RCR Fuel Levy

[Arthur Marshall]

13 minutes ago, MichaelG said:

A fixed fee of £15 per call out seems reasonable enough. Although they should commit that in writing to their members as well as including it in their website.

As fuel costs must have been included in their original charges, is it really going to cost an extra fiftenn quid per callout? Although as some may involve seveal visits I suppose it well could. I'd be surprised if fuel ever drops below £1.60 though.

[AndrewIC]

10 minutes ago, pete.i said:

The price of fuel should be going down now. Rishi thingy knocked 5p off the tax, okay it wasn't much but it was never reflected at the pumps. The price of crude is going down but petrol and diesel stays high at the pumps. I call scammers!

Work out the total tax take per litre -  duty and VAT - at prices before Sunak announced the duty cut. Then work out the total tax take now. You’re looking in the wrong place for the scammers.

[1st ade]

1 hour ago, magpie patrick said:

There is a side effect in that demand for delivery drivers has shot up! This is having an impact on other sectors including I believe care work - carers can get paid more driving groceries around than working in care homes

Our refuse collections are falling behind - at one point refuse collectors were being followed around (seriously) by people going "wouldn't you rather earn more cash for less aggro delivering for Tesco" - HGV and LGV drivers are in short supply; part Brexit and part that the grandad rights from 1997 are increasingly hitting the "elderly"*...

 

[ * - when the kids moved house there was a certain "Dad, did you pass your car test before 1997? Cos' if so, you can hire a 7.5 tonner on your licence; we can't". I used to teach people how to handle trailers and "grandad rights from 1997" was in there - somehow it changed from "passed your test recently" to "passed your test in the last 25 years ... I'm old... ]

[Ronaldo47]

When I got to 70, I did sucessfully apply to retain my 7.5 T and minibus entitlements, both of which I had previously made use of. No charge for the official D2 and D4 forms that are required, but it cost me around £140 for my GP and Optician to do the specified medical checks and complete the paperwork (you need a  30 mins GP appointment).  DVLA then paid for three comprehensive health  checkups at local NHS snd private hospitals on a private patient basis (can you come in next week?), so it was well worth the cost. 

[Jim Batty]

4 hours ago, MichaelG said:

... What I have an issue with is a business telling customers that as of next week the cost to you of using our services will increase but we won’t or can’t tell you by how much. How can anyone make an informed decision on whether or not to sign up to a service if they don’t know how much it will cost them. ... Surely a contract was entered into when the membership fee was paid. I agreed to pay X amount, they agreed to provide the cover for 12 months for that fee. 

 

This is what bothers me. A retrospective change to a service agreement, that can come at any time, by any amount deemed a fair profit by a business. Perhaps we'll have another type of, or increased, levy in 6 months time. It all seems pretty Wild West to me.

 

What other subscription providers will add a levy into their service? Magazines costs more to deliver, so a 10% levy might be added to your subscription. Broadband ground support is more expensive, so a fuel levy needs to be added to that subscription. Add another levy to your bi-monthly veg-box delivery. Even digital subscriptions could make a case for a levy, as every business relies on fuel in some way or other. 

 

I think when you agree to pay x in advance for a particular package, the fee should remain x for the duration. How can you decide on the value of the service otherwise?  I think RCR should be modifying the cost of their service/membership packages, not adding ad hoc charges as we go along. Let the customer decide what is fair and what isn't.

 

For balance, this was RCR's follow-up email after they decided how much to levy:

 

Quote

The fuel levy is being applied to all membership levels but will only apply when we attend a callout. A callout is any situation where an engineer has to travel to you and undertake a repair.

 

The Fuel Levy will be set at £15 per callout, this is to keep costs reasonable and easy to apply. As soon as the fuel costs drop back down below £1.60 per ltr we will remove the fuel levy.

 

Our T&Cs state -  ‘We reserve the right to change these terms and conditions and the service provided without notice provided that such changes do not materially adversely affect the provision of your RCR cover.’ . As this is a temporary solution and is a charge for a specific issue and only applied to specific situations it is not classed as adversely affecting your membership cover. However we opted to notify all customers and provide notice for transparency.

