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Josephine- DIY replating and full fitout of a 70s Hancock and Lane narrowboat


harrybsmith

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14 minutes ago, harrybsmith said:

Updates... This will probably be a multi-part update because of the upload limit, so bear with. 

 

 

Wow what an elegant boat! Always liked them, I'd LOVE to have one!

 

 

image.png.918437c384f4c463d35a0b18182833b9.png

 

 

The only thing missing is s set of bridge bars, as shown in the other boat HERMES photo. I'm ambivalent about them though. They'd go so well with the boat but must be a right PITA to cruise with, making it bloomin' awkward to get on and off the bow with the bow line. 

 

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4 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

My 1st Mate broke 2 ribs on the bridge bars when we were delivering one. He jumped into the well deck but slid.

 

Reminds me of the time on the Thames when I returned to the boat to find some scrotes had pulled the mooring stakes and chucked them in. Boat was only still there by luck as I'd caught a twig on the tree we'd moored under in the side doors when I closed them! 

 

I took a running jump to leap the gap (maybe 8ft) onto the boat and made it into the well deck, but crunched my ribs good and hard on the far side of the well. Had it been a tug deck I'd have gone straight over in to the river with nothing to stop me.

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1 hour ago, Bee said:

Bl***y H**l!!!!!  What've you done to it now!!!  Ten out of ten for courage! Actually, filling that hole in could be awkward, You might find that making a hardboard template or two from the existing side could make the job easier but I would hesitate to offer any advice to someone who clearly is tackling something that would scare the pants off me.

 

I promise you, it's really easy. Let me show you how...  

 

With the top left corner of the sheet tacked in, the bottom of the sheet could then be pulled in to match the bottom of the hull side where it meets the baseplate. This was done (as ever) by welding an eyelet on the inside and pulling it into shape with a chain hoist, then tack it into place 

 

20230217_154307-min.jpg.c9b6012c2eb523cb707a161b4156f65c.jpg

 

With that in place the front of the sheet can then be pulled round the existing bow, and used as a ruler to run a grinder along to ensure the plate fits spot on. The original hole is deliberately undersized and is effectively just cut for access. You'd be stunned at how little force it took to bend it, I could get it most of the way round by simply leaning on it. 

 

20230217_163943-min.jpg.f6e7b2fb2e7a4aee534d19fef7c7fa53.jpg

 

When the grinder has been run along it a pretty decent level of fit-up is achieved. Note the pitting above where the new steel is going in. It's a bit annoying but it's well above the waterline, i'm contemplating the best way to fill it in, possibly an epoxy fairing filler, possibly lead loading, open to suggestions

 

 

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Part 3 soon...

 

Oh, and the fitment of bridge guards is a non-negotiable yes in my book, they look flippin great and they'll serve a 2nd purpose on the edges of my tug deck (whick you might be able to guess from a background theme in earlier posts...) 

 

 

(Edited due to weird duplicate)

 

Edited by harrybsmith
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Part 3- Hole removed. 

 

If you continue running the grinder along the top of the sheet then eventually you reach the stem bar. At that point you should stop, and your work should look something like this

 

20230218_103217-min.jpg.f327de009118e6bb24bfe013cb95f115.jpg

 

At which point simply trace a line off the stem bar, cut down it, pull the bottom in and job done! I'll seam weld this up soon, but I was fortunate enough to have "the apprentice" helping out (My dad) and it's not the most entertaining thing to stand around and watch someone wave sparklers about, so we went to the pub. 

 

20230218_110017(1)-min.jpg.87657d24ca5c8640a15b8a738d769264.jpg

 

The observant among you will note a gaping triangular hole under the plate, this forms naturally when the plate bends round. Originally the shell builder filled this in to give a flat baseplate, and this was my plan, however another way of doing it is to jack the baseplate up to meet it. Seeing how rusty the bottom 2" of the stem bar was sealed the deal for me, and i'll be bringing the baseplate up once i've done the other side. A lot of boats are done like this, i've a sneaky suspicion it might make more wash but if it's really terrible it would be easy enough to rework at a later date as there will only be water tank behind it. 

