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Hiring (borrowing?) a foldingbike for a narrowboat


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On 21/05/2022 at 08:35, Tigerr said:

Llangollen is perfect for bromptons - its pretty well surfaced towpath and our bromptons coped just fine. Up by Llangollen itself the bikes were really useful for exploring too. 

 

There are certainly well-surfaced stretches of towpath, but it is not universal.

Whitchurch down to Ellesmere there are long stretches that are pretty bumpy and stony when dry, and a lot of those stretches when it rains turn into a quagmire. 

I spent five months last summer on the Llangollen, and I cycled almost every part of it, and I personally would not have attempted to use a brompton on some of those stretches (and at the time, I carried an electric brompton on board with me). 

We all have differing abilities and strengths on a bicycle of course, and thus different opinions on the difficulty, but I personally would not suggest that the whole of the Llangollen is perfect for a bike with thin tyres and 16 inch wheels, and certainly not in wet weather. 

 

 

Edited by Tony1
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On 18/05/2022 at 18:00, Johnq said:

Wow! Many, many thanks for sharing all your ideas.

As it is the very first time we are hiring a narrow boat, I have no idea what to expect. It seems nice to us, once having birthed for the night, to explore the surrounding by bicycle, instead of by foot. Our trip is for 10 days on the Llangollen canal from Wrenbury, we are very much looking forward to it.

If you have 10 days do to the Llangollen from Wrenbury, you'll have plenty of spare time to explore the Montgomery Canal too, which is lovely.  You still need to book passage a day or two before.  It can be done online https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/notices/21749-frankton-locks-summer-opening-2022-montgomery-canal

 

 

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  • 4 months later...
On 02/07/2022 at 17:18, David Schweizer said:

We had two Bromptons on Helvetia, and I used mine regularly for lock wheeling. It is true that the ride could be a bit uncomfortable on very bumpy towpaths, but not often so bad for me to get of and push. The biggest problem was if the towpath grass had not been cut for a long time. With the chain only being about six inches off the ground, long grass could get caught between the chain and the rear sprocket, causing either slipping or jamming, that is when I did have to get off and walk.

Displaying my ignorance but what's lockwheeling? I'd rather ask a stupid question than remain stupid in perpetuity.

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As nobody has responded I will stick my head above the parapet as a serial hirer😀.  This is the practice of issuing a crew member with the trusty treader and sending them off up the canal ahead with a windlass to set the next lock in anticipation of your inpending arrival. You then enter said lock and lock through with minimal delay.  I seem to recollect this was more  popular with working boats but more informed posters may be able to comment further.  These days said bod may well be issued with the ubiquitous walkie talkie which amuses us greatly as mere ambling retirees.  Time to put the kettle on and watch them whizz past. 😂

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18 hours ago, Ken X said:

As nobody has responded I will stick my head above the parapet as a serial hirer😀.  This is the practice of issuing a crew member with the trusty treader and sending them off up the canal ahead with a windlass to set the next lock in anticipation of your inpending arrival. You then enter said lock and lock through with minimal delay.  I seem to recollect this was more  popular with working boats but more informed posters may be able to comment further.  These days said bod may well be issued with the ubiquitous walkie talkie which amuses us greatly as mere ambling retirees.  Time to put the kettle on and watch them whizz past. 😂

It doesn't just get you through the locks faster, you get some exercise too... 🙂

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2 hours ago, IanD said:

It doesn't just get you through the locks faster, you get some exercise too... 🙂

This is very true, keeps you warm in winter if you are so inclined.  Often, when winter cruising, OC Domestic hops off at a bridge hole and stomps off up the towpath for a mile or two when it is particularly cold. Perhaps I could invest in a folding bike for Christmas for her. How brave do I feel 😳?

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1 hour ago, Ken X said:

This is very true, keeps you warm in winter if you are so inclined.  Often, when winter cruising, OC Domestic hops off at a bridge hole and stomps off up the towpath for a mile or two when it is particularly cold. Perhaps I could invest in a folding bike for Christmas for her. How brave do I feel 😳?

 

If you do stump up the cash for a folder, I would advise caution.

I used my brompton as shopping transport for much of this year, but in the last couple of weeks I'm finding it feels a bit sketchy riding through muddy stretches of towpath on those rock hard thin tyres. And the dimensions of the brompton are so precise and so constraining that you can't fit fat tyres on in for winter, at least not without doing some surgery. 

