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Newbie solo; experience needed?


mickyh

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3 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

I think the comment was refering to the 'walkie-talkies' used by couples working the locks, lock wheeling etc.

And very useful they are too - particularly at the likes of Middlewich where you are waiting to go under the bridge and into 'Maureens' lock and have no idea if the lock is empty, or in use, or someone is coming down - yoir crew walk under the bridge and can call you when it is your turn, and the lock ready.

 

Called 'PMR446' they typicaly have around 8 or 16 channels and a range of 3 miles or so (or more depending on the conditions)

 

Motorola TALKABOUT T92 two-way radios | Onedirect.co.uk

 

Might have been useful at one time, but these days when we all carry mobile phones and most of us are on "included minutes" contracts, then the phone is easier and no marginal cost, for the relatively few occasions when boat and crew are out of line of sight and contact is necessary.

Edited by David Mack
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On 21/08/2022 at 16:28, Goliath said:

Just to add: I keep meaning to get myself a life jacket, I boat alone, (including through winter) I think it would be better to be safer than sorry

As I recently said I stood one Christmas, frost on the ground, full winter gear, and I looked down into the lock and thought, if I go in there I won't come out alive.

 

A life jacket is second nature now at all times.  Having taught outdoor pursuits made wearing a LJ pretty normal anyway.

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4 hours ago, LadyG said:

I'm on the Calder and Hebble, 57ft, and some of the locks are short, there is no room for two. Going up the boat sitting diagonally till over the cill at front, when there is 57 ft! something to be alert to when going down! A very kind local lady insisted she and her family would put me through a pair of locks,  Salterhebble basin, and I was very grateful, I don't think the guide books mentioned these shorter locks. 

Looking at the number of hire boats which are in this area, boat handling is quite an easy thing to learn, and just take it easy for a while, well actually best to take it easy all the time, it's supposed to be relaxing, and it generally is uneventful.

Lots of people (including us, several times) take 57' hire boats from Shire Cruisers through Salterhebble with no big problem -- apart from going through solo (not with another boat) and having to move across behind the closed bottom gate to open/close the other one -- and avoiding the cill (obviously) and maybe getting a bit wet.

 

Anything longer (up to 60') takes rather more care, and is not recommended for inexperienced boaters.

 

Edited by IanD
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9 hours ago, David Mack said:

Might have been useful at one time, but these days when we all carry mobile phones and most of us are on "included minutes" contracts, then the phone is easier and no marginal cost, for the relatively few occasions when boat and crew are out of line of sight and contact is necessary.

 

Nothing wrong with using your phones.

We all have different ideas of the best way to achieve things.

For us the £500 / £1000 phones stay on the boat and the £25 radios get taken to the locks, when walking up the Llangollen 'narrows' etc if likely to be required.

 

I have also lost enough hand-held Marine VHF radios climbing on and off boats that my main ones now are the £9* Baofeng VHF radios which can be programmed with all (including the new ones) marine channels, the coastguard channels, the SAR channels and the PMR446 channels, as well as the 2mt 'Ham' channels

 

*I bought a few when several suppliers were having a 'I have the lowest price' fight, they are now around £25 / £30

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51 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Nothing wrong with using your phones.

We all have different ideas of the best way to achieve things.

For us the £500 / £1000 phones stay on the boat and the £25 radios get taken to the locks, when walking up the Llangollen 'narrows' etc if likely to be required.

 

I have also lost enough hand-held Marine VHF radios climbing on and off boats that my main ones now are the £9* Baofeng VHF radios which can be programmed with all (including the new ones) marine channels, the coastguard channels, the SAR channels and the PMR446 channels, as well as the 2mt 'Ham' channels

 

*I bought a few when several suppliers were having a 'I have the lowest price' fight, they are now around £25 / £30

 

 

As a single hander I never understand this need to use walkie talkies, phones etc at locks. I've never failed to transit a lock solo without calling other people on the mobile or a radio while I'm there, but some boaters seem to really need to have long and animated conversations on them! 

 

Although on reflection there have been a couple of occasions over the years when the mobile has been handy to call CRT when a gate would not open properly and I couldn't clear the obstruction myself.

 

 

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16 hours ago, Crewcut said:

I dunno what your budget is but I'd suggest something with a modern engine (kubota or Yanmar based), fixed bed with a proper mattress is an absolute must if you're living on it, have a think about what type of toilet you might find least unpalatable to deal with - in my experience fancy pants electric flushing with a macerator into a large holding tank toilets are anathema but others prefer them to cassette type, with which there's much less to potentially go wrong but you'd need to deal with the waste more often. Forget separator loos if you're tempted, they don't really work on the canals. Reverse layout or not, stern/bow type, fuel & water tankage (especially water, ideally I think I'd be looking for 600 litres plus for FT liveaboard). Heating - again in my experience and opinion keep it simple, maybe a solid fuel stove or drip feed diesel in the middle of the boat (not at one end or the other), maybe if you must a radiator at either end and in the bathroom for occasional use in really cold weather? A lot of it depends on you & how much "luxury" you want, how much stuff you need to have around you, etc. but it's a massive help if you're practical and confident with tools, interested in how engines work, doing a bit of woodwork/DIY, painting and if you enjoy watching people do something on Youtube before having a go at doing it yourself!

