Electric bikes

[Bubblebuster]

What's the deal with electric bikes on towpaths.

Are they allowed and if so, what sort of restrictions if any are there... and recommendations please as thinking of getting a couple of 'em.

Bikes in general can be a but of a nuisance as walkers will know, but are electric bikes charging along (see what I did there 🙂) going just a bit too far?  

[MtB]

I doubt the existence of electric bikes has penetrated the corporate consciousness of CRT yet, so I'd say the rules are the same as normal bikes. I.e. don't be a dick on one. 

[Bubblebuster]

.... and not one doing 25mph! 

[Alan de Enfield]

7 minutes ago, Bubblebuster said:

.... and not one doing 25mph! 

 

Depends if you want the 25mph pedalists to overtake you

[Higgs]

18 minutes ago, Bubblebuster said:

.... and not one doing 25mph! 

 

The usual limited speed is 25kph (15mph). With a 250 watt motor. Anything above 250 watts and it will have to be registered with the DVLA and insured for road use, but otherwise, could be used on private land, with permission. 

 

 

Edited May 9, 2022 by Higgs

[Mike Hurley]

25 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

The usual limited speed is 25kph (15mph). With a 250 watt motor. Anything above 250 watts and it will have to be registered with the DVLA and insured for road use, but otherwise, could be used on private land, with permission. 

 

 

But in real life they are everywhere and i bet none are registered with anyone.

[IanD]

Just now, Mike Hurley said:

But in real life they are everywhere and i bet none are registered with anyone.

There are a lot more electric scooters than electric bikes on the towpaths round here -- and for sure some of them aren't limited to 15mph either... 😞

[Higgs]

15 minutes ago, Mike Hurley said:

But in real life they are everywhere and i bet none are registered with anyone.

 

As above. But in the case of scooters, they may be made legal. It isn't always easy to spot an over-powered bike. Even with those of legal power rating, it is possible to override the speed limiter, and gain an extra few kph of powered only speed. Theoretically (legally), you're not supposed to be able to do more than 25kph, unless it's by way of peddling. 

 

 

Edited May 9, 2022 by Higgs

[Jim Riley]

It's not the electrickery, it's the attitude of the cyclist, there are inconsiderate drivers in charge of all sorts of vehicles, including boats.

 As an electric cyclist I love using the paved towpath to get around, keeps me off the roads, out of the traffic. 

There needs to be a few prosecutions for Furious Cycling, well publicised, same for illegal escooters and under age riders. Maybe don't fine the kids, just confiscate the e scooter. 

[David Mack]

2 hours ago, Bubblebuster said:

What's the deal with electric bikes on towpaths.

Are they allowed and if so, what sort of restrictions if any are there.

An electric bike under 250W/15mph is legally a bike, so the normal bike rules apply. Anything more powerful/faster is legally a motor cycle and needs to be licensed and insured as such, and so is not generally allowed on towpaths.

[reg]

I have 2 electric 250w bikes, no different to riding an unassisted bike in that the same rules and considerations should be followed. However due to age and health I am unable to use an unpowered bike for very long. Ebikes have been a major boon for me particularly when having to travel a few miles for shopping.

Anything over 250w is both unnecessary and illegal when being used as a bicycle and when cycling rules and laws are being followed. 

[mrsmelly]

2 hours ago, Higgs said:

 

As above. But in the case of scooters, they may be made legal. It isn't always easy to spot an over-powered bike. Even with those of legal power rating, it is possible to override the speed limiter, and gain an extra few kph of powered only speed. Theoretically (legally), you're not supposed to be able to do more than 25kph, unless it's by way of peddling. 

 

 

Whats a kph? surely in Great Britain we do speeds in MPH. The road speed limit signs are in  MPH, the distances on our road signs are in  miles, as are the distances on the canals. Mustnt mix up with some unused foreign measurements 

[Tony1]

 

Legal ebikes have a maximum assisted speed of 15mph, but personally I find that I'm usually carrying something or other, and the towpaths are often bumpy or potholed- and riding at more than 10mph with a week's shopping in your panniers (or rucksack) doesn't feel all that safe. 

If its wet or muddy, you'll be even slower.

But the cyclists that I generally see riding fast enough to unsettle the walkers are not the boaters, they are the leisure cyclists. 

To be fair the speedsters seem to be a small minority, but that said I've been spending most of my time on the quieter towpaths since the turn of the year, so I'm not seeing that many cyclists anyway.    

Oddly enough when I first moved aboard I thought an ebike would be fine, but in recent months I've been thinking I would benefit a lot from more vigorous exercise, so I also got a normal/manual bike, which I now use for shorter trips a few times a week- and its small enough to fold and get onto a local bus (because of course the trains dont stop in as many places as you might like).

I will absolutely be keeping the ebike, but I save it for when I know there are big hills or long distances, rainy days, or when I'm not feeling very well (as happened in March when I had covid). 

 

 

 

[Higgs]

4 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Whats a kph? surely in Great Britain we do speeds in MPH. The road speed limit signs are in  MPH, the distances on our road signs are in  miles, as are the distances on the canals. Mustnt mix up with some unused foreign measurements 

 

Have seen the odd miffed e bike user wondering why the kph readout. It would be a good feature to be able change the settings. Not always possible, I think. 

