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Overplating of swim on the stern


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Way back in this conversation when I mentioned a narrow beam canal cruiser I specifically linked it to  a holiday boat and NOT a live-aboard.

 

Most steel narrowboats have a gap between the cabin inner lining and steel cabin side, ditto the  ceiling and roof. This often already contains thermal insulation or where insulation can be fitted. Few GRP  cruisers are like this so with someone living aboard will suffer horribly from condensation in winter. It is not a simple job to fit insulation to a GRP canal cruiser because it already has a narrow interior and ding so will make it narrower and you will have to organise a serviceable inner cabin lining.

 

Next heating. The most popular form of live-aboard heating on a steel narrowboat is a solid fuel stove. As GRP canal cruisers are usually smaller finding space to safely fit a stove, properly insulated and with a large enough gap between GRP and stove, is far more difficult. That leaves GRP boats with either gas or diesel powered heaters, often blown warm air or a wet central heating system.  These are less reliable than a solid fuel stove and also tend to use a lot of  electricity and the latter can all too easily become a problem unless the boat can  be connected to a shoreline, usually in a marina at a greater cost.

 

If the boat is not in a marina or a mooring with a shoreline then I can almost guarantee electricity will be a problem, especially in winter. CaRT say do not run engines (for battery charging/hot water) between 8pm and 8am. Marinas are likely to have similar rules. At the price point you seem to be looking at the batteries will be lead acid, and they need charging to some degree every day and fully charging once a week if you are to get more than a few week's life out of them - hence the need for a shore-line charger that can be left charging 24/7 AND supplying all the 12V loads. Solar charging will help a little in summer but not for winter. It is very doubtful if a narrowbeam GRP cruiser will have enough roof  space for sufficient solar to even cover the summer months, especially the wide beam one's Old Goat mentions.

 

Experience tells me this idea is born from a critical lack of in depth knowledge of boating and suggests that for the purpose you stated you forget it. I can all too easily see the whole thing turning into a nightmare and money pit.

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Thanks so much everyone, this thread has been very insightful!  It seems the options are to spend £10k-£20k on a steel walled narrow boat to do up or forget the idea. 
 

This is going to need some serious thought! It still may be preferable to throwing tens of thousands of the family coffers down the drain on rent, but it’s a large chunk to find. 
 

Time for a good think….

 

My daughter is also off the uni this September, (5year vet course in Nottingham, fingers crossed). If we could get the boat ready in time for her second year then she can live on it too, perhaps with a pal or two. When she finishes her course, my son should be starting uni a few months later so we could sail it to his area.  For my daughter rent is costing £170 a week, which we have to pay for 30 weeks of the year. We may still be quids in with a narrow boat. 

Edited by Zanyzoya
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17 minutes ago, Zanyzoya said:

Thanks so much everyone, this thread has been very insightful!  It seems the options are to spend £10k-£20k on a steel walled narrow boat to do up or forget the idea. 
 

This is going to need some serious thought! It still may be preferable to throwing tens of thousands of the family coffers down the drain on rent, but it’s a large chunk to find. 
 

Time for a good think….

i thought that students get a loan to pay their university expenses, I can't imagine thousands get a boat and live on it for three years while trying to study in difficult circumstances.

Putting it bluntly, it's not a good idea.

These days a half decent small boat will be £25 to £40k, and project boats at half those prices could easily cost £10K to make comfortable. Money which you may or may not get back. Living in a marina is expensive, living on the cut is extremely difficult, and not cheap.

 

 

 

 

Edited by LadyG
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30 minutes ago, LadyG said:

i thought that students get a loan to pay there university expenses, I can't imagine thousands get a boat and live on it for three years while trying to study.

Putting it bluntly, it's not a good idea.

These days a half decent boat will be £25 to £40k, and project boats at half those prices could easily cost £10K to make comfortable. Money which you may or may not get back.

 

 

 

 

Edited by Zanyzoya
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If the target is accommodation during term time at low cost then it might be worth considering an old touring caravan on a pitch that provides an electrical hookup and allows any living there any X months in a year. The holidays taking acre of the non-living months. I know some of my son's college friends did this in the Wakefield area, but that was a number of years ago. However, site fees will also add up just like marina fees. I fear a caravan would still get squalid and damp during the winter.

 

It depends upon what he wants to study, but it seems many can now get a degree level qualification via the apprenticeship route (with the right company). He will also end up with his qualification and, more importantly, practical experience that  would expect any potential new employer to value. That would give him an income, and he might be able to live at home or with a  relative.

