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INVERTERS - Your opinion on best, and worst


Ca Jon

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FWIW, my 600W PSW Sunshine Solar inverter is incapable of starting my cheapo Igenix 60W 230Vac fridge. It just goes straight to overload fault. 

 

Point being, even though received wisdom is motors need an inverter 10x their rating, this is not enough with the above combination. I suspect the inverter cannot quite deliver 600W transient starting power and the fridge perhaps is a little more than 60W as per the data label.

 

Edited by MtB
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5 minutes ago, MtB said:

FWIW, my 600W PSW Sunshine Solar inverter is incapable of starting my cheapo Igenix 60W 230Vac fridge. It just goes straight to overload fault. 

 

Point being, even though received wisdom is motors need an inverter 10x their rating, this is not enough with the above combination. I suspect the inverter cannot quite deliver 600W transient starting power and the fridge perhaps is a little more than 60W as per the data label.

 

Minimum I use for starting a fridge is 1000w preferably more.

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6 minutes ago, MtB said:

FWIW, my 600W PSW Sunshine Solar inverter is incapable of starting my cheapo Igenix 60W 230Vac fridge. It just goes straight to overload fault. 

 

Point being, even though received wisdom is motors need an inverter 10x their rating, this is not enough with the above combination. I suspect the inverter cannot quite deliver 600W transient starting power and the fridge perhaps is a little more than 60W as per the data label.

 

Thank you. Useful to know. 

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1 minute ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Minimum I use for starting a fridge is 1000w preferably more.

 

 

I've just received my 2.5kW PSW inverter, that should make the bugger work! 

 

Will report back when I've fried it... 

 

 

Ooops great typo, I'll leave it in!

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1 minute ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Minimum I use for starting a fridge is 1000w preferably more.

Thank you, I am thinking of getting one rated at 2000w to allow for that. 

Just now, MtB said:

 

 

I've just received my 2.5kW PSW inverter, that should make the bugger work! 

 

Will report back when I've fried it... 

 

 

Ooops great typo, I'll leave it in!

LOL. Yes please do let me know. What make?

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14 minutes ago, Ca Jon said:

Hello all,

After having our old sterling 1800 msw stolen from our boat, I am looking to replace it and am asking for advice on best, ok, and rubbish ones.

Thank you

It depends to some extent on what you want from an inverter. On the boat we have a fancy Mastervolt Combi that does everything including talking to other devices, does power support etc.

 

In the caravan I have a sunshine solar 1500w PSW inverter that seems fine - does what it should do and has quite a low quiescent power consumption (around 1A at 12v). If you just want a very basic inverter then the sunshine solar range seems good.

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4 minutes ago, nicknorman said:

It depends to some extent on what you want from an inverter. On the boat we have a fancy Mastervolt Combi that does everything including talking to other devices, does power support etc.

 

In the caravan I have a sunshine solar 1500w PSW inverter that seems fine - does what it should do and has quite a low quiescent power consumption (around 1A at 12v). If you just want a very basic inverter then the sunshine solar range seems good.

Thank you, I think basic is what we are going for. I will check them out. 

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25 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

 

I've just received my 2.5kW PSW inverter, that should make the bugger work! 

 

Will report back when I've fried it... 

 

 

Ooops great typo, I'll leave it in!

Don't forget that the bigger the inverter is the bigger the zero-load power is, so more drain on the batteries. This is especially true for some of the cheap ones, the expensive gear like Victron tends to be pretty good.

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Just now, IanD said:

Don't forget that the bigger the inverter is the bigger the zero-load power is, so more drain on the batteries. This is especially true for some of the cheap ones, the expensive gear like Victron tends to be pretty good.

 

Yes this is why I initially bought the 600W inverter. The quiescent current on this 2.5kW Sunshine unit is still only 0.8A according to the spec sheet!

 

 

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27 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Yes this is why I initially bought the 600W inverter. The quiescent current on this 2.5kW Sunshine unit is still only 0.8A according to the spec sheet!