 

 

 

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The pitting above the new bit is right where it will get clouted by bridge holes, lock mouths and the like.  Epoxy filler will not like it at all.  Nor am I sure that if you leaded it you will be able to get the steel clean enough to get a proper tinning for the lead.  If you can it should be flexible enough  but will dent very easily.

You could either overplate the area and fair the edges very carefully or just lay down a pad of heavy runs of  weld and fair them off with a grinder.  A good way to use up a box of odd or not well kept rods.

Or, as it is mainly  along a guard iron run, a BCN style wide guard over it all.

 

N

Edited by BEngo
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4 minutes ago, harrybsmith said:

 

The observant among you will note a gaping triangular hole under the plate, this forms naturally when the plate bends round. Originally the shell builder filled this in to give a flat baseplate, and this was my plan, however another way of doing it is to jack the baseplate up to meet it. Seeing how rusty the bottom 2" of the stem bar was sealed the deal for me, and i'll be bringing the baseplate up once i've done the other side. A lot of boats are done like this, i've a sneaky suspicion it might make more wash but if it's really terrible it would be easy enough to rework at a later date as there will only be water tank behind it. 

 

 

I was wondering if you'd spotted that triangular hole. 

 

My last boat was quite deep drafted and built with the baseplate flat and the triangle infilled (rather than the baseplate jacked up as most new boats seem to have), and it actually a bit of a pain. The extra 6" of draft right at the pointy bit meant I sometimes couldn't put the bow in as close as I'd have liked to the bank when single handing. Or rather, with the jacked up baseplate style I'd have been able on occasions to get 2ft closer in which I'd have preferred. So basically I'm suggesting you jack up your baseplate rather than infill the gap. Means you'll need a bit less ballast at the bow too, once you're afloat. 

 

 

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4 hours ago, MtB said:

 

 

Wow what an elegant boat! Always liked them, I'd LOVE to have one!

 

 

image.png.918437c384f4c463d35a0b18182833b9.png

 

 

The only thing missing is s set of bridge bars, as shown in the other boat HERMES photo. I'm ambivalent about them though. They'd go so well with the boat but must be a right PITA to cruise with, making it bloomin' awkward to get on and off the bow with the bow line. 

 

 

Indeed, I only hired one boat with bridge bars, that was enough.

 

The way they curve means that it is very difficult to judge exactly where they are, so that you frequently bang your head on them, often painfully,when trying to get on or off at the bow.

Edited by cuthound
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Hi

 

Only just seen this thread... great to see she will be coming back to life

 

It was built by Fernie Steel Fabrications (of Fernie Road, Market Harborough) and I believe was fitted by Blisworth Tunnel Boats who first ran her, new for 1975 (in orange gunwhales/roof and white sides).

 

When Black Prince took over at Blisworth she then stayed with them for a number of years and went into the blue & yellow colours

 

Here is the other info I have on her, from when I was running the Black Prince owners/info site

 

Dan

 

The pictures are:

Another boat from the Blisworth Tunnel fleet in 1975 to illustrate her original colours

The 1979 Black Prince (B & W) brochure entry (The first year under their command I believe)
Her failing to make the turn at Norton Junction in the '80s, that I was sent

Josephine 1979 29.jpg

Josephine colours Hoseasons 1975 2.jpg

lady_josephine 80s.jpg

Edited by DanH
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@DanH Thank you so much for that! Amazing archive material 

 

I think I've just decided on my colour scheme too, back into original orange and white, which is actually startlingly similar to my current boat but a nice nod to the past. 

 

I don't feel guilty for chopping her about to get the boat I want, but one day I might do a historically accurate resto on one, they're just as much a part of canal heritage as any ex-carrying NB. 

