner Privately owned
Manager(s) Not applicable
Construction Inflatable stand up paddleboard

 

 

;)

 

The generic term is SUP. You can then subdivide this into several different categories as I and the anoraks at the MAIB did.

 

The simple fact is that the vast majority (I'd say over 90 percent but I know nuffin) of SUPs used on inland waterways are inflatable. That's the whole reason why so many people are using them.

 

600,000 I think they said. A drop in the ocean but a lot of people. None of them drive hearses except perhaps for a living.

 

Edited by magnetman
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1 minute ago, magnetman said:

 

 

MAIB report

 

1.1 PARTICULARS OF STAND UP PADDLEBOARD
VESSEL PARTICULARS
Vessel’s name Not applicable
Flag UK
Certifying Authority Not applicable
Hull identification number Not applicable
Type Stand up paddleboard
Registered owner Privately owned
Manager(s) Not applicable
Construction Inflatable stand up paddleboard

 

 

;)

i give up. you can lead a horse to water

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Just now, Tonka said:

i give up. you can lead a horse to water

You can lead the MAIB to water and find they are packed full of people who know that they are talking about.

 

They don't use terminology randomly. It is very precise and very deliberate. There is a reason for this.

 

 

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It is actually quite interesting looking into the difference between inflatable stand up paddle board and just stand up paddleboard.

 

Decathlon (popular retailer) has this "stand up paddleboard"

 

743263925_Screenshot2022-12-08at20-44-18AquaMarinaCORALTOURING350cm11ft6inTouringStandUpPaddleboardPackage.png.cc8706a5f18afcf74466a376d4a4d4b8.png

 

 

 

and this "inflatable stand up paddleboard"

 

447349201_Screenshot2022-12-08at20-46-59AquaMarinaMonster12.0_366cmInflatableStandUpPaddleboardPackage.png.16f821eb30bc867e4dcbddbbf6cc958d.png

 

 

I'm finding it hard not to notice the bag and pump that come with the first one.

 

Hmm. 

 

I did intially assume they were rigid as they look really hard.

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21 minutes ago, magnetman said:

 

 

Hmm. 

 

I did intially assume they were rigid as they look really hard.

When fully inflated (10-15 psi)they are very hard, completely solid, no different to a solid windsurfing board. We got ours 2 years ago and have used them on canals and (calm) rivers. 

No body should have been on that river in those conditions following that rain.

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