 

 

10W zero-load for a 2.5kW inverter is pretty good (some cheap ones are a lot higher), always assuming that it meets the spec -- there are plenty of cases where this has been found out to not be the case especially with unit-to-unit variation, even some Victron inverter/chargers... 😞

 

P.S. Best typo I've seen for ages... 😉

Edited by IanD
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5 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

I have bought Flamezum off the auction sight. The quiescent current is slightly higher than their spec sheet but at less than 1A for a 2500/5000 surge inverter it is good.

Thank you for that

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1 hour ago, MtB said:

 

Yes this is why I initially bought the 600W inverter. The quiescent current on this 2.5kW Sunshine unit is still only 0.8A according to the spec sheet!

 

 

 

 

Just jury-rigged the 2.5kW one to test, and yes the quiescent current IS about 0.8A!

 

Bustard thing still faults when starting the fridge though, much to my amazement. 

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No one has recommended the worst yet, so...

Something no-name from EBay, or auction site of your choice, especially if it is a direct import, with no UK presence. Search on the brand name comes up with little, or nothing and what you might find is in Chinese, or "Chinglish". High quiescent current, low efficiency. Supplied with undersized cables. Liable to fail in a short time. Liable to burst in to flames and burn out your boat with little warning.

The lower risk approach with lesser known brands is to buy from a larger UK importer that specialises in off-grid electrical stuff. They are more likely to have tested them and will have considered the possible effect on their reputation from supplying duff ones. Some one to go back to if the inverter goes wrong that is likely to still be there. Can still be cheaper than the top name brands.

Edited by Jen-in-Wellies
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1 hour ago, Richard10002 said:

I'm delighted with my Victron Phoenix 1600W, (2000VA), "Smart" inverter. Way better than the inverter bit of the Sterling inverter charger that it replaced.

 

https://www.12voltplanet.co.uk/victron-energy-phoenix-pure-sine-wave-inverter-12v-2000w-smart.html

 

 

thank you I will take a look. 

1 minute ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

No one has recommended the worst yet, so...

Something no-name from EBay, or auction site of your choice, especially if it is a direct import, with no UK presence. Search on the brand name comes up with little, or nothing and what you might find is in Chinese, or "Chinglish". High quiescent current, low efficiency. Supplied with undersized cables. Liable to fail in a short time. Liable to burst in to flames and burn out your boat with little warning.

The lower risk approach with lesser known brands is to buy from a larger UK importer that specialises in off-grid electrical stuff. They are more likely to have tested them and will have considered the possible effect on their reputation from supplying duff ones. Some one to go back to if the inverter goes wrong that is likely to still be there. Can still be cheaper than the top name brands.

A very wise bit of advice. Thank you!  

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PROSINE inverters are the best ever made. (disclaimer: Gibbo said this so I believe it).

 

Slightly noisy fans but the hardware is top notch.

 

I believe the original Statpower ones are slightly better than the XANTREX units. They seem identical but not sure if this is the case. 

 

PROSINE were fitted in ambulances. DAMHIKT but you want the gear in an ambulance to work. It is rather important.

 

ETA not all that easy to find these. Maybe they are getting a bit old now.

 

Anyway Victron can be ok but very expensive and I have seen the big combi units by left by bins before now. This could of course just be the result of someone buying a boat geared up for mains electric but then going CC ing and thinking the blue box is a waste of space.  Mastervolt is another Dutch product.

 

Xantrex do some other ones including the ProWatt. I've got one of these (700w) and it is a good item but has not  been given hard work.

 

 

 

Mine is the 700w version of this one https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/255724673242?hash=item3b8a60d8da:g:WD8AAOSwuxJjIIL~&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAAoFJWO%2FNC3kpK0hf5qZ8hJCZZ%2BIcAYFK6KQItxdGDCG6SSkSs13exFrfRdYHmPCcmcnaffrmXsEy0QO6lwmMB4384LoaGuXZWnzO3bHZtNoBK%2F3O95SpgvPQC0z6alSNvKBeIzSfW9Df9J%2FeXjrQgvorNnUUw6iZkKQ%2FZoQ4jMbnqP3Qi5Wv6AeUS1polaHLZjQFmFwthutPlHNlwc7hrlO4%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR_z2orP9YA

 

Obviously I can't vouch for someone else selling a second hand inverter but the product seems like good quality to me,

 

 

Edited by magnetman
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24 minutes ago, magnetman said:

PROSINE inverters are the best ever made. (disclaimer: Gibbo said this so I believe it).