 

[Mike Todd]

8 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

 

It still suprises me that Asda can pick, pack and deliver my shopping for the grand sum of £1.

It would cost me £12 in fuel alone to go to my nearest Asda.

 

It still surprises me that Hermes will come and collect my parcels (for delivery) for £1 when it would cost me £3 or £4 in fuel to take them to the drop-off point

I thought that Hermes did not deliver, just the poor subcontractor who carries the cost burden. Same with Uber.

[Arthur Marshall]

As far as RCR goes, I suspect they don't make much from the call-out service, but mostly from refloating sunk boats. I seem to remember them being in a bit of financial trouble a few years back, and personally I'd be sorry to lose the service. 

I'd rather pay the £15 if I need them rather than have it added on the annual charge when I don't. And I think you'll find a lot of businesses whacking prices sky high soon if fuel costs don't come down, which they won't. I think RCR are pretty safe at 1.60.

I definitely envy Peterboat his electrics...

[Rob-M]

I've not received any notification from RCR regarding the fuel levy, is it being applied to all membership levels or only certain ones?

[Alan de Enfield]

It is not unusual to have a price 'surcharge' added at the time of delivery.

 

50 years ago when manufacturing and selling electric cables the cost of copper fluctuated wildly in a matter of a days,. We would base our quotation price on the LME (London Metal Exchange) daily price of copper on the date of the quotation, there would be a rider at the end of the quotation that the 'invoice' price would be based on the LME price at the date of despatch.

 

Copper was the primary cost in the cable and there could be a 20%, 30% or more difference between the quoted price and the invoiced price.

15 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

I thought that Hermes did not deliver, just the poor subcontractor who carries the cost burden. Same with Uber.

 

Same with Amazon and many other courier services.

 

Private individuals using their own cars or vans to make deliveries.

[Mike Todd]

7 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

It is not unusual to have a price 'surcharge' added at the time of delivery.

 

50 years ago when manufacturing and selling electric cables the cost of copper fluctuated wildly in a matter of a days,. We would base our quotation price on the LME (London Metal Exchange) daily price of copper on the date of the quotation, there would be a rider at the end of the quotation that the 'invoice' price would be based on the LME price at the date of despatch.

 

Copper was the primary cost in the cable and there could be a 20%, 30% or more difference between the quoted price and the invoiced price.

 

Same with Amazon and many other courier services.

 

Private individuals using their own cars or vans to make deliveries.

Amazon are increasingly using their own vehicles around us.

[Arthur Marshall]

20 minutes ago, Rob-M said:

I've not received any notification from RCR regarding the fuel levy, is it being applied to all membership levels or only certain ones?

All. I just got an email.

[PeterF]

3 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

All. I just got an email.

Still waiting for an email, I assume there system is dribling them out slowly over the day.

[Alan de Enfield]

14 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

Amazon are increasingly using their own vehicles around us.

 

Not in our rural area not enough people to justify running a Van and the electric ones they are introducing apparentky do not have the range needed to cover the 'vast distances' between drops.

[MtB]

7 hours ago, Midnight said:

Yes increasing membership fees would cost everyone regardless of call outs which isn't fair.

 

Of course it's fair. That's the whole principle of insurance! Pool the cost and divide it up equally amongst the insured. 

 

 

[Arthur Marshall]

23 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Of course it's fair. That's the whole principle of insurance! Pool the cost and divide it up equally amongst the insured. 

 

 

I thought the main principle of insurance was to take your premiums but refuse to pay out.

If this is a temporary thing I think it's fair enough. If it carries on (as I presume it will) they probably will put the fees up. And keep the levy...

[Richard10002]

7 hours ago, pete.i said:

The price of fuel should be going down now. Rishi thingy knocked 5p off the tax, okay it wasn't much but it was never reflected at the pumps. The price of crude is going down but petrol and diesel stays high at the pumps. I call scammers!

 

I heard someone from The RAC the other day saying that they could not find any reason for the price of fuel to continue to increase, given that the wholesale price had stabilised/fallen.

