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London boaters fight for moorings


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20 hours ago, Tim Lewis said:

Worth a watch

 

 

Community 😂 wouldn’t want any of them as my neighbour. Offer any of those interviewed a 3 bed semi they would abandon their boat life in a flash.

Edited by PD1964
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2 hours ago, robtheplod said:

Reading this i get the impression London is now off limits to those wishing to visit by boat?  Are moorings - even just overnight ones so rare now in London?

London is on my boating bucket list......

 

Most of the commenters on London Moorings are raely seen south of Braunston, I'm not saying that it is easy but with the many bookable moorings and the acceptance that double mooring is the norm boating in central London can be very enjoyable.

Edited by Tim Lewis
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1 hour ago, robtheplod said:

Reading this i get the impression London is now off limits to those wishing to visit by boat?  Are moorings - even just overnight ones so rare now in London?

London is on my boating bucket list......

 

1 hour ago, PD1964 said:

Community 😂 wouldn’t want any of them as my neighbour. Offer any of those interviewed a 3 bed semi they would abandon their boat life in a flash.

 

Except that no-one is 'offered a three bed semi'  in London when they can be rented out at £2.5k a month. 

 

The London liveaboerds are generally young, friendly and love their way of livin

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26 minutes ago, Tim Lewis said:

 

 

Except that no-one is 'offered a three bed semi'  in London when they can be rented out at £2.5k a month. 

 

The London liveaboerds are generally young, friendly and love their way of livin

 

That may be true but its not for CRT to solve the housing crisis, whether it be London or anywhere else.

 

If you cannot afford to live in the capital, you need to find somewhere where you can live. Its the same just about all over the world, Paris, New York etc.

 

Going back 40 years first married and in our early 20's we couldnt afford to live where we wanted to so we had to find somewhere that we could.

 

We've moved three times in that time but ended up in the same general area.

 

Edited by The Happy Nomad
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5 hours ago, Tim Lewis said:

 

The London liveaboerds are generally young, friendly and love their way of livin

 And are all probably similar types of young people looking at that Vid. all socialise together, moor together have the same political views and work ethic and all their boats are probably in similar state of decay and age.  No wouldn’t want to be part of that community.

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4 hours ago, PD1964 said:

 And are all probably similar types of young people looking at that Vid. all socialise together, moor together have the same political views and work ethic and all their boats are probably in similar state of decay and age.  No wouldn’t want to be part of that community.

I'm sure the feeling would be mutual.

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13 hours ago, robtheplod said:

Reading this i get the impression London is now off limits to those wishing to visit by boat?  Are moorings - even just overnight ones so rare now in London?

London is on my boating bucket list......

 

It's getting harder, but still doable with a little planning and pre-booking of some of the CRT visitor moorings. It's usually pot luck with regard to finding an overnight mooring so you might need some long cruising days in order to find one. We will be doing it in June this year so if we do have problems finding somewhere at least we will have daylight until late evening if need be.

 

For example this year we are exploring the Lee & Stort navigation and will be arriving from the Thames at Limehouse. We will head north out of the city and just keep going until we find somewhere, even if that might be well into the evening. When we return from the L&S we have a few nights booked in Paddington Basin on the Regents Canal after which we should easily be able to reach Uxbridge (or north of) where you can usually find somewhere to moor, before we continue north on the Grand Union.

 

Also bear in mind that some of the marinas and boatyards do bookable overnight moorings but you have to pay for the privilege of course. Last time we were there 4 years ago we stayed a night at Highbridge Marina a little down the Slough Arm before continuing the next day to our pre-booked 3 nights at CRT's Little Venice moorings.

 

 

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25 minutes ago, Grassman said:

 

It's getting harder, but still doable with a little planning and pre-booking of some of the CRT visitor moorings. It's usually pot luck with regard to finding an overnight mooring so you might need some long cruising days in order to find one. We will be doing it in June this year so if we do have problems finding somewhere at least we will have daylight until late evening if need be.

 

For example this year we are exploring the Lee & Stort navigation and will be arriving from the Thames at Limehouse. We will head north out of the city and just keep going until we find somewhere, even if that might be well into the evening. When we return from the L&S we have a few nights booked in Paddington Basin on the Regents Canal after which we should easily be able to reach Uxbridge (or north of) where you can usually find somewhere to moor, before we continue north on the Grand Union.

