C&RT Review of 'Facilities' provision

[Lady M]

As I said before, there are Elsan points on the system which are not maintained by CRT.  The same is true of waterpoints.

[LadyG]

1 hour ago, Goliath said:

I think you’re confusing the ladies 😃

there be a lady G and a lady C. 
G’s a day away from Brighouse. 

Just so, but I'm two minute cruise from my nearest Elsan, at Sowerby Bridge, and it's a four star facility.

[Jon57]

2 hours ago, Goliath said:

I think you’re confusing the ladies 😃

there be a lady G and a lady C. 
G’s a day away from Brighouse. 

Yes my mistake. Don’t know my arse from my elbow. 👍

[Mike Todd]

2 hours ago, Goliath said:

Or simply use a proper hose. 
A proper hose will loop across the path giving the cyclists something to consider. 

My expendable one does lots of bends unless at full stretch but when I asked a  cyclist recently to carry his bike over the hose (having pointed out to him not to trip over it) it was decidedly dischuffed.

[Mike Todd]

On 24/09/2022 at 11:02, Dog said:

Yes, I think the tap at Barbridge was stopped because the nearby house owner discovered that it was coming from his property and, quite rightly, didn't like paying for boaters to use his water.

I believe the rubbish point was scrapped because of difficulty accessing the site over bridge 101(?)

 

I could, of course, be wrong.

I understand that the collection companies have become a lot fussier over access in recent years, especially as they now use much chunkier vehicles. This is what I believed happened at Batchworth (GU) until a new site was found some distance over a bridge, but better than none at all.

[Mike Todd]

On 24/09/2022 at 12:23, ditchcrawler said:

They did not look very operational when we passed yesterday but a fleet of rather aged hire boats was taking up a lot of the canal at an already crowded location.

[ditchcrawler]

3 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

But 30 miles is only 2 or at worst 3 days cruising and well within the 'range' of a single cassette.

But some people dont want to move for 13 days and on the 14th it all change

1 hour ago, Mike Todd said:

I understand that the collection companies have become a lot fussier over access in recent years, especially as they now use much chunkier vehicles. This is what I believed happened at Batchworth (GU) until a new site was found some distance over a bridge, but better than none at all.

And the one at Minworth lost completely due to access, not sure who looks after the wheely bin chained to the post

2 hours ago, LadyG said:

Just so, but I'm two minute cruise from my nearest Elsan, at Sowerby Bridge, and it's a four star facility.

See my post 

 

[pearley]

4 hours ago, Goliath said:

Manchester, a city with a link to 3 major canals has nothing to offer in way of CRT facilities/services. 

Quite true. But it does have a few offered by the Bridgewater Canal Company.

[David Mack]

4 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

But 30 miles is only 2 or at worst 3 days cruising and well within the 'range' of a single cassette.

I agree, but others were saying they should be 6 to 8 cruising hours apart, which is a lot less than 30 miles.

[Wanderer Vagabond]

4 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

But 30 miles is only 2 or at worst 3 days cruising and well within the 'range' of a single cassette.

Not entirely sure on the maths around this one. Since we are on a boat, rushing is what we don't do so for us 30 miles will probably be over 4 days cruising (7 miles a day). If that 30 miles included Hatton Flight or Wolverhampton 21 or Caen Hill it just might take us a little bit longer. Added to that, we don't tend to urinate in the towpath hedges (I know some do) so a cassette lasts us 2 days (which is why we have 3 cassettes). 

 

Having said that, the only place recently that I thought might have been as issue was between Calcutt and Warwick because I thought the Fosse Wharf Elsan had been closed, fortunately it hadn't so we could make a more leisurely trip.

[Mike Todd]

2 hours ago, pearley said:

Quite true. But it does have a few offered by the Bridgewater Canal Company.

Almost universally the BCC ones are infinitely worse than CaRT ones.

[Tracy D'arth]

3 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

Almost universally the BCC ones are infinitely worse than CaRT ones.

What, PEELing paint?

[steve hayes]

We have three cassettes and need them all occasionally, any fewer elsans and I might need four. Now where would I store it 🤔

[cuthound]

Having trialled the "pilot scheme" at Fazeley Junction, where the CRT facilities were closed and the nearby boatyard paid to offer passing boaters "free" elsan emptying, water and rubbish disposal, I suspect they will roll this out further.

