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3 way fridge on boat


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4 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

The prices of compressor fridges has reduced dramatically with new entrants into the market.

Who knows how reliable they will be but at ~£200 less than the Dometic or Waeco ones I'm sure they will soon get some buyers and reviews;

 

 

50 Litre 12v Compressor Fridge DC50 Like The DOMETIC WAECO CRX CRE Campervan VW | eBay

 

£419 with free delivery a one year warranty and buying from a 'proper' address (including registered company number and a VAT registration number), I'm giving serious consideration to getting one for the campervan.

You exaggerate.

 

Only £90 less than this Waeco/Dometic

 

https://www.jacksonsleisure.com/dometic/cre50/12volt/campervan/fridge/

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7 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

However, with the price of gas going the way it is it may soon be time for a massive upgrade on such boats

 

I've been saying for years that gas fridges were a brilliant option at a fiver a bottle for gas.

 

I've seen them at fifty quid recently which makes a gas fridge about a tenth as good as it used to be.

 

An electric fridge running from sunshine makes a lot more sense to me - generally speaking, the hotter it is the more solar electric you have available to "burn" ..

Edited by TheBiscuits
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7 hours ago, TheBiscuits said:

An electric fridge running from sunshine makes a lot more sense to me - 

 

Yes, as long as the sun is shining. 

 

It's funny how in the middle of summer people start to think it's going to stay there all year round. 

 

Gas is getting more expensive but my fridge will run for about 2 months on a 13kg gas bottle which is still fine for the amount I'm away from shore power. 

 

Who knows what will happen to the price of gas? It could go down a bit after this energy crisis is over. Nobody really knows. It's about as reliable as the sun coming out. 

Edited by blackrose
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47 minutes ago, blackrose said:

 

Yes, as long as the sun is shining. 

 

 

Well that's not entirely true is it?

 

I've only got 200 watts of solar but that still runs my 12v fridge most days between about May to to September. White cloud is normally no problem, grey cloud contributes some solar but only black cloud and rain are more or less useless for solar.

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11 minutes ago, Lily Rose said:

 

Well that's not entirely true is it?

 

It is true going by the accounts of other solar users I know. I'm only going by what they tell me. I still don't have solar myself. 

 

Anyway, you've said your panels will run your fridge from May to Sept. So what happens after September? That was my point really. 

Edited by blackrose
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7 minutes ago, Lily Rose said:

 

Well that's not entirely true is it?

 

I've only got 200 watts of solar but that still runs my 12v fridge most days between about May to to September. White cloud is normally no problem, grey cloud contributes some solar but only black cloud and rain are more or less useless for solar.

 

 

This is my experience too, but with 560W of solar it used to run my fridge 24/7 March to October with ease. Not 'most days' but every day without fail, rain or shine thanks to the smoothing effect of batteries.

 

On a grey afternoon in December with the rain slashing down however, the solar would fall to 1% of peak harvest on a sunny day in July. Lots of people post stats showing solar drops to 10% in poor conditions, but in my personal experience is that figure is closer to 1%.

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48 minutes ago, blackrose said:

 

Anyway, you've said your panels will run your fridge from May to Sept. So what happens after September? That was my point really. 

 

After September I'm at home or I'm on the boat in the marina plugged in to shorepower or I'm out for a few days cruising for 2 or 3 hours so the engine does most of the charging. Often, even in October, there's still a useful solar top up after I stop.

 

I appreciate that it's different for liveaboards without shorepower in the winter months.

 

My point was that the sun doesn't need to be shining. That seems to be a popular misconception.

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52 minutes ago, Feeby100 said:

How do you vent the fridge 

on moterhome they have vent top and bottom but on boat you cannot ?

At one time Electrolux provided a flue kit that went at an angle between the top of the units and a skin fitting. They drew "bottom air" from the boat. For a while Dometic supplied a balance flue version with a roof mounted terminal.

 

At one time there were hundreds of boats with gas fridges with either no top flue or a locally fabricated version with very few if any deaths associated with them. Typically, if you allow the flame to burn yellow soot builds up inside the unit and eventually produces an eye watering acrid smell. That tends to ensure those who do not service the burner do it then.

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One of the technical objections to gas fridges is they encourage breaching of the very old general safety rule of thumb (from the 70s) of always fitting gas pipes as high as possible in the boat. People like their fridges down at ground floor which means LPG pipework low in the boat, which is in principle never a Good Idea. 

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47 minutes ago, MtB said:

One of the technical objections to gas fridges is they encourage breaching of the very old general safety rule of thumb (from the 70s) of always fitting gas pipes as high as possible in the boat. People like their fridges down at ground floor which means LPG pipework low in the boat, which is in principle never a Good Idea. 

And the old Alde slim boilers were nearly 6 ft tall, so you had no option but to install those with the bottom down at floor level.

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52 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Have a look in the BSS guidance docs there are illustrations and discussion for venting and spark arresting systems.

 

eg

 

 

Screenshot (1483).png

But that is not a standard 3 way fridge, its one modified by Wilderness boats to work with a petrol outboard. I very much doubt you could buy that arrangement today

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8 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

But that is not a standard 3 way fridge, its one modified by Wilderness boats to work with a petrol outboard. I very much doubt you could buy that arrangement today

 

I know - but if you look at the illustration it shows (with text) "Standard Electrolux vent Kit for discharge of combustion gases" which illustrates, and answers Feeby's question :

 

3 hours ago, Feeby100 said:

How do you vent the fridge 

 

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18 minutes ago, David Mack said:

And the old Alde slim boilers were nearly 6 ft tall, so you had no option but to install those with the bottom down at floor level.

