Replacing deck boards

[Tony Brooks]

17 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

 

Thanks again, that sounds like a cracking idea, strips of neoprene around the edges on the underside of the board. The soundproofing sheets I fitted have really cut down on the noise (which was pretty loud when I first got the boat), and rubber strips will help even more, as well as lifting the wood a little bit away from the draining water. 

There are vents on both sides of the engine bay so that should be ok. 

I dont suppose you have a link of the sort of thing that would be suitable? I'm guessing softer rubber will just squash down anyway, right? So would it need to be a harder rubber compound? 

 

 

I used self-adhesive closed cell (that bit is important because it is less likely to absorb water) neoprene strip as may be sold for weed hatches. Say about 4 mm thick. I got mine from Hills Rubber in Reading but I am sure Seals+ direct have it in a variety of widths.

 

https://www.sealsdirect.co.uk/shopping.asp?intDepartmentId=1#14

[tree monkey]

27 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

 

That's all very well old fruit, but there are so many commoners on the Llangollen these days, its a rather frightful place. Not like it used to be in the good old days when I started boating in 2020. 

The discerning boater waits until October, by which time the riff raff have departed, and he can cruise to Llangollen and actually find somewhere to park his gin palace.

Or his lager palace, in my case. 

 

This is true

 

[Arthur Marshall]

14 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

I used self-adhesive closed cell (that bit is important because it is less likely to absorb water) neoprene strip as may be sold for weed hatches. Say about 4 mm thick. I got mine from Hills Rubber in Reading but I am sure Seals+ direct have it in a variety of widths.

 

https://www.sealsdirect.co.uk/shopping.asp?intDepartmentId=1#14

I used that round where it sits on the channels. I'm not convinced the soundproofing stuff does much good - i think the old loft insulation sandwiched in pegboard did a better job, but a Lister defeats everything.

[Tony1]

11 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

I used that round where it sits on the channels. I'm not convinced the soundproofing stuff does much good - i think the old loft insulation sandwiched in pegboard did a better job, but a Lister defeats everything.

 

I've no idea if this will help with a Lister, but it made a big difference for a canaline engine.

 

https://www.force4.co.uk/item/Force-4/Acoustic-Class-O-Insulation-Silver-Faced-Box-of-4/D5L

 

It was really intrusively loud with just the hexagrip board, and I could never hear what anyone was saying on the bank, at a lock etc, and it wasn't very pleasant just cruising with it. 

I stuck this stuff underneath the deck board (and later secured it with screws because the adhesive was not strong enough), and it reduced the racket to a tolerable level, and meant I had a chance of understanding thing that people said from the bank.   

I would ideally like to install the same stuff to the underside of the steel plating of the stern deck, and not just underneath the deck board, but to date I haven't bothered. 

I know electric engines are the work of the devil and Jesus himself actually designed the first Lister engine, but I reckon cruising in peace and quiet would be really nice. 

 

 

Edited July 4, 2022 by Tony1

[Quattrodave]

For sound insulation I use 10mm closed cell foam, on top of that the thickest MLV (mass loaded vinyl) you can afford, then 25mm foil faced foam...

[Arthur Marshall]

That's what I used. I too thought of sticking it under the metal,but never got round to it.

[George and Dragon]

4 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Give the edging aluminium channel some thought on two counts.

 

First is water is held between the channel and edge of the board earlier rot/delamination is more likely. so make sure whatever "glue" you use fills all the voids.

 

Secondly, when I screwed aluminium strip around the edge of the board on the top to hide the delaminating and edge rotting board  I found it was lethal in winter. The aluminium trapped rain/dew on the board and if it then froze it was like a skating rink.

Thirdly, you run the risk of corrosion from dissimilar metals, although not as much as on a road vehicle, unless you ensure there is a physical barrier between the aluminium and steel.

 

[Tony Brooks]

13 minutes ago, George and Dragon said:

Thirdly, you run the risk of corrosion from dissimilar metals, although not as much as on a road vehicle, unless you ensure there is a physical barrier between the aluminium and steel.

 

But it is likely to be the aluminium that suffers, rather than the steel.

[George and Dragon]

36 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

But it is likely to be the aluminium that suffers, rather than the steel.

Indeed. But if the ally channel around the deckboard rots away...

[Tony Brooks]

Just now, George and Dragon said:

Indeed. But if the ally channel around the deckboard rots away...

 

I suspect unlikely as any damp is unlikely to be brackish, but that is why I suggested using an angle section rather than U channel. The other thing is if he puts foam under it the ally & steel will not make contact.

[Tony1]

5 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Give the edging aluminium channel some thought on two counts.

 

First is water is held between the channel and edge of the board earlier rot/delamination is more likely. so make sure whatever "glue" you use fills all the voids.