 

Also bear in mind that some of the marinas and boatyards do bookable overnight moorings but you have to pay for the privilege of course. Last time we were there 4 years ago we stayed a night at Highbridge Marina a little down the Slough Arm before continuing the next day to our pre-booked 3 nights at CRT's Little Venice moorings.

 

 

 

We have overnight moorings at the London Canal Museum:

 

Mooring at London Canal Museum

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On 11/04/2022 at 20:58, Tim Lewis said:

Worth a watch

 

 

 

The London Boat (Crusty) Community is one of the original long lasting communities. But most of those interviewed have only been on boats for 5 minutes. How do they end up being the spokespeople for liveaboards?

Edited by blackrose
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Thanks Tim for the Canal Museum tip. I've just made a booking there, and DaveP for the heads up about moorings in general. 

 

I'll be coming in from the Lea & Stort navigations and was planning on overnighting the previous day somewhere around the Rammey Marsh area. Do you think I will have a decent chance of finding somewhere there (for 2 Nbs)? Or might we even be able to get a little closer to the city? Although I'd prefer to have a longer day travelling from Rammey Marsh to the canal museum mooring than risk going too far into London and not finding anywhere.

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12 minutes ago, DaveP said:

I'm in London, and have been since December. There is plenty of room coming in from the West until Alperton.  From there until Paddington (2hrs) it's mostly full, but even at the Westway there were a couple of breasted-up spots.  We paid for a weekend in the basin (6 places there plus another 2 in Little Venice).  However, we then found a spot for Xmas/New Year by the station.  Followed by a couple of weeks back in the basin behind the hospital.  We then went back out onto the mainline at the Harrow Road.  Now the big leap over to Kings Cross - there are no moorings really (apart from the 5 spots in Camden) for a good 3hr cruise through Mary!ebone, Regents Park and Camden.  We'd booked a week on the eco-moorings above City Road lock.  Then back to Kings Cross and an extended stay on the Coaldrops (because of Storm Eunice), then back to the eco-moorings for a futher week. 

 

There's a major problem with the eco-moorings (which occupy the entirety of the moorings from East of Kings Cross to City Road Lock) in that the booking website doesn't allow one to cancal a booking within two weeks of arrival, and thus spaces go wasted.  I've just spent the last week back on them and 4-6 spaces (of 10 at Colebrooke Row) were vacant every night.

 

From the eco-moorings we went East to Haggerston, and then down to Mile End for two weeks apiece before returning to the eco-moorings.  Yesterday we discovered that there were no appropriate spaces at Old Ford in Stratford and had to travel a whole mile and a half further north to find a lovely space on Hackney Marshes.  The next moorings will hopefully be outside Lidl on the Limehouse Cut and then somewhere in Brentford before climbing up to the Fox in Hanwell.

 

In the last four months, the only time we haven't found a space in or close to our preferred destination - was yesterday.  London is not full; it's crowded, but there are always spaces somewhere.  And now there are many more bookable moorings in the centre of town (website incompetence notwithstanding) so, so long as you don't have a massive widebeam, or will not breast-up, you'll find a space.  

 

As to the locals.  They're young and new.  They can't move out of London, because that's where their jobs/families and schools are - but in general they do seem to try and obey the guidelines for cc'ingas they currently exist, and many want to make a go of living on boats.  There are a few who are obstreperous, and care nought for the rules - some have dependency or mental health issues, others are merely self-centred and selfish, but they are a very small minority.  

 

As to CRT - they're pretty universally seen as remote, uncaring, ignorant, incompetent, and biaised against boaters.  The farago of the 'safety zones' on the Lee over the past year has played, once again, into the hands of the NBTA activists.  The workers on the bank are respected, but the employment of District Enforcement is destroying even that.

 

But in two weeks, I'm back off up-country for 7-8 months.  I'll report back next time I come down to this country within a country....

 

 

 

I have to disagree on some of this -- I've been cycling this section of towpath into Paddington a couple of times a week for the last year and I see plenty of boats on exactly the same mooring for months at a time, and plenty more moving from one mooring to another along the same few miles (Alperton-Paddington -- less than 5 miles?) of canal. There is precisely zero chance that they are following the CC rules, and from observation I'd say they're definitely not "a very small minority", and may well be the majority -- obviously I don't have detailed statistics, but like the widebeam issue I know what I see and it's not difficult to work out what's happening.