 

Last winter I did very little cycling on muddy towpaths, circumstances meant I was able to reach surfaced roads easily. BUt I'm on the Llangollen at the moment, and I've come across a couple of stretches where it felt a bit sketchy trying to ride the brompton.

 

For those areas I keep a second bike, again a folder, but its an ebike with 24 inch wheels and 2 inch wide tyres, so it feels much safer on rough or muddy towpaths, as well as on rutted  rural lanes in wet conditions.

If I had to choose one bike for all conditions, I would go with something that has at least 20 inch wheel, and that will allow you to fit 2 inch tyres for the winter, if like me you have to tackle muddy stretches of towpath. 

 

In fairness you can always wheel a bike through a few hundred yards of mud, but the 20 or 24 inch tyres will also allow a lower pressure than 16 inch brompton tyres, so they are more comfortable to ride even on a dry towpath. 

But all of that said, bike preference are a very individual thing. 

 

Edited by Tony1
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4 hours ago, Tony1 said:

 

If you do stump up the cash for a folder, I would advise caution.

I used my brompton as shopping transport for much of this year, but in the last couple of weeks I'm finding it feels a bit sketchy riding through muddy stretches of towpath on those rock hard thin tyres. And the dimensions of the brompton are so precise and so constraining that you can't fit fat tyres on in for winter, at least not without doing some surgery. 

 

Last winter I did very little cycling on muddy towpaths, circumstances meant I was able to reach surfaced roads easily. BUt I'm on the Llangollen at the moment, and I've come across a couple of stretches where it felt a bit sketchy trying to ride the brompton.

 

For those areas I keep a second bike, again a folder, but its an ebike with 24 inch wheels and 2 inch wide tyres, so it feels much safer on rough or muddy towpaths, as well as on rutted  rural lanes in wet conditions.

If I had to choose one bike for all conditions, I would go with something that has at least 20 inch wheel, and that will allow you to fit 2 inch tyres for the winter, if like me you have to tackle muddy stretches of towpath. 

 

In fairness you can always wheel a bike through a few hundred yards of mud, but the 20 or 24 inch tyres will also allow a lower pressure than 16 inch brompton tyres, so they are more comfortable to ride even on a dry towpath. 

But all of that said, bike preference are a very individual thing. 

 

Wise words indeed. The mud on some winter towpaths can get biblical.  Thought I had lost the better half a few times over the years but she always managed to dig herself out.

 

Did mention the idea of her lock wheeling tonight......... I have received "The Stare". Ho hum, another present idea binned. Perhaps the chrome windlass is back on the table. 🤔

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14 hours ago, Tony1 said:

 

If you do stump up the cash for a folder, I would advise caution.

I used my brompton as shopping transport for much of this year, but in the last couple of weeks I'm finding it feels a bit sketchy riding through muddy stretches of towpath on those rock hard thin tyres. And the dimensions of the brompton are so precise and so constraining that you can't fit fat tyres on in for winter, at least not without doing some surgery. 

 

Last winter I did very little cycling on muddy towpaths, circumstances meant I was able to reach surfaced roads easily. BUt I'm on the Llangollen at the moment, and I've come across a couple of stretches where it felt a bit sketchy trying to ride the brompton.

 

For those areas I keep a second bike, again a folder, but its an ebike with 24 inch wheels and 2 inch wide tyres, so it feels much safer on rough or muddy towpaths, as well as on rutted  rural lanes in wet conditions.

If I had to choose one bike for all conditions, I would go with something that has at least 20 inch wheel, and that will allow you to fit 2 inch tyres for the winter, if like me you have to tackle muddy stretches of towpath. 

 

In fairness you can always wheel a bike through a few hundred yards of mud, but the 20 or 24 inch tyres will also allow a lower pressure than 16 inch brompton tyres, so they are more comfortable to ride even on a dry towpath. 

But all of that said, bike preference are a very individual thing. 

 

As usual there's no such thing as a perfect solution...

 

Bromptons are certainly not ideal for muddy/rough towpaths and they're expensive, OTOH they need less space to store them onboard and are great for journeys where public transport doesn't quite get you to where you want to go.