 

Secondly, when I screwed aluminium strip around the edge of the board on the top to hide the delaminating and edge rotting board  I found it was lethal in winter. The aluminium trapped rain/dew on the board and if it then froze it was like a skating rink.

 

 

Tony, I wonder if I could ask for your thoughts on this rubber type of edging for a deck board?

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/123384676630?epid=18024063000&hash=item1cba4cc116:g:QSIAAOSwnRZbpn95

 

My slight concern is about adhesion. Even if I roughen up the inner faces of the rubber, I'm not confident that it will bond to sikaflex well enough to hold it securely to the wood- especially when the board's being hoiked around- so I'm wondering if I might need to use a screw every 30cm or so,  to help hold it in place. 

 

My concern with an L shaped edging trim ( as opposed to a U shaped trim) is that it might not adhere to the hexagrip quite so well as a U trim might do- and especially if its rubber or plastic. An aluminium L shaped trim sounds ok, but again I'd be mostly relying on screws to hold it to the deck board, whereas with a U trim, sikaflex would become more useful.

 

 

Edited July 4, 2022 by Tony1

[Tony Brooks]

Why not try it, in any case the edges of the board will be rough from the sawing unless you intend to plane and sand it. I am not sure that Sikaflex would be the best thing to use for fixing rubber to wood because the rubber will move when you walk on it etc.

 

The other thing to think about is if a rubber section is available to suit the Hexaboard. Too wide and it will not be a good fit, too narrow and you will have to route the edge of the board to reduce its thickness.

Edited July 4, 2022 by Tony Brooks

[Tony1]

6 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

Why not try it, in any case the edges of the board will be rough from the sawing unless you intend to plane and sand it. I am not sure that Sikaflex would be the best thing to use for fixing rubber to wood because the rubber will move when you walk on it etc.

 

The other thing to think about is if a rubber section is available to suit the Hexaboard. Too wide and it will not be a good fit, too narrow and you will have to route the edge of the board to reduce its thickness.

 

Cheers Tony, the board is 18mm wide I believe, so this trim is about 1 or maybe 2mm too wide, so not an ideal fit.

The other option I'm pondering is a better fit, and maybe sturdier against the knocks it will gets when being dropped back into place etc.

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Furniture-Various-Colours-TMW-Profiles/dp/B07N93467M

 

Maybe this plastic trim, combined with a 4mm neoprene strip around the underside of the edges, will be a good combo.

 

[Tony Brooks]

6 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

 

Cheers Tony, the board is 18mm wide I believe, so this trim is about 1 or maybe 2mm too wide, so not an ideal fit.

The other option I'm pondering is a better fit, and maybe sturdier against the knocks it will gets when being dropped back into place etc.

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Furniture-Various-Colours-TMW-Profiles/dp/B07N93467M

 

Maybe this plastic trim, combined with a 4mm neoprene strip around the underside of the edges, will be a good combo.

 

 

Look at the ribs on the inside, they will not make it easy to seal properly. I think that you would do better with just treating the edges.

 

I think that you are overcomplicating things. In about 15 years or so it may be time to edge it in some way for aesthetic reasons.

Edited July 4, 2022 by Tony Brooks

[Richard T]

23 hours ago, BEngo said:

 

Most of the "Marine ply" offered is total carp.  Even the stuff that claims to conform to BS 1088. Far East rubbish. Full of voids, damaged veneers and bonded with boiled rice or summat. Somewhere like Robbins in Bristol or Fitchett  and Woolacot (in Notts IIRC) will sell you real Marine ply, but it will cost an arm and a leg and probably more.

 

Fitchett and Woolacot are long gone - the site in Nottingham is now operated by Brooks timber who bought them in 2002 https://brookstimber.com/about-us/locations/

The service is still very good.

[Tony1]

1 hour ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Look at the ribs on the inside, they will not make it easy to seal properly. I think that you would do better with just treating the edges.

 

I think that you are overcomplicating things. In about 15 years or so it may be time to edge it in some way for aesthetic reasons.

 

Thanks Tony, it does look like its going to be more trouble to fit some trim than the benefits are worth. 

The current board has lasted over 6 years (although its been tatty for about a year), so maybe I can accept that is the expected lifespan- a new board is not a great expense after all, taken every 5 years or so.

 

For sealing the edges, is there an epoxy or other suitable product that might be available from normal DIY stores? 

 

 

[PaulJ]

17 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

 

 

For sealing the edges, is there an epoxy or other suitable product that might be available from normal DIY stores? 

 

 

As you were thinking of going to the expense of trims/adhesive etc then a small pack of Wests will only be similar cost. You could get it Click and Collect from ebay.

Edges will need to be a decent finish though .

[Tony1]

3 minutes ago, PaulJ said:

As you were thinking of going to the expense of trims/adhesive etc then a small pack of Wests will only be similar cost. You could get it Click and Collect from ebay.

Edges will need to be a decent finish though .

 

Thanks Paul, I'll go for that stuff.