 

Really, really try to get your head around 12 & 240 volt electrics, batteries, solar power, use of inverters, etc. on boats. Being a sea boater it was a great surprise to me that many canal boaters seem to me to be obsessed with using domestic 240v appliances whilst cruising/away from shore power on their boat - you can do without 240v appliances and if you do it will be much easier to manage your power on board.

 

Go have a look at some boats to start to get a feel, anything upwards of 40 odd feet. If it was me as a single FT liveaboard I'd be aiming for around 45 - 50 feet but I've lived on much smaller sailboats and been quite happy. Good luck...

Thanks crewcut some good advice.  I’m reasonably practical, having installed a couple of kitchens and a bathroom. I really need to get my head around the electrics; obviously crucial to understand how to deal with winter CCing.  I’m planning on lots of research then some practical experience before taking the plunge.

 

Does anyone have any thought on whether it’s better to start in Winter when it’s quieter or summer when it’s busier, but a little more help with things like solar?

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34 minutes ago, mickyh said:

Thanks crewcut some good advice.  I’m reasonably practical, having installed a couple of kitchens and a bathroom. I really need to get my head around the electrics; obviously crucial to understand how to deal with winter CCing.  I’m planning on lots of research then some practical experience before taking the plunge.

 

Does anyone have any thought on whether it’s better to start in Winter when it’s quieter or summer when it’s busier, but a little more help with things like solar?

 

I'd suggest start in spring to give yourself the longest possible run-up to your first winter...

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2 hours ago, mickyh said:

I really need to get my head around the electrics;

 

Start with my course notes on the subject and ask here or email me with any questions. Hopefully that will give the grounding needed to decide if other sources seem reliable rather than pushing a particular agenda.

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5 hours ago, mickyh said:

 

Does anyone have any thought on whether it’s better to start in Winter when it’s quieter or summer when it’s busier, but a little more help with things like solar?

 

I wouldn't let Winter be a major factor either way. If you see the right boat at the right price in October, go for it. 

As long as the boat systems are working (and critically the stove), Winter's not that big a deal. 

Do make sure the batteries and charging system are running properly- my first batteries were half knackered, and by October I was running the engine for 3 or more hours each day to try to recharge them. And they were still down to 50% charge by 9 or 10pm, and down to 40% or less by the morning, which is bad for lead acids.

If you have a car, its worth hanging onto it for the first few months at least, in case you need to go and buy heavy items like batteries- but that would apply in summer as well.

What I would do for the first few weeks is stay reasonably close to towns most of the time, so you can pick up any stuff you need urgently. 

I spent a few weeks close to Nantwich in my first winter- the towpath there was tarmac, so it was easy, quick, and safe to cycle into town for anything I ran out of. 

Also, get at least 6 bags of coal onto the boat before you move anywhere (maybe from a passing fuel boat)- that will see you through the first few weeks.

Bear in mind most marinas sell coal as well, so its never too far away.  

It partly depends on whether you are still going to be working- in which case the short daylight hours can be a nuisance, and you are always getting back to the boat in the dark (and usually wet).

But if you are semi retired or fully retired, you have all the daylight hours to sort yourself out and the boat. 

Many lock flights don't have volunteers in the depths of winter, but on the plus side there's little traffic so you can take your time and think through all the manouvres in locks. 

You need more warm gear in winter (its surprising just how chilled your body can get when standing more or less still on the back of a boat in a cold winter wind)- so there is that, and the mud is more common (and even rain seems to be as well).

But on the plus side CRT relax the rules a bit (unofficially), and if a place is quiet you might be able to stay for 4 weeks instead of two, so there's less pressure to keep moving. 

You can generally cruise around all day and only see a few boats moving, so there's less chance of collisions and evasive manoeuvres being needed at bridge holes and tight bends, which makes it a bit less stressful. 

The biggest change in winter is probably the isolation. The short days and the cold tend to keep boaters indoors more, so you'll have less chance to start a conversation with other boaters or passers by. 

But on the whole I would want to just get started if I was keen to get into boating, and I wouldn't let winter stop me. It definitely has some negatives, but winter can be a lovely time to cruise. 

 

 

Edited by Tony1
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's funny but after watering up at probably the slowest water point on the system at the Hope and Anchor at Syston, I was clearing my hose away whilst being watched by two lads enjoying their spliff on the towpath, one of whom said to me,"Tell us mate, what's the worst thing about living on a boat?". I thought for a bit and then said,"I'll have to get back to you on that" because I couldn't think of much that bothers me on the canals. At a pinch it'd be emptying the Elsan's but after 9 years of doing so it isn't really a concern, and lumping them around keeps you fit.