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54 minutes ago, harrybsmith said:

@DanH Thank you so much for that! Amazing archive material 

 

I think I've just decided on my colour scheme too, back into original orange and white, which is actually startlingly similar to my current boat but a nice nod to the past. 

 

I don't feel guilty for chopping her about to get the boat I want, but one day I might do a historically accurate resto on one, they're just as much a part of canal heritage as any ex-carrying NB. 

 

Just looking through again, are you sure that your boat is the one in the BP brochure

 

I just ask because the window arrangement as was doesn't look to match, unless there is evidence of previous changes/weld ups?

 

Also, is she definately 50ft, as the Lady class/Josephine I mention and you found in the brochure is 54ft.

 

Do you know your reg number?  The ex Black Prince one I showed is 67991

 

Your boat is definately a Fernie build, but if the above is not true then we may need to dig deeper to figure out her former/original identity!

 

Dan

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5 minutes ago, DanH said:

 

I just ask because the window arrangement as was doesn't look to match, unless there is evidence of previous changes/weld ups?

 

 

The small (bathroom) window is definitely in the wrong place in the 1980s brochure, however, Black Prince regularly sell off their boats(always have done), and use the girls names many times. We have a Jenny coming in soon, but it's not the present BP jenny, or any of the preceding 3....

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17 minutes ago, matty40s said:

The small (bathroom) window is definitely in the wrong place in the 1980s brochure, however, Black Prince regularly sell off their boats(always have done), and use the girls names many times. We have a Jenny coming in soon, but it's not the present BP jenny, or any of the preceding 3....

 

They do, but as Josephine has only been used by them on a 30ft boat before here it is more mistaken identity or by someone other than BP using a similar name on a similar boat

 

I don't think the boat is the Josephine (Lady class) that Black Prince ran, so whether any previous names can be seen is probably the hopeful identifier, especially with the interior having gone, and so too any possible pointers

 

Dan

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Wow, the plot thickens. You are indeed correct about windows

 

My Reg number is 62740, although it's registered as a Hancock and Lane, so whether it's on its original reg or not I don't know 

 

It is categorically 50ft, (Well, 49ft 11" without fenders) and there was no evidence of cabin work before I got my welder out... 

 

There is yellow paint under the red, although I hadn't found the orange pictured earlier, I think the roof has always been blue 

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4 minutes ago, harrybsmith said:

Wow, the plot thickens. You are indeed correct about windows

 

My Reg number is 62740, although it's registered as a Hancock and Lane, so whether it's on its original reg or not I don't know 

 

It is categorically 50ft, (Well, 49ft 11" without fenders) and there was no evidence of cabin work before I got my welder out... 

 

There is yellow paint under the red, although I hadn't found the orange pictured earlier, I think the roof has always been blue 

It is a very old reg that, from around the time they introduced them (reg's came in about 1979)

 

The Hancock and Lane bit is just wrong

 

The shell builder is Fernie.  However, who fitted her or ran her is now not known

 

CRT may be able to give you information on it's previous names.  Sally Ash at British Waterways (as it was then) looked in the archives for me to supply previous names of some boats in the early 80's by reg number, which may help us pinpoint where/what she was if you let me know if you do this.  However, that was back in 2009 so whether she is still there, or able to be as helpful as she was then I do not know

 

Dan

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  • 1 month later...

Well @MtB, you just had to jinx it didn't you... I had a couple of days free, which just at the moment is something of a rarity. Did I do my own boat as would be sensible? No, of course not. I got suckered into building a cabin (or half of one so far) for the boat next door. Bums. 

 

 

 

Screenshot_20230322-195126_Gallery.jpg.d9113df770331a73c06f2745ae40fda7.jpg

 

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Screenshot_20230322-195117_Gallery.jpg.ee84154b062c8788e9693587691de823.jpg

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  • 3 weeks later...
  • 1 month later...

I'm impatiently waiting for the boatyard to get their bloomin crane working and give me a date it can be moved to another yard! I went to see it yesterday, update is it's still there, as was the dog, who looked dejected I had no sausages for him. 

