Water leaking onto stove top

[RickS]

Hello

without going into huge detail, I have rain (I think) still entering the boat from somewhere. I spent most of the Summer searching for the leak and sealing what I can. Still coming in from somwhere, so I have taped every possible entry point on the roof and windows as  temporary measure. Whether this is a good plan or not I don't care to be honest, i've pretty much lost patience with it.

 

Anyway, that is background really, the issue is that when there is rain, water spits onto the hot stove surface from somewhere on the ceiling collar and i jsut can't figure how it's getting in.

I have a double chimney and a top hat - I don't get, if the rain is coming down the chimney, how it transfers to the outside of the flue - it must be getting through the roof somewhere else and running to the flue is all I've got, but I can't see where from.

 

Has anyone else had this sort of problem, and what did it turn out to be please?

[MtB]

Is this a steel narrowboat with a steel top, or something else?

[mrsmelly]

Could it be condensation?

[rusty69]

The top of the flue pipe is often the first place to go, sometimes just inside the roof collar.

 

[MtB]

Just now, mrsmelly said:

Could it be condensation?

 

Dripping only when it rains? Hmmm, now lemme think about that....

[rusty69]

The other possibility, if you are sure the roof collar itself is sealed is the through bolts themselves that secure the collar to the roof.

Edited November 23, 2022 by rusty69

[RickS]

It is a steel boat with a steel roof. I don't think condensation would cause this - or rather it concides with rainfall and the heavier the rain, the heavier the dripping.

 

There is the stub of a radio aerial on the opposite side of the roof which, even though I have taped over it, there seems to be wetness beneath it (I can feel through a hole in the lining to feel this).

I will have to put more tape on this until it stops to see if this is causing the dripping onto the stove.

flue is in good nick - only a year or so old and no sign of corrosion

1 minute ago, rusty69 said:

The other possibility, if you are sure the rood collar itself is sealed is the through bolts themselves that secure the collar to the roof.

The roof collar is pretty much covered - no guarantee 100% covered but pretty sure

 

[jonathanA]

Joint between the roof and roof collar? Especially if there is a bit of rust under the collar.  

I've also had water find its way from mushroom vent to light fitting... very confusing till i worked it out so might bevworth checking any vents nearby

[Feeby100]

Well I say you found it the Ariel 

[Tony Brooks]

Unless the inner liner to the chimney is slightly longer than the outer so the inner fits inside the flue any misalignment will allow the inner flue to drip onto the top of the roof collar. So if there is any question about the seal between collar and flue you can easily get water dripping down. What sealer do you have at the top of the flue, I would advise Plumbaflue silicon, so the flue can expand and contract without damaging the top seal.

[MtB]

1 hour ago, RickS said:

The roof collar is pretty much covered - no guarantee 100% covered but pretty sure

 

 

I'd say there's your problem, right there then.

 

With water ingress you need to be 101% certain, not just 'pretty sure'. Any room for doubt at all, and the water will seek it out. 

 

I'd suggest removing the roof collar and re-fitting it with new sealant making sure the bolts and bolt holes in particular are thoroughly sealed with mastic.

 

You've mentioned tape a couple of times I think. Tape is less than useless at sealing water leaks.

 

 

Edited November 23, 2022 by MtB
Fiddle with it...

[blackrose]

I agree, tape is useless, no wonder you're getting frustrated, that will never work.

 

Take the collar off, clean of any old sealant and rust and reseal it with high temp silicone like Plumbaflu. You can use ordinary silicone if you want but since it's the same price I don't really see the point of using the wrong product.

 

Also reseal the gap between/around the flue and the collar.

 

That's where you should have started.

Edited November 23, 2022 by blackrose

[Tracy D'arth]

Put a big bucket over the flue collar. If the drip stops, there you go.

[MtB]

3 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Put a big bucket over the flue collar. If the drip stops, there you go.

 

Wouldn't the stove go out though?

[Tracy D'arth]

2 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Wouldn't the stove go out though?

Silly boy, the rain will have put it out.   😁

[Slim]

4 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Put a big bucket over the flue collar. If the drip stops, there you go.

 No , because water will still drain down the roof and under the rim of the bucket. My money, like several others, is on the collar/roof joint. Be prepared for significant rust under the collar. 