 

How would others answer the question?:huh:

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10 hours ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

's funny but after watering up at probably the slowest water point on the system at the Hope and Anchor at Syston, I was clearing my hose away whilst being watched by two lads enjoying their spliff on the towpath, one of whom said to me,"Tell us mate, what's the worst thing about living on a boat?". I thought for a bit and then said,"I'll have to get back to you on that" because I couldn't think of much that bothers me on the canals. At a pinch it'd be emptying the Elsan's but after 9 years of doing so it isn't really a concern, and lumping them around keeps you fit.

 

How would others answer the question?:huh:

I think it is the dirt from the coal, gets everywhere.

Re the cassette I disregarded instructions, I add a bit of diluted blue every time I need to, and close the flap then wash hands and add a bit of scented soapy water. A smelly loo is unnecessary. 

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On 23/08/2022 at 00:13, IanD said:

Lots of people (including us, several times) take 57' hire boats from Shire Cruisers through Salterhebble with no big problem -- apart from going through solo (not with another boat) and having to move across behind the closed bottom gate to open/close the other one -- and avoiding the cill (obviously) and maybe getting a bit wet.

 

Anything longer (up to 60') takes rather more care, and is not recommended for inexperienced boaters.

 

Yes, but Shire Cruisers do provide good training and support to their customers, and they know the boats and the canals very well

It's a different matter for a novice to set off in to the unknown. 

I've been single handing for three years now, and it's not easy with a big boat, the learning curve is steep, might be easier further south , but with no boating background, I'd advise 52 to 55, unless c(r)amping on a 45!

As others have noted, you collect stuff, I now have five toolbags, having started with one, and a fair number of half empty paint tins, a big anchor and chain, several 20 litre containers for diesel, and miscellaneous things under the diner.

Of course I've filled nearly all available spaces, but I'd struggle with anything less than 52.

Edited by LadyG
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12 hours ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

's funny but after watering up at probably the slowest water point on the system at the Hope and Anchor at Syston, I was clearing my hose away whilst being watched by two lads enjoying their spliff on the towpath, one of whom said to me,"Tell us mate, what's the worst thing about living on a boat?". I thought for a bit and then said,"I'll have to get back to you on that" because I couldn't think of much that bothers me on the canals. At a pinch it'd be emptying the Elsan's but after 9 years of doing so it isn't really a concern, and lumping them around keeps you fit.

 

How would others answer the question?:huh:

Emergency stoppages due to lack of maintenance.

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On 22/08/2022 at 22:42, David Mack said:

Might have been useful at one time, but these days when we all carry mobile phones and most of us are on "included minutes" contracts, then the phone is easier and no marginal cost, for the relatively few occasions when boat and crew are out of line of sight and contact is necessary.

We all don't have mobile 'phones and I find my £14.00 (for two) walkie talkies very cheap to run :)

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1 hour ago, Laurie Booth said:

We all don't have mobile 'phones and I find my £14.00 (for two) walkie talkies very cheap to run :)

The advantage of mobile phones is that you can speak to other people.

 

They are very cheap, you can play CandyCrush, order takeaways, find out where the nearest pub that sells craft ale is, and if they have plain crisps or prawn cocktail.

People can contact you from all parts of the UK, including Wales. Probably the EU and US, maybe Hongkong and Singapore.

Edited by LadyG
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2 hours ago, Laurie Booth said:

We all don't have mobile 'phones and I find my £14.00 (for two) walkie talkies very cheap to run :)

I agree, the time taken to dial, it to then connect and ring out and be answered Diana could walk back and talk to me. A walkie talkie,  Press the button and speak, instantaneous

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My mate & I came through 7 locks on the GU last week buddied up with a lovely family of 4. Unusually Mum was on the boat, Dad & 2 daughters were being super organised doing most of the work, one of them going ahead to the next lock to start prepping that. They all had walkie talkies and were having a whale of a time...

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39 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

I agree, the time taken to dial, it to then connect and ring out and be answered Diana could walk back and talk to me. A walkie talkie,  Press the button and speak, instantaneous

 Maybe it’s an old people thing, just travelling with another boat now and just walk back to the boat from the lock to inform of any problems, as never too far away to find it a problem to communicate with the other boat. I often see people a boat length apart talking on them and wonder why, maybe because they have them, they have to use them?

Edited by PD1964
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We had walkie talkies when we started (old kids' set) until o'h dropped one in a lock. Our old deck boards were very rattly so it was quite hard for the steerer to hear someone speaking any distance away. We soon developed hand signals which work well for us. Now have very quiet deck boards but we still use hand signals. 

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1 hour ago, The Gravy Boater said:

While I'm sure you are a paragon of accurate boating at least 50% of people who have ever bumped into me had a Captain's cap on.  I usually bite my tongue but I did once say... "Captain's privilages revoked... hand it over."

I just blame the steerer not following orders

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