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A few ideas id like to run by you all


Boatbricky

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2 minutes ago, dmr said:

Maybe derust and sprayfoam then move it to London (if its not already there) and sell the shell at a handsome profit to finance a better ready to go boat?

 

Or maybe even, leave out the derust and sprayfoam bit! 

 

 

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Well I'm glad I havent had anyone say my ideas were stupid haha

 

I think the blower/extractors my be slightly over engineered from the sound of it.

 

While I'm here as to the mention of keeping ballast off the plate what I was planning to do was do one more coat of thick bitumen and basicly cock a load of plastic BBs (the type for a BB gun) in there so they stick to the bitumen.

To me that makes sence but wanted another opinion before I do it haha.

 

Also a back boiler was mentioned...... how effective are they 🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️ 

 

 

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As you plan to live on this boat and as its a short boat with a cruiser stern, plus you appear confident about welding, have youy thought about converting the back to a Trad to gain a bit of extra internal space?  This could be anywhere between fairly easy to really difficult depending upon the current layout and construction.

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11 minutes ago, Boatbricky said:

Well I'm glad I havent had anyone say my ideas were stupid haha

Which is a start. However, I'd suggest a better start is to look at what solutions have already been tried and tested in narrowboats and implement those wherever suitable. You've enough on without reinventing the wheel where you don't have to. :)

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15 minutes ago, Boatbricky said:

Also a back boiler was mentioned...... how effective are they 🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️ 

With a 4 or 5 kw solid fuel stove in 30' (minus a cruiser deck), I don't see the benefit. As has been said, you'll most likely be looking for ways to let the heat out, so you don't need the expense or complexity of adding a way to get the heat to distant parts of the boat you don't really have.

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21 minutes ago, Boatbricky said:

While I'm here as to the mention of keeping ballast off the plate what I was planning to do was do one more coat of thick bitumen and basicly cock a load of plastic BBs (the type for a BB gun) in there so they stick to the bitumen.

That sounds like it could work. One I've seen is to use the plastic spacers that are used when setting the grouting gap between ceramic tiles, but placed underneath concrete paving slabs. Cheap as chips and readily available.

 

21 minutes ago, Boatbricky said:

Also a back boiler was mentioned...... how effective are they 🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️ 

Very. Not so necessary on a shorter boat for distributing the heat around, especially if you place the stove more towards the centre, rather than the common site beside the bow doors. Comes in to its own for water heating in winter, if you have a calorifier.

Edited by Jen-in-Wellies
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Agreed. Ive a 48ft trad stern boat and have no such issues. Tbh its nice that the bedroom is a little cooler (furthest room away from our stove). 
 

edited to also agree with Jen. Stove mounted more centrally a better idea. Always thought having one right at the bow doors was daft. 

Edited by Jak
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Another vote here for buy a fitted out used boat.

To re-iterate what has been already said, it will cost more to fit it out yourself, double or more than your original estimate and probably take three times longer than you thought.

I know you said buying a boat ready to go isn't as much fun, but having done a couple of (not very major projects) I did not find it fun.Slicing your hand on a chisel on a freezing day and being unable to feel it untill you wonder where all that blood has come from,is quite character building and you will find your swearing vocabulary will enlarge immensely!!

There are many jobs on a boat that seem at first glance the same as doing them to a house, but on a boat these jobs are much more difficult.

So again recommend that you buy a used boat and move in and go cruising immediately.

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5 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

Comes in to its own for water heating in winter, if you have a calorifier.

Good idea to mention this back boiler advantage for others reading this thread - and for the OP too as he's starting from scratch and  may yet not go for the gas instant water heater he mentioned earlier.

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23 minutes ago, dmr said:

As you plan to live on this boat and as its a short boat with a cruiser stern, plus you appear confident about welding, have youy thought about converting the back to a Trad to gain a bit of extra internal space?  This could be anywhere between fairly easy to really difficult depending upon the current layout and construction.

Hahaha I love your difficulty range.

 

....... but that is a brilliant idea 🤔🤔🤔

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The more I think about this, the less I like the idea of moving the windows in order to change the interior, it's such a major thing for little or no benefit. I'd redesign the interior to fit with the windows. No way would I start cutting holes in the roof. It's a small boat, accept that. 

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You are mad and your ideas are potty.  Happy now?

 

Ask yourself why boats are built and fitted out as they almost always are, and you answer all your questions. Don't create another Whitefield, that one was a big enough disaster.

 A 30 foot cruiser stern has no space for anything, a 30 foot trad may just have space for a flying cat. Neither have space or water systems for a bath.

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3 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

You are mad and your ideas are potty.  Happy now?

 

Ask yourself why boats are built and fitted out as they almost always are, and you answer all your questions. Don't create another Whitefield, that one was a big enough disaster.

 A 30 foot cruiser stern has no space for anything, a 30 foot trad may just have space for a flying cat. Neither have space or water systems for a bath.

Whats a Whitefield 😳😳...... 