So I need to coat the edges of a board that is very roughly 1m by 2m and 18mm thick- would this size do the job?

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/233621130560?hash=item3664e78d40:g:aFcAAOSwP1de6OA3

 

They also sell a 1kg pack, but seems like it might be far too much.

 

 

 

[PaulJ]

22 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

 

Thanks Paul, I'll go for that stuff.

So I need to coat the edges of a board that is very roughly 1m by 2m and 18mm thick- would this size do the job?

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/233621130560?hash=item3664e78d40:g:aFcAAOSwP1de6OA3

 

They also sell a 1kg pack, but seems like it might be far too much.

 

 

 

Probably. Ive never tried working out how much I ever used though as always had it in gallon cans and its been about six/seven years since I last had a real job doing stuff like that 😀

But worse can happen is they will be half finished and you have to order another one .

 

 

[Tony Brooks]

9 hours ago, Tony1 said:

 

Thanks Tony, it does look like its going to be more trouble to fit some trim than the benefits are worth. 

The current board has lasted over 6 years (although its been tatty for about a year), so maybe I can accept that is the expected lifespan- a new board is not a great expense after all, taken every 5 years or so.

 

For sealing the edges, is there an epoxy or other suitable product that might be available from normal DIY stores? 

 

 

 

I have told you  this earlier in this topic. Epoxy, and you have been told West Systems are on maker. I got mine from a chandlery but online might be easier. Otherwise, Endsele or any other cut  end wood sealer. Probably available from most DIY outlets and hardwear shops.

[Tony1]

1 hour ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

I have told you  this earlier in this topic. Epoxy, and you have been told West Systems are on maker. I got mine from a chandlery but online might be easier. Otherwise, Endsele or any other cut  end wood sealer. Probably available from most DIY outlets and hardwear shops.

 

 

Thanks Tony, I was just wondering if there was something I could pick up at say B+Q to seal the wood, rather than ebay.

The problem is I have to use ebay click and collect, which means staying put for say 4 or 5 days depending on how quick the courier is, etc.

There've  been a few times I've ordered a product to be delivered to an ebay collection shop that is about 4 days ahead on my route, so it can work that way, but I'm moving on tomorrow to Pretty Bridge, which is not very handy for any ebay collection shops. 

And in the case of Amazon, you have to get to the shop within say a week of your item arriving there, or it will be sent back. If its an amazon locker you get three days to collect it, so you try to place the order on the right day, and if it gets delayed, or if you're late getting there, you can have a problem. 

So if possible, I try to get stuff from local DIY shops when I know I'll be moving the boat shortly

The other issue is that I wanted to make sure I got exactly the right product, as I'd never heard of West system expoxy before yesterday. 

Its very easy for a relative newbie to get the wrong product sometimes- like I did when I picked up a bottle of marine 16 at the chandlery, and it was the complete, instead of the more effective biocidal type. 

So sometimes double checking the name and details, or even better getting a link to a specific product, will avoid an hour of searching online, and maybe getting the wrong thing as I did with the marine 16. 

I can understand that it must be slightly irritating for folks who have known all this stuff for years, and I can only apologise and ask for your patience if possible, because for someone with little or no knowledge it can be a useful safeguard, and help avoid wasting money. 

 

 

Edited July 5, 2022 by Tony1

[cuthound]

On 04/07/2022 at 13:13, Tony Brooks said:

I think most yards that do boa repairs will cut to size and supply the board you want. You might pay  a bit more, but there won't be any waste. I got mine this way from Calcutt. Otherwise, see if you have a local commercial vehicle body fitter/repairer, they tend to use such board for load floors.

 

And they often have smaller offcuts at very reasonable prices.

[Arthur Marshall]

I've always just used several coats of varnish to seal plywood edges. I Sikaflexed the aluminium edging onto the boards as well as making sure they were a tight fit, had to rout a fraction off the boards. Then a couple of coats of varnish a year or when I remember over the lot.

[LadyG]

5 hours ago, Arthur Marshall said:

I've always just used several coats of varnish to seal plywood edges. I Sikaflexed the aluminium edging onto the boards as well as making sure they were a tight fit, had to rout a fraction off the boards. Then a couple of coats of varnish a year or when I remember over the lot.

Epoxy

[Mike Jordan]

The ply from the DIY shops will, as already stated, turn into puff pastry in record time. I suggest that you consider covering decent quality ply with Flotex carpet glued in place and turned down the edges. Follow that up with alloy angle edges sealed  and fixed in place with stainless screws. This on top of drainage channels not flat steel supports will last very well..

if you can obtain a copy of Waterways World of July 2014 it has an article titled “Keeping The Noise Down” which shows how to fit the deck boards with very effective sound proofing complete with hinges, gas struts, and locks. As you indicated earlier you can do a temporary repair or a proper job that lasts and enhances the appearance and value of the boat.