 

Slightly noisy fans but the hardware is top notch.

 

I believe the original Statpower ones are slightly better than the XANTREX units. They seem identical but not sure if this is the case. 

 

PROSINE were fitted in ambulances. DAMHIKT but you want the gear in an ambulance to work. It is rather important.

 

ETA not all that easy to find these. Maybe they are getting a bit old now.

 

Anyway Victron can be ok but very expensive and I have seen the big combi units by left by bins before now. This could of course just be the result of someone buying a boat geared up for mains electric but then going CC ing and thinking the blue box is a waste of space.  Mastervolt is another Dutch product.

 

Xantrex do some other ones including the ProWatt. I've got one of these (700w) and it is a good item but has not  been given hard work.

 

 

 

Mine is the 700w version of this one https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/255724673242?hash=item3b8a60d8da:g:WD8AAOSwuxJjIIL~&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAAoFJWO%2FNC3kpK0hf5qZ8hJCZZ%2BIcAYFK6KQItxdGDCG6SSkSs13exFrfRdYHmPCcmcnaffrmXsEy0QO6lwmMB4384LoaGuXZWnzO3bHZtNoBK%2F3O95SpgvPQC0z6alSNvKBeIzSfW9Df9J%2FeXjrQgvorNnUUw6iZkKQ%2FZoQ4jMbnqP3Qi5Wv6AeUS1polaHLZjQFmFwthutPlHNlwc7hrlO4%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR_z2orP9YA

 

Obviously I can't vouch for someone else selling a second hand inverter but the product seems like good quality to me

 

 

Thank you for that. Very useful to see the best. 

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53 minutes ago, Dav and Pen said:

Had a couple of cheap basic ones at first but brought a 3000/24 Victron combi in 2006 still going strong. It is not one of the fancy ones and we needed a big one for all the 240 stuff on the barge.

Thank you for that 

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7 hours ago, MtB said:

FWIW, my 600W PSW Sunshine Solar inverter is incapable of starting my cheapo Igenix 60W 230Vac fridge. It just goes straight to overload fault. 

 

Point being, even though received wisdom is motors need an inverter 10x their rating, this is not enough with the above combination. I suspect the inverter cannot quite deliver 600W transient starting power and the fridge perhaps is a little more than 60W as per the data label.

 

 

7 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Minimum I use for starting a fridge is 1000w preferably more.

I have a 2020 year fridge rated 50W or thereabouts. Occasionally it has turned on when I am looking at the Cerbo monitor and it displays a momentary load of 900 to 950W.

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15 hours ago, PeterF said:

 

I have a 2020 year fridge rated 50W or thereabouts. Occasionally it has turned on when I am looking at the Cerbo monitor and it displays a momentary load of 900 to 950W.

 

That's because fridge power ratings (e.g. 50W) are usually average power over a day according to testing (50W would be 1.2kWh/day or 438kWh/year, which seems rather high).

 

If this is the case and the compressor is only on for (say) 3h a day then the power while it's running would then be 400W. Typical startup current is often taken to be 3x-4x running current, which would then be up to 2kW for a fraction of a second. If the 50W is power while running then the peak power would be much lower than this, but then that wouldn't trip the inverter...

 

I don't know what the measurement interval on your Cerbo is (1 second?) but if the duration of the startup current is less than this (very likely) it could well be under-reading the actual peak value, which is what would trip an inverter.

 

P.S. Inverter overload data for Victron attached, this gives 6x nominal current at startup for single-phase motors like a fridge compressor.

Victron overload.jpg

Edited by IanD
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21 hours ago, MtB said:

 

 

Just jury-rigged the 2.5kW one to test, and yes the quiescent current IS about 0.8A!

 

Bustard thing still faults when starting the fridge though, much to my amazement. 

Have you tried fitting a hard start capacitor to the fridge? 

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