 

Bigger-wheeled folders are better in mud (and usually cheaper) but harder to find space for or get on a bus/train.

 

You pays yer money... 😉

Edited by IanD
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26 minutes ago, IanD said:

As usual there's no such thing as a perfect solution...

 

Bromptons are certainly not ideal for muddy/rough towpaths and they're expensive, OTOH they need less space to store them onboard and are great for journeys where public transport doesn't quite get you to where you want to go.

 

Bigger-wheeled folders are better in mud (and usually cheaper) but harder to find space for or get on a bus/train.

 

You pays yer money... 😉

 

And in my case, you pays yer money twice! I felt I had to have two bikes, but that's a personal choice of course.

I couldn't really do without the brompton- as you say it can go on trains even when all the official bike spaces are taken, and its super helpful that you can take it on local buses too. I had to make a 7 mile trip to Oswestry and it rained most of the day, so I saved a thorough drenching by taking the brompton on a local bus.

When you want to get some exercise, you can switch off the brompton motor and ride it as a normal bike- its an amazing little machine really.

But I did have a few close calls getting my full size bike onto trains at predictably busy periods such as school holidays etc.

And sometimes you get get caught out by the trains being busy, as I did when I travelled during freshers week this Autumn.

Sometimes it'll be a local event that you know nothing about (something at the NEC for example), and it will cause a few trains to be jam packed.  

So I find it takes the stress out of planning when I know that no matter how busy the train is, I'll be able to get the bike on board. And nothing beats the brompton for that.

 

But as a full time liveaboard and CCer, you also come across stretches where there is half a mile of stony, bumpy and muddy towpath, and I don't enjoy riding the brompton there.

Don't get me wrong, people have done world tours on bromptons, so you can ride them in rough terrain, but I don't like doing it, and in mud it feels riskier than I would like, so I have the other folder specifically for winter, or for muddy conditions during summer. 

 

If I had to choose just one, I would probably go for a 20 inch folding ebike (2 inch tyres), with as compact a fold as possible- that way it could fit on a train as luggage (perhaps in a carry bag), and maybe even on a bus if you ask nicely.

I would look for one that was still rideable without the motor, to get a bit of exercise. You would also want it to weigh less than Jupiter, which would rule a few of them out. 

It's a tall order, innit? 

 

Edited by Tony1
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14 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Yes, particularly as the thead title suggests the OP wantS to hire this bike presumably for a week or fortnight at a time, rather than buy one!!

 

 

 

But my dear fellow, the OP will by now have long ago hired his bike, completed his cruise, and ridden off into the sunset.

In the meantime, the thread has morphed into one of those 'perfect boating bike' threads. 

But it weren't my fault, guvnor.

It was like that when I got here. 😁

 

 

 

Edited by Tony1
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1 hour ago, MtB said:

 

Yes, particularly as the thead title suggests the OP wantS to hire this bike presumably for a week or fortnight at a time, rather than buy one!!

 

 

 

And if you do want to hire a bike, Bromptons -- perfect or not -- can now be hired by the day (or longer) from a fair few locations... 😉

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20 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

And if you do want to hire a bike, Bromptons -- perfect or not -- can now be hired by the day (or longer) from a fair few locations... 😉

 

All of them in remote locations next to the canal, hopefully! 

 

:giggles:

 

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1 hour ago, MtB said:

 

All of them in remote locations next to the canal, hopefully! 

 

:giggles:

 

Obviously not, why on earth would they do that? 😉

 

IIRC they're mainly at railway stations -- but not that many of them, so Murphy's law says there won't be one where you want one... 😞

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The brompton website seems to advertise their bike hire from £5 a day, so maybe £35 for a week on the Llangollen, plus a few quid petrol to go and pick up the bike (depending on where you are/where you passing). 

But what use does a hirer have for a bike? One of the unwritten rules of hiring is that the boat must never stop moving during daylight hours. 

But for those hirers who break the rule, £35 seems pretty decent to get a bike for a week. 

 

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9 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

 

The brompton website seems to advertise their bike hire from £5 a day, so maybe £35 for a week on the Llangollen, plus a few quid petrol to go and pick up the bike (depending on where you are/where you passing). 