 

To keep you all amused here's my proposed interior rough fitout, for your critique 

 

WIN_20230521_14_24_42_Pro.thumb.jpg.efc9b1d77cf3faab86778f90deaaeedd.jpg

Oh, another thing i'm impatiently waiting for is the sale of my current liveaboard boat, i've lost 3 weekends and 4 days off work to people who turn up and say ridiculous things like "the windows are too big for me" or "oh I thought living on a boat was free" when they ask about the costs. It's going on a brokerage at the end of next weekend if it hasn't sold, i'll let the professionals deal with it. 

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  • 4 weeks later...
On 21/05/2023 at 14:26, harrybsmith said:

I'm impatiently waiting for the boatyard to get their bloomin crane working and give me a date it can be moved to another yard! I went to see it yesterday, update is it's still there, as was the dog, who looked dejected I had no sausages for him. 

 

To keep you all amused here's my proposed interior rough fitout, for your critique 

 

WIN_20230521_14_24_42_Pro.thumb.jpg.efc9b1d77cf3faab86778f90deaaeedd.jpg

Oh, another thing i'm impatiently waiting for is the sale of my current liveaboard boat, i've lost 3 weekends and 4 days off work to people who turn up and say ridiculous things like "the windows are too big for me" or "oh I thought living on a boat was free" when they ask about the costs. It's going on a brokerage at the end of next weekend if it hasn't sold, i'll let the professionals deal with it. 

You need to ask a few questions, to find out what they want.

I had some silly girl came to look at a small beauty room to rent in my spa, she said "it won't suit, it's painted white"!

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9 hours ago, LadyG said:

You need to ask a few questions, to find out what they want.

I had some silly girl came to look at a small beauty room to rent in my spa, she said "it won't suit, it's painted white"!

 

You have a Spa in your bote???!!!!

 

I have to say, I prefer the Co-Op.

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8 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

You have a Spa in your bote???!!!!

 

I have to say, I prefer the Co-Op.

A previous life, it was a beauty saloon, just felt spa was modern equivalent!

I could have done with a paddling pool in the well deck today.

Edited by LadyG
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Updates! Contrary to popular belief I've not been slacking, ran out of cash or given up and emigrated, I just had a few other priorities. 

 

My other boat is now sold, if I'm honest to exactly the type of buyer I didn't really want. I put in the advert "your best negotiating tactic is to turn up and tell me the history of GRP boats on canals (and bring biscuits)" hoping to encourage some research beforehand.  Sadly that wasn't the case at all, the buyer bought it blind, didn't take on board what I'd said on the handover day I set aside then ran out of diesel, and was told by a certain company it needed a new engine.  What a saga...

 

20230617_220458.thumb.jpg.752eddc9e55221bb2bcd092a1af93e0d.jpg

 

One thing I have been doing while waiting for transport/cranage is putting a cabin on a friend's boat that was next door to mine. Note was, and the lack of my boat next to it, the move has happened! 

 

First proper work weekend next weekend, very excited to be back at it 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Back at it! Productive weekend with plenty more in the pipeline now, life reconfigured for the better. 

 

Finished off the welding of the plate that I put in last time, and welded up inside the bow (inc fitting the scantlings) as the next major step will be to make and fit the tug deck 

 

WhatsAppImage2023-06-25at22_12_31.jpeg.b7871e5d6ebdf9e139fddecd747546e3.jpeg

 

WhatsAppImage2023-06-25at22_13_01.jpeg.4f273c26c7cd021074befb772816b503.jpeg

 

WhatsAppImage2023-06-25at22_13.01(1).jpeg.74d737c61f78f54a956d9c4d1981ee6e.jpeg

 

 

The new boatyard* is quite different to the old one, this is a far more involved project than most people have seen done here so they all think i'm a fruitcake

 

*You may recognise where it is, please don't mention it at the moment but if you're local then feel free to message me to pop round for a chat 

 

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