 

 

[ditchcrawler]

33 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

  as are the distances on the canals. Mustnt mix up with some unused foreign measurements 

Unless you are in a tunnel

[ditchcrawler]

How about one of these 

 

[Quattrodave]

The other week my next door neighbour was bragging about his new electric bike that he had 'chipped' (his words not mine) he reckons it'll do 37 mph!!! Wouldn't like to see that on the tow path!!  Wouldn't mind seeing it in the cut tho 😁

[Ronaldo47]

Agreed, we do need more enforcement regarding e- scooters and illegal bikes, but I'm not holding my breath.   Years of government efficiency savings ( i.e. cuts), in the public sector mean that realistically  there are not enough police to do anything, not to mention the severe cuts-induced backlog in the courts if they did attempt to prosecute offenders.   I get the impression that the government prefers to turn a blind eye to these illegal, but green, means of  transport, despite the dangers to pedestrians and other road users. France does allow faster e-bikes and scooters, but users must have third party insurance and there are age limits. 

 

We have two electric bikes, both  Powabyke shoppers, that can be operated in both power and assist modes. The first was bought some 15 years ago. These models, which are no longer available new, have grandfather rights for power use on public roads, but are limited to 12 mph under power. Their panniers and pannier bags mean we use them for most local shopping trips.  Current street-legal electric bikes are assist-only and limited to 15mph.  .

 

We used to use conventional bikes, but it is hilly where we live, and age and joint problems meant giving them up.  Our car use has fallen substantially since getting the electric bikes, which unfortunately are too heavy and bulky to fit our car to take with us on holidays, but I do still have my Bickerton folder for canal holidays, where hills are not a problem. 

Edited May 9, 2022 by Ronaldo47
typos

[MtB]

1 hour ago, Ronaldo47 said:

Years of government efficiency savings ( i.e. cuts), in the public sector mean that realistically  there are not enough police to do anything,

 

 

I disagree. There are still plenty of police around to persecute easy targets such as motorists.

 

DAMHIK.

[David Mack]

4 hours ago, mrsmelly said:

 the distances on our road signs are in  miles, as are the distances on the canals.

Canal distances might be in miles, but towpath distances aren't (unless the Mailbox really is 700 miles from Tindal Bridge)

[Ronaldo47]

That is no doubt a consequence of the target culture that pervades organisations like the government and civil service these days, where your annual review requires you to have met targets. When my god-son was a trainee copper, they were expected to get a certain number of bookings each month, and if you were a bit low, the easiest way to catch up was to get in early,  grab one of their hand-held speed cameras before anyone else did, and book some motorists ntil you had met your bookings quota if you wanted to get on.

 

I think things may have been different when I was a new driver in the early 1970's. One fine summer's day I had been happily driving at 60mph on an empty 40mph dual carriageway in open  country, oblivious to the police car behind until he put his siren on.  I admitted what speed I had been doing and what the speed limit was, and rather than booking me, the copper warned me to pay more attention to my mirror  as he had been sat beind me for some time, and if I catch you doing that again in my manor, you're for it. Lesson learned, (I do always check my rearview  mirror regularly  when driving,)  and left with a feeling of goodwill towards the police.  But that was then, and I wonder if I would receive the ssme treatment today? 

Edited May 9, 2022 by Ronaldo47
typos

[Bubblebuster]

All good stuff guys, and I guess I'd better not ask about using a trike!

On a conventional two wheeler carrying stuff could also be a problem especially if you have a basket with say groceries on the front because of the wobble factor - so unless you fancy an early bath, a trailer behind is probably going to be a lot safer as you head back to that boat along the canal path.

  

[Jim Riley]

12 hours ago, mrsmelly said:

Whats a kph? surely in Great Britain we do speeds in MPH. The road speed limit signs are in  MPH, the distances on our road signs are in  miles, as are the distances on the canals. Mustnt mix up with some unused foreign measurements 

The brighter ones amongst us understand. We didn't vote brexit either.

[Jim Riley]

8 hours ago, MtB said:

 

 

I disagree. There are still plenty of police around to persecute easy targets such as motorists.

 

DAMHIK.

We must AYHYK. Why were you persecuted? Is it persecution to be prosecuted for a wrongdoing? Will you offer to resign or are you a Tory?

[Tony1]

7 hours ago, Bubblebuster said:

All good stuff guys, and I guess I'd better not ask about using a trike!

On a conventional two wheeler carrying stuff could also be a problem especially if you have a basket with say groceries on the front because of the wobble factor - so unless you fancy an early bath, a trailer behind is probably going to be a lot safer as you head back to that boat along the canal path.

  

 

Just a quick note on the trailer thing- I got one over a year ago to act as a sort of emergency transport system if I needed to carry a bag of coal or gas bottle for a couple of miles, or perhaps a bulky item.

But in truth I've not used the trailer once so far (although I'll keep it for those sorts of emergency situations anyway). 

I've seen a few of them being towed along on the towpath, and they do seem to bounce around quite a lot on the rougher stretches, so you would need to go fairly slowly towing one over rougher ground, and to strap in the shopping to avoid things being bounced out. 

 

For routine shopping trips I used to use a 65 litre rucksack. Bulky items can also be strapped onto this rucksack with luggage straps, and carried on one's back (which I have done at good few times). E.g. a few weeks ago I picked up a folding hand-pulled trolley/cart thing (bought via ebay click and collect), and that had to be strapped on to my rucksack for the 2 mile ride back to the boat. 

 

As long as your bike will safely carry the extra weight of shopping (and some folders have lower weight/loading limits than others), I've come round more recently to preferring panniers to carry shopping. 

It's certainly more pleasant to ride a few miles with maybe 20kg of shopping loaded lower down on the bike than it is to carry it on your back, especially in warmer weather, and I did worry about what would happen if I took a fall on a faster downhill stretch with a 20kg pack on my back.

I still use a small rucksack, but that's just to provide a softer ride for the beer. If I carried the beer in panniers it would be so shaken up on the ride back that I couldn't open it for ages, and morale aboard the vessel could be critically impacted.