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1 minute ago, Boatbricky said:

Did it sink 🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️

Commissioned in 2008 or so at humungous expense by first time narrowboaters. They tried to make it look like the Med sea going boats they had been on. Lots of new ideas, never before applied to a narrowboat. Electric everything. Joy stick steering. TV's in every room. It was in all the inland waterways magazines.

Was used once or twice by the owners, who then sold it at a great loss. Reappears for sale every couple of years as people buy it, find it is a liability and try and get rid of it.

Now used as an example of new to the inland waterways people with no previous experience coming up with new and innovative ideas, rather than relying on the tried and tested. Also the perils of money no object builds and the losses that can result.

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Ohhhhhhh gotcha so effectively I need to bear in mind to a certain extent that when it comes to sell that so.e things will put people off

2 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

Commissioned in 2008 or so at humungous expense by first time narrowboaters. They tried to make it look like the Med sea going boats they had been on. Lots of new ideas, never before applied to a narrowboat. Electric everything. Joy stick steering. TV's in every room. It was in all the inland waterways magazines.

Was used once or twice by the owners, who then sold it at a great loss. Reappears for sale every couple of years as people buy it, find it is a liability and try and get rid of it.

Now used as an example of new to the inland waterways people with no previous experience coming up with new and innovative ideas, rather than relying on the tried and tested. Also the perils of money no object builds and the losses that can result.

Right im with you 👌👌 simplicity is king 👌👌

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4 minutes ago, Boatbricky said:

Ohhhhhhh gotcha so effectively I need to bear in mind to a certain extent that when it comes to sell that so.e things will put people off

 

I think you need to be practical. You will be spending a lot of time in the saloon area. I would be as generous as possible with that space. You would seem to have room for a saloon, a galley, and a space for a shower and toilet. The saloon doubling as sleeping space. The boat could be heated with a warm air blower, or a very compact solid stove. 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, Boatbricky said:

Ohhhhhhh gotcha so effectively I need to bear in mind to a certain extent that when it comes to sell that so.e things will put people off

Partly that, but more about the perils of building, or fitting out a boat with no previous inland waterways experience. Some one may think that the current common way of doing a certain thing on a boat is silly and their way is going to be much better. Nine times out of ten, they find that their idea doesn't work and the common way does. There are tens of thousands of boats on the waterways and the common way of doing things on them has evolved over decades. Things change as new technology and materials become available, but slowly. Once you've got some boating experience on a more conventional boat, then you can try something new. You'll have a much better idea of what is likely to work and have a better chance of success.

 

As an example. On CWDF, new boaters thinking of fitting out a boat often want under floor heating. This has been installed, but is not common. There are good reasons for this to do with the height required to get enough insulation underneath, which reduces the ceiling height for tall people. Also the power required for pumping, the need for it to be on continously. This isn't immediately apparent to new boaters. It is the reason why, for example people have been asking you how you are going to power your extraction fans. Almost all new boaters don't get how what a struggle it can be to keep the batteries charged and in good condition.

Another one is gas free boating, which some new boaters desperately want. Again, it can be done successfully, but isn't common and there are good reasons for this.

 

I'm saying this because I fitted out my boat with little previous experience. I mostly used the accepted way of doing things, with a few exceptions, like solar thermal hot water. I was lucky. My departures from accepted practice worked fine, but they could easily not have.

Jen

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25 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

Another one is gas free boating, which some new boaters desperately want. Again, it can be done successfully, but isn't common and there are good reasons for this.

It's always worth revisiting concepts though as new technology emerges - off grid, gas free cooking is getting viable now with lithium batteries. Well, in summer at least! Until October, I use an electric kettle and induction hob, the gas hob gets covered over. The power is quickly put back into the batteries from solar, and it saves on gas; a 13kg bottle lasts me about 8 months as it's only used for hot water.

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14 minutes ago, cheesegas said:

It's always worth revisiting concepts though as new technology emerges - off grid, gas free cooking is getting viable now with lithium batteries. Well, in summer at least! Until October, I use an electric kettle and induction hob, the gas hob gets covered over. The power is quickly put back into the batteries from solar, and it saves on gas; a 13kg bottle lasts me about 8 months as it's only used for hot water.

Which is a good example of the point I was making. Accepted practice does change as technology changes, but it needs boating experience, like you have, to make an informed decision on if it is worth persuing. Li batts open up new possibilities, but at the moment need both boating experience and good electrical knowledge to get right. In a few years time they'll be standard.

Edited by Jen-in-Wellies
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5 hours ago, cheesegas said:

It's always worth revisiting concepts though as new technology emerges - off grid, gas free cooking is getting viable now with lithium batteries. Well, in summer at least! Until October, I use an electric kettle and induction hob, the gas hob gets covered over. The power is quickly put back into the batteries from solar, and it saves on gas; a 13kg bottle lasts me about 8 months as it's only used for hot water.

But there's a difference between having gas and electric cooking options and being gas free! I know boaters who will happily use an electric kettle of the inverter when the engine is running, but will use one on the gas stove when moored up.

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