 

Yes there are boats who do try and meet the rules, I've clocked them over the whole length from Paddington to Hanwell and Uxbridge, but I would say *these* are the ones in the minority. And yes, I've talked to some of the boaters who happily admit that they basically ignore the rules, or use the loopholes in them ("broken down, waiting for parts", "birds nesting in fenders") to avoid moving for months at a time. "They can't move out of London, because that's where their jobs/families and schools are" is precisely the excuse the NBTA use to justify this, in spite of it being given by CART as a specific reason why you can't claim to CC if this is the case.

 

This doesn't make them bad people, on the contrary they're mostly friendly (and poor), particularly the younger less grumpy ones, but they are simply ignoring the rules about moorings and CCing. As DaveP says it's not *impossible* to find moorings when visiting London as a consequence but it is *much* more difficult, especially if you want to be able to moor close to a particular location for any reason -- where there are often VMs or short-term moorings, but these are completely filled by overstayers. Even the towpath sections in between official moorings are completely full of boats which never or very rarely move -- or just arrange to swap places, which still means nowhere to moor for visitors.

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2 hours ago, Grassman said:

 

Thanks Tim for the Canal Museum tip. I've just made a booking there, and DaveP for the heads up about moorings in general. 

 

I'll be coming in from the Lea & Stort navigations and was planning on overnighting the previous day somewhere around the Rammey Marsh area. Do you think I will have a decent chance of finding somewhere there (for 2 Nbs)? Or might we even be able to get a little closer to the city? Although I'd prefer to have a longer day travelling from Rammey Marsh to the canal museum mooring than risk going too far into London and not finding anywhere.


min general once you are north of Ponders End you should have no problem finding a mooring unless you want to be within spitting distance of a train station such as at Cheshunt, Ponders and to the Canal Museum is an easy day

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  • 2 months later...
On 04/04/2022 at 14:36, magnetman said:

 

 

I liked Nigel. Had a couple of beers in the Magpie in Brentford with him just before he shuffled off. Very knowledgeable man. 

This is a really interesting point about the rings. CRT have recently started installing mooring rings in previously unmoorable areas with concrete edges and nowhere to hammer pins in. I suspect personally that hammering mooring pins in could technically be a byelaw infringement so the move from self mooring to provision of a mooring service may be rather interesting. 

 

I must admit I had not cottoned-on to this possibly being a precursor to taking money for moorings on towpath as a service. 

 

If that's what it is then it is refreshing to see that someone in CRT actually knows what they are doing ! 

 

A good sign. 

 

 

What bylaw does this breach?

 

CRT have never sought to enforce any of its bylaws so it's an academic question. 

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2 minutes ago, waterworks said:

What bylaw does this breach?

 

CRT have never sought to enforce any of its bylaws so it's an academic question. 

 

But maybe the point is that under the Waterways Act C&RT can charge for 'additional services' of which the provison of mooring rings could be so classed.

 

There are already precedents, around the system for charges for temporay moorings (London, Llangollen etc)

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26 minutes ago, waterworks said:

What bylaw does this breach?

 

CRT have never sought to enforce any of its bylaws so it's an academic question. 

BW general canal byelaw no.29. 

 

"29. No mooring rope shall be affixed to any sluice lockgate, bridge or

other work of the Board not provided for the purpose of mooring."

 

---

 

I reckon a canal bank structure is an "other work of the board" and is not provided for the purpose of mooring.

Banging mooring pins into cracks in concrete is definitely liable to cause damage. Banging mooring pins into grass which is laid over stone canal bank structures is liable to cause damage. 

 

The Board will clearly need to be able to enforce against these sorts of things if they need to otherwise damage will be done to the works. 

 

Technically interesting when it comes to Armco type campshedding / piling. 

 

It's just a fluke that the horizontal rail is easy to attach to with chains or hooks. It is not provided for mooring. 

 

It is probably a byelaw infringement to secure vessels to the piling unless there are rings or bollards provided for the purpose of mooring. 

Edited by magnetman
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