[harrybsmith]

A quick bodge is to squirt Capt Tolleys Creeping Crack Cure around all fittings on the roof, where it gets sucked in is your leak, put a bit more into that area and the leak will probably stop. The windows on my current boat love to spring leaks occasionally despite being well fitted, this is my usual solution. In my case it's to do with thermal expansion, could that be the case for you? 

[rusty69]

6 minutes ago, harrybsmith said:

A quick bodge is to squirt Capt Tolleys Creeping Crack Cure around all fittings on the roof, where it gets sucked in is your leak, put a bit more into that area and the leak will probably stop. The windows on my current boat love to spring leaks occasionally despite being well fitted, this is my usual solution. In my case it's to do with thermal expansion, could that be the case for you? 

Interested to learn how"well fitted windows" leak?

 

Are they well fitted with perished rubber seals or something?

[harrybsmith]

5 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Interested to learn how"well fitted windows" leak?

 

Are they well fitted with perished rubber seals or something?

 

They're 2 metres long into 45 year old fibreglass with no provision for a proper seal so they have butyl tape behind, all seals, tape and screws renewed 4 ish years ago. The difference in thermal expansion between the aluminium frame and the fibreglass boat over that length means that leaks are sometimes inevitable. Chatting to the guy that made the windows originally (for Dawncraft and Highbridge) he said they always leaked from new... 

 

(edited for spelling)

Edited November 24, 2022 by harrybsmith

[rusty69]

2 minutes ago, harrybsmith said:

 

They're 2 metres long into 45 year old fibreglass with no provision for a proper seal so they have butyl tape behind, all seals, tape and screws renewed 4 ish years ago. The difference in thermal expansion between the aluminium frame and the fibreglass boat over that length means that leaks are sometimes inevitable. Chatting to the guy that made the windows originally (for Dawncraft and Highbridge) he said they always leaked from new... 

 

(edited for spelling)

Interesting. Thanks. I have aluminium windows on a GRP cabin over a shorter length. They have never leaked between frame and cabin, but a few years ago started leaking through the rubber seal between glass and frame. Captain Tolley cured the leak for a good couple of years before they leaked again.

[Tracy D'arth]

Isn't Capt. Tolley just EVA, waterproof PVA?

[harrybsmith]

2 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Interesting. Thanks. I have aluminium windows on a GRP cabin over a shorter length. They have never leaked between frame and cabin, but a few years ago started leaking through the rubber seal between glass and frame. Captain Tolley cured the leak for a good couple of years before they leaked again.

 

Yeah it's impressive stuff. Thinking about it, I haven't spotted any leaks this year, I wonder whether it's cured itself....

 

(The windows and slight lack of headroom are the only bad bits with my current boat, a Highbridge 32, one day I'll buy a scruffier one and chop the topsides off, extend them up and fit proper windows to it, be better than any lumbering metal thing) 

[jonathanA]

5 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Isn't Capt. Tolley just EVA, waterproof PVA?

I've always suspected it was watered down pva. Wasn't aware of EVA. 

[RickS]

Thanks all. Went a bit postal with the tape today whilst it was fine, just to see if I could stop the drips. Posts here have made me realise that the tape (Gorilla waterproof tape) would not neccessarily stop leaks, I was hopeful it might reduce the drips.

Rain this afternoon caused the same level of drippage, hwich makes me think (thanks Tony Brooks) that my arrangement of chimney and inner chimney might be the problem. Next time it rains, my plan is to not light a fire, remove the chimney and put a cap on the flue collar, which, hopefully should tell me if the rain is getting down the chimney - at which point I wal ask about sealing the flue in the collar on the inside.

Reading other posts about leaks, it seems that even small cracks in filler / rust patches on the roof can cause a lot of water to enter through the roof. I think I have been naive about this and need to deal with every possible entry (when the weather improves)

Used Captain Tolley's around windows and mushrooms and I could smell it in the water that eventually made itsway to the cabin bilge. Either the crack was bigger than it could deal with or it needs more applications.

Thank you to all who posted (blackrose - I know I should have started at the point you mention, but to be honest there seem to be a million jobs that take priority - until it rains. I appreciate the advice though). I learn a lot even though i tend to get the general feeling that I am making very obvious errors