But what use does a hirer have for a bike? One of the unwritten rules of hiring is that the boat must never stop moving during daylight hours. 

But for those hirers who break the rule, £35 seems pretty decent to get a bike for a week. 

 

 

But the boat can move non-stop and even faster if you have a lock-wheeler on a bike going ahead... 😉

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3 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

But the boat can move non-stop and even faster if you have a lock-wheeler on a bike going ahead... 😉

 

To be fair I've got a damn cheek taking the mick out of hirers.

I did the Grindley Brook flight last week, and there was a crew behind me on a hire boat who were absolutely first class. 

I'm not sure how many of them there were- they seemed as numerous as an army of Orcs (but much better looking).

Pairs of them went on ahead to all the locks, and started really getting things moving- they had the queue through there several times faster than would otherwise have been possible. 

I had one in attendance upon me at all times, and often two. In fact I barely got off the boat the whole time, which in fairness was probably safest for all concerned.

Not only did they do all of the work I should have done, but they did it faster, and they were laughing and joking with me the whole way. 

Of course I still hit every lock wall on the way through like the eternal amateur I am, but this time I laughed gaily as I did it. 

I considered kidnapping a few of them to use on the lift bridges further on, but they were vodka drinkers and would have cleaned me out of booze within hours.

 

 

 

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18 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

 

To be fair I've got a damn cheek taking the mick out of hirers.

I did the Grindley Brook flight last week, and there was a crew behind me on a hire boat who were absolutely first class. 

I'm not sure how many of them there were- they seemed as numerous as an army of Orcs (but much better looking).

Pairs of them went on ahead to all the locks, and started really getting things moving- they had the queue through there several times faster than would otherwise have been possible. 

I had one in attendance upon me at all times, and often two. In fact I barely got off the boat the whole time, which in fairness was probably safest for all concerned.

Not only did they do all of the work I should have done, but they did it faster, and they were laughing and joking with me the whole way. 

Of course I still hit every lock wall on the way through like the eternal amateur I am, but this time I laughed gaily as I did it. 

I considered kidnapping a few of them to use on the lift bridges further on, but they were vodka drinkers and would have cleaned me out of booze within hours.

 

 

As hire boaters we've often been held up/slowed down in flights of locks by privately owned boats. Given how much time some boaters spend moored or pootling along gently (nothing wrong with that, of course!) I'm sure that some regular hire boaters have travelled further and done more locks than some owners -- there are competent and incompetent boaters on both sides. Also nice friendly boaters and selfish ones. In fact the same applies to all walks of life, there are nice people and tw*ts everywhere...

 

But I'd say that the least accommodating/friendly boaters I've come across have mostly been owners, for example refusing to let other faster boats pass them, or refusing to move up to make space at a mooring, or turning locks in the face of an oncoming boat... 😞

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1 hour ago, IanD said:

As hire boaters we've often been held up/slowed down in flights of locks by privately owned boats.

 

 

I have to say I agree, the very worst delayers are the boaters who like to open a paddle one click at a time and wait a bit to see what happens, and if all is well do another click after about five minutes. Always a privateer does this, I've never seen a hire boat do it. 

 

Hire boaters tend to be slow if there are a lot of crew, a lot of rope throwing and leaping on and off the boat, a lot of hats and no-one with a clear role to play and all thoroughly enjoying themselves. But frankly who cares? 

 

Unless you need to get to your mooring in time to catch the train, or the pub three locks along closes in an hour, or, or....

Edited by MtB
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1 hour ago, MtB said:

 

 

I have to say I agree, the very worst delayers are the boaters who like to open a paddle one click at a time and wait a bit to see what happens, and if all is well do another click after about five minutes. Always a privateer does this, I've never seen a hire boat do it. 

 

Hire boaters tend to be slow if there are a lot of crew, a lot of rope throwing and leaping on and off the boat, a lot of hats and no-one with a clear role to play and all thoroughly enjoying themselves. But frankly who cares? 

 

Unless you need to get to your mooring in time to catch the train, or the pub three locks along closes in an hour, or, or....

When there was just me and my wife -- me doing all the locks -- we were being held up by a hire boat with half a dozen people on the shore, all running round like ants. They did let us past them and we then got further ahead at each lock...

 

But as you say they were having a good time -- we however had a pub to get to for dinner... 🙂

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