 

After all it makes sense where a boatyard can provide these facilities cheaper than CRT can maintain their dedicated ones, provided there is a suitable boatyard nearby and the contract is written in such a way to prevent the boatyard ramping up the price in future years once they have secured the contract.

 

That way more of their budget can be spent on maintaining the canal infrastructure (and blue signs).

[MtB]

This does seem a good way forward as a lot of the abuse of Elsans etc happens because the CRT ones are by nature, unsupervised.

 

Once it a boatyard is supplying the service even if free to the users (and paid for by CRT behind the scenes), the supervision element of there being boatyard staff around suggests to me that abuse will be less likely.

 

 

[Mike Todd]

5 hours ago, MtB said:

This does seem a good way forward as a lot of the abuse of Elsans etc happens because the CRT ones are by nature, unsupervised.

 

Once it a boatyard is supplying the service even if free to the users (and paid for by CRT behind the scenes), the supervision element of there being boatyard staff around suggests to me that abuse will be less likely.

 

 

MSC seem to have a similar arrangement with at least a couple of places I recall (Boothstown and Stretford)

[Creaking Gate]

On 23/09/2022 at 23:04, David Mack said:

Why did BW/CRT ever get into the business of providing showers?

Because boaters wanted showers. Technology was not where it is today and it was demanded that boaters should have access to the same facilities as others. If i recall, Washing machines were added as well. 

 

All of it abused and in my opinion 90% of the use was people washing work clothes that they didn't to put through the household washing machine and the showers to wash mucky dogs after a canal walk. 

[David Mack]

2 hours ago, Creaking Gate said:

Because boaters wanted showers. Technology was not where it is today and it was demanded that boaters should have access to the same facilities as others. If i recall, Washing machines were added as well. 

If boaters wanted showers, to my mind they should have fitted them on their boats, rather than using licence money from all boaters to pay for facilities only ever used by a few.

As a holiday boater I have boated for years on a boat without a shower and managed perfectly well with stand up strip washes, combined with occasional visits to the local leisure centre.

[Mike Todd]

24 minutes ago, David Mack said:

If boaters wanted showers, to my mind they should have fitted them on their boats, rather than using licence money from all boaters to pay for facilities only ever used by a few.

As a holiday boater I have boated for years on a boat without a shower and managed perfectly well with stand up strip washes, combined with occasional visits to the local leisure centre.

I would be sympathetic to your proposal if all boaters ere leisure boaters but I do still try to take into account the needs of those who live permanently aboard many of whom may not have the resources to install a new shower  and to heat it.

[Tim Lewis]

At a meeting yesterday Richard Parry stated that showers, and washing machines, provision are no longer core  facilities and will be removed as and when repairs become uneconomic 

Edited March 5, 2023 by Tim Lewis

[Alan de Enfield]

1 minute ago, Tim Lewis said:

A a meeting yesterday Richard Parry stated that showers, and washing machines, provision are no longer core  facilities and will be removed as and when repairs become uneconomic 

 

 

 

[Arthur Marshall]

On 27/09/2022 at 12:45, Mike Todd said:

I would be sympathetic to your proposal if all boaters ere leisure boaters but I do still try to take into account the needs of those who live permanently aboard many of whom may not have the resources to install a new shower  and to heat it.

Seriously, does anyone get a boat to live on and not have access to hot water? A shower consists of a tap, hose, showerhead and a drain with a pump. It's not expensive and it's not rocket science to install.

[David Mack]

21 minutes ago, Tim Lewis said:

A a meeting yesterday Richard Parry stated that showers, and washing machines, provision are no longer core  facilities and will be removed as and when repairs become uneconomic 

I have never understood why BW/CRT ever installed them in the first place!

[LadyG]

2 minutes ago, David Mack said:

I have never understood why BW/CRT ever installed them in the first place!

I assumed it was to encourage holidays in the days when hiring a narrowboat was akin to camping, and pre 1966.

I did once use a shower, the facilities were exceptionally clean and in good order, I just prefer not to use communal facilities if it can be avoided.

Edited March 5, 2023 by LadyG

[David Mack]

12 minutes ago, LadyG said:

I assumed it was to encourage holidays in the days when hiring a narrowboat was akin to camping, and pre 1966.

No showers back then. There weren't even elsan emptying points. Hire boats were equipped with a folding shovel so you could dig a hole in a field and bury the toilet contents. Sanitary stations were installed from the 1970s. I don't think the showers appeared until the 90s or even 2000s, by which time almost every boat had its own shower.