Edited by Tony Brooks
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On 24/06/2022 at 19:45, Zanyzoya said:

The purchase price of the boat is £3500,

 

At this trivial price, I'd suggest just buying the boat and getting on with some boating. Don't spend anything on 'doing it up', wait for something critical to go wrong then sell it for a pittance and buy something else.

 

 

 

On 24/06/2022 at 19:45, Zanyzoya said:

plus and extra £3500 for a reconditioned Lister SR2 2 cylinder engine, 2-1 reduction gearbox and prop (also from same seller).  The mechanical bits above need fitting (which my hubby can do).

 

Ah right. This now sounds suspicious as hell, unless you can be persuaded about why the seller does not fit this supposedly reconditioned engine and flog the boat for say, £15k-£20k as doer-upper with a good engine. (There is a ready market for 45ft Springers needing 'just a bit of overplating'.)

 

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53 minutes ago, Zanyzoya said:

Thanks so much everyone, this thread has been very insightful!  It seems the options are to spend £10k-£20k on a steel walled narrow boat to do up or forget the idea. 
 

This is going to need some serious thought! It still may be preferable to throwing tens of thousands of the family coffers down the drain on rent, but it’s a large chunk to find. 
 

Time for a good think….

 

My daughter is also off the uni this September, (5year vet course in Nottingham, fingers crossed). If we could get the boat ready in time for her second year then she can live on it too, perhaps with a pal or two. When she finishes her course, my son should be starting uni a few months later so we could sail it to his area.  For my daughter rent is costing £170 a week, which we have to pay for 30 weeks of the year. We may still be quids in with a narrow boat. 

As well as the purchase price of the narrowboat plus the money spent doing it up you need to factor in the running costs.

 

The annual licence will be getting on for a £1000, mooring fees will likely be double that or more. Then there are energy costs which will depend on how the boat is setup and where it is moored, but likely to be over a thousand. Plus insurance, maintenance, repairs and anything else I've forgotten.

 

Rent at £170 a week for 30 weeks is £5100, I'm guessing that's uni accommodation which will be inclusive of bills. I doubt that living on a boat would make a significant saving on that, and could well cost more.

 

Plus there is extra work involved in living on a boat, toilets need emptying, water tanks need filling, solid fuel needs to be loaded on to the boat, gas bottles need changing etc.

 

Choosing to live on a boat just to save money isn't a good idea, especially if your trying to do a degree at the same time.

Living on a boat because you want to and because you'll enjoy it is a different thing.

 

 

 

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56 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

At this trivial price, I'd suggest just buying the boat and getting on with some boating. Don't spend anything on 'doing it up', wait for something critical to go wrong then sell it for a pittance and buy something else.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Maybe good advice for an experienced boater but this is patently a novice. Considering that the OP has also indicated that the intention may be to use it as a houseboat for  her two children over an extended period I don't consider that this advice is realistic.

 

Howard

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11 minutes ago, howardang said:

Maybe good advice for an experienced boater but this is patently a novice. Considering that the OP has also indicated that the intention may be to use it as a houseboat for  her two children over an extended period I don't consider that this advice is realistic.

 

Howard

 

 

I would never advise a novice-boater to attempt to live on ANY 45ft narrowboat with two children.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by MtB
Fiddle with the grammar.
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57 minutes ago, Barneyp said:

As well as the purchase price of the narrowboat plus the money spent doing it up you need to factor in the running costs.

 

The annual licence will be getting on for a £1000, mooring fees will likely be double that or more. Then there are energy costs which will depend on how the boat is setup and where it is moored, but likely to be over a thousand. Plus insurance, maintenance, repairs and anything else I've forgotten.

 

Rent at £170 a week for 30 weeks is £5100, I'm guessing that's uni accommodation which will be inclusive of bills. I doubt that living on a boat would make a significant saving on that, and could well cost more.

 

Plus there is extra work involved in living on a boat, toilets need emptying, water tanks need filling, solid fuel needs to be loaded on to the boat, gas bottles need changing etc.

 

Choosing to live on a boat just to save money isn't a good idea, especially if your trying to do a degree at the same time.

Living on a boat because you want to and because you'll enjoy it is a different thing.

 

 

 

Maybe the grand plan wasn’t so grand after all. Ah well it was worth considering. Thanks for all your help. 

21 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

 

I would never advise a novice-boater to attempt to live on ANY 45ft narrowboat with two children.

 

 

 

 

 

The two ‘children’ will be 18+, it would be for them to live on whilst at university 🤣

Edited by Zanyzoya
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I realise that the OP's question is regarding the Q of overplating the swim on a Springer, not knowing the cost but understanding that the hull is on offer for 3.5k, I suggest running, not walking from such a can of worms. It's a project for the few experienced people ready to take a chance, and with the resources and contacts to sort it out. The Highbridge mentioned is a good boat for leisure use, GRP's easier to maintain than steel, but hard to insulate and keep warm and dry in the winter.