 

Somebody, Somewhere, is having us for a bunch of mugs.

 

I'll be buying from the cheapest local petrol station from now.... even if that means using supermarket fuel for a while. We've already stopped buying Lurpak, (which used to be between £2 and £3 for 500g, whereas it is now £5 and more). Aldi do Norpak which tastes very similar, for £2  

 

If enough people head for the cheapest suppliers, the pressure will be on for them all to reduce prices, because we know that they can.

[David Mack]

2 hours ago, Mike Todd said:

Amazon are increasingly using their own vehicles around us.

Or are they just requiring their independent contractors to use an Amazon-branded vehicle which they lease to the driver (and profit from the lease arrangement)?

Edited July 1, 2022 by David Mack

[Ianws]

8 hours ago, AndrewIC said:

Work out the total tax take per litre -  duty and VAT - at prices before Sunak announced the duty cut. Then work out the total tax take now. You’re looking in the wrong place for the scammers.

Yep. How much extra VAT has been taken while prices are so high?

[Richard10002]

26 minutes ago, Ianws said:

Yep. How much extra VAT has been taken while prices are so high?

In reality, up to a certain date, not much extra VAT - For every 10p increase in fuel price, VAT increases by 1.67p. So when fuel increased from £1.35p to £1.75p per litre, (a 40p increase), the VAT increased by 6.68p. IIRC, Sunak gave us about 5p back on a litre, so pretty much all of the increased VAT take at the time...... Whether this has been passed on by the sellers is debated.

 

Obviously, now that fuel has increased to over £1.90, (say £1.95 per litre), Sunak is collecting a further 3.34 per litre, which he has not yet deigned to give back to us. He may, or may not, do so, at some time in the future.

[frangar]

How unusual for RCR to make some cash from fleecing the gullible......

[Jim Batty]

Red diesel from our local fuelboat was £1.45/ltr today. Never thought I'd appreciate paying sub-£1.50 for the stuff! 

[MtB]

On 01/07/2022 at 23:00, Richard10002 said:

In reality, up to a certain date, not much extra VAT - For every 10p increase in fuel price, VAT increases by 1.67p. So when fuel increased from £1.35p to £1.75p per litre, (a 40p increase), the VAT increased by 6.68p. IIRC, Sunak gave us about 5p back on a litre, so pretty much all of the increased VAT take at the time...... Whether this has been passed on by the sellers is debated.

 

 

Never mind the extra VAT, are you implying the fuel duty element remains static? Or does it, like the VAT, rise proportionally with the base price of the fuel? 

 

I've an idea that something like 50% of what we pay for road fuel goes straight to the chancellor.  

[Arthur Marshall]

14 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Never mind the extra VAT, are you implying the fuel duty element remains static? Or does it, like the VAT, rise proportionally with the base price of the fuel? 

 

I've an idea that something like 50% of what we pay for road fuel goes straight to the chancellor.  

I think it's static, currently about 52p a litre. The Vat is is 20%, so on a £2 a litre it would be about 90p to the government, so you're right. Almost half the cost is tax. Makes you realise how lucky we are to have a party in power that believes in low taxation, don't it?

[MtB]

9 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

I think it's static, currently about 52p a litre. The Vat is is 20%, so on a £2 a litre it would be about 90p to the government, so you're right. Almost half the cost is tax. Makes you realise how lucky we are to have a party in power that believes in low taxation, don't it?

 

Makes ya wonder what the other lot would be adding to fuel duty, dunnit!!!

[Richard10002]

39 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Makes ya wonder what the other lot would be adding to fuel duty, dunnit!!!

 Firstly I should say that, until the recent council elections, my vote was made in a way that stood a chance of keeping "the other lot out". 

 

I seem to recall Sunak agreeing with a TV interviewer that we now had the highest tax for many decades. I think he said "Yes..... but.....   " followed by some utter bollocks.

 

So I'm not sure there can be any criticism of "the other lot" with respect to tax, "compared to the current lot".

Edited July 4, 2022 by Richard10002