 

 

True. And like gas fridges, designed for caravans not boats.

 

 

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On 26/07/2022 at 07:46, Tony Brooks said:

 

Not to the fridge but  a huge difference to your batteries and the required change to your charging regime if you do not intend to wreck your batteries.

 

There is typically no thermostat on the 12V system so it draws about 8 amps 24/7 and you get solid milk and tomatoes. That is close to 200 Ah per day which in turn implies a 400 Ah battery bank JUST FOR THE FRIDGE and then many hours of engine running to recharge. A 12V compressor fridge typically draws less than 50Ah per day.

 

They can be worse than that. The Thetford 3 way fridge on our van uses a continuous 22 amps on 12v!

 

Thankfully it will only run on 12v when the engine is running. When the engine shuts off it immediately switches to either 240v or gas.

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On 29/07/2022 at 07:19, blackrose said:

 

Yes, as long as the sun is shining. 

 

It's funny how in the middle of summer people start to think it's going to stay there all year round. 

 

Gas is getting more expensive but my fridge will run for about 2 months on a 13kg gas bottle which is still fine for the amount I'm away from shore power. 

 

Who knows what will happen to the price of gas? It could go down a bit after this energy crisis is over. Nobody really knows. It's about as reliable as the sun coming out. 

That's why we fitted Gaslow refillable gas bottles to the van.

 

With the cost of equivalent Calor bottles soaring they will pay for themselves in no time at all. We had reckoned on 3 years to pay for themselves but with the recent price hikes for Calor it will be sooner.

 

Our last refill was £14 for a full 11kg bottle.

 

We use a fair bit of gas in the van as we are normally "off grid" so running the fridge, hot water, heating and cooking on gas.

 

That said at this time of year we don't use that much. Our recent 9 day trip to the Isle of Wight used less than half an 11kg bottle, probably about 4.5kg looking at the gauge. That will double come winter when we are using the heating as well.

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10 hours ago, MtB said:

One of the technical objections to gas fridges is they encourage breaching of the very old general safety rule of thumb (from the 70s) of always fitting gas pipes as high as possible in the boat. People like their fridges down at ground floor which means LPG pipework low in the boat, which is in principle never a Good Idea. 

 

The actual connection is to the top of the fridge, so at a similar height to a typical gas cooker,  which are obviously far more widely used.  Of course it is them true that the actual pipework on the fridge extends extends down far further towards the bilge than the connection hose.  However this is also obviously  also true of the pipework on a gas cooker, where the oven burner is also close to the bottom of the boat.  Of course an oven is not being fed with gas all the time, whereas  fridge may be.

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50 minutes ago, alan_fincher said:

 

The actual connection is to the top of the fridge, so at a similar height to a typical gas cooker,  which are obviously far more widely used.  Of course it is them true that the actual pipework on the fridge extends extends down far further towards the bilge than the connection hose.  However this is also obviously  also true of the pipework on a gas cooker, where the oven burner is also close to the bottom of the boat.  Of course an oven is not being fed with gas all the time, whereas  fridge may be.

 

 

Yes I totally agree with all you write. The difference between a fridge and an oven is the fridge runs 24/7 and accumulates dirt dust and crap in the burner and needs removal from its cubbyhole for servicing, which is a right ball-ache as the contents need removing first (milk and liquids at least!), so tends not to get done. 

 

An oven on the other hand probably only gets used at most for an hour a day on average (and often MUCH less), and the burner assembly can be serviced/cleaned (on most) without having to remove the appliance. 

 

 

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1 minute ago, ditchcrawler said:

Silly question, what difference does it make what height the gas pipe is? If the pipe leaks (very unlikely) the gas will come out whatever height it is

 

 

The thinking is, LPG sinks being heavier than air. (A LOT heavier.) 

 

So your schnozzle is far more likely to pick up a leak from a pipe at waist or head level than a leak around your ankles. Gas from a low level leak is thought to find it's way directly into the bilges, undetected.

 

Another but lesser concern is gas pipework installed near the floor is more prone to damage from footwear, brooms etc.

 

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9 hours ago, Feeby100 said:

I going to just get a 2 way fridge save all the worry 

 

Worry about what, and what are a two-way fridges power sources? It is simple to convert a three-way fridge into a two-way by not connecting the 12V circuit. Any fridge that uses gas will be an absorption fridge and those will be far less efficient and thus use more electricity than a 12V or mains compressor fridge.

  • Greenie 2
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22 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Worry about what, and what are a two-way fridges power sources? It is simple to convert a three-way fridge into a two-way by not connecting the 12V circuit. Any fridge that uses gas will be an absorption fridge and those will be far less efficient and thus use more electricity than a 12V or mains compressor fridge.

 

I'm guessing that "his" 2-way is 12vdc & 230vac, rather than Gas and 12vdc, or gas and 230vac.

 

It seems it is the use of gas that is concerning him.

 

Just buy either a 12v OR a 230v fridge and be done with it.

  • Greenie 3
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