 

Despite the fact that I would have loved to have lived on a posh boat back in the mists of time when I was at uni, and considering that in 2nd year we had  a student house that was falling down and resembled the Young Ones' place, doing so just wouldn't have been practical.

 

Firstly, it really restricts the choice of university to ones with decent, secure, affordable moorings close to the place of study

Secondly, it is year round accommodation. November, early Dec, late Jan, Feb not being the warmest months and generally times when students have to be on campus. A good boat, able to supply the comfort, warmth and power for winter living will not be cheap to purchase, and as said the running costs are significant, especially near to a popular city location.

 

Even if I had gone to a uni with good canal moorings, the family leisure narrowboat we had at the time would have needed some serious power generation additions for running student essentials of fridge, computer, TV, stereo, phone charger etc a lot of the time.

As it was, I ended up at a uni with a river and no cabin boats, just rowing boats. Sometimes I wonder if a camping skiff might not have been an improvement on our second year rathole. Thankfully, university accommodation nowadays does seem to be a lot more habitable.

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4 minutes ago, Zanyzoya said:

Maybe the grand plan wasn’t so grand after all. Ah well it was worth considering. Thanks for all your help. 

The two ‘children’ will be 18+ 🤣

Even worse!!!

 

You are massively underestimating the cost of living aboard and have no comprehension of the lifestyle required. It is not compatible with students devoting their time to drinking, partying and a little occasional study.

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15 minutes ago, Zanyzoya said:

The two ‘children’ will be 18+, it would be for them to live on whilst at university 🤣

 

 

Christ on a bike, that will be even more of a disaster.

 

Two students in a 45ft NB paid for by parent, I can't see them even attempting to comply with the CC rules in summer (too much studying to move the boat compliantly mum!) Plus the partying aboard is gonna really hack off any neighbouring boats if you decide to shell out £5k a year on a resi mooring near a decent uni.

 

And never mind them having the interest needed to manage the batteries!!

 

 

 

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18 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

 

Christ on a bike, that will be even more of a disaster.

 

Two students in a 45ft NB paid for by parent, I can't see them even attempting to comply with the CC rules in summer (too much studying to move the boat compliantly mum!) Plus the partying aboard is gonna really hack off any neighbouring boats if you decide to shell out £5k a year on a resi mooring near a decent uni.

 

And never mind them having the interest needed to manage the batteries!!

 

 

 

 OP could think outside the box

)1 Move to a university town, buy a big old house, fill it with students, rake in the rent.

2) Tell own children to go to university close to home and let them stay at home.

 

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4 hours ago, Zanyzoya said:

For my daughter rent is costing £170 a week, which we have to pay for 30 weeks of the year. We may still be quids in with a narrow boat. 

My daughter bought a house in Liverpool while doing a Masters. The deposit was paid from earnings saved over two years working, and the mortgage repayments on a three bedroom terraced house are less than the rent for a single room in a shared house. She chooses to live alone, but could easily more than cover her costs by letting the spare bedrooms to fellow students.

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18 minutes ago, David Mack said:

My daughter bought a house in Liverpool while doing a Masters. The deposit was paid from earnings saved over two years working, and the mortgage repayments on a three bedroom terraced house are less than the rent for a single room in a shared house. She chooses to live alone, but could easily more than cover her costs by letting the spare bedrooms to fellow students.

What a fantastic idea! At least she he has something to show for her money at the end, other than the qualification of course 🤣

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8 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Kick the kids out to stand on their own two feet. Then the parents can have a life of their own at last.

What? Parents choose to have kids and then absolve themselves of any responsibilities?

 

Tuition fees are now £9.5k pa alone, on a loan. You, me, and our our peers, weren't loaded with those for a start.

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7 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

 

Once they hit the age of majority, why on earth not? 

 

 

Why? Because parents who are always there for their kids may hope to have them there when they are in their later years. Parents who have told their kids to sod off may not have that support.

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9 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Kick the kids out to stand on their own two feet. Then the parents can have a life of their own at last.

I was only partially serious. Of course.

 

Don't bank on the kids looking after you in your dotage, I outlasted mine.

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25 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

I was only partially serious. Of course.

 

Don't bank on the kids looking after you in your dotage, I outlasted mine.

 

That's very sad. My sincere condolences, despite not knowing you or them.

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12 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

I was only partially serious. Of course.

 

Don't bank on the kids looking after you in your dotage, I outlasted mine.

Sad to hear that. 

I have three older kids, and if I lost one I would be devastated.

No parent should have to bury their kids, it should be the other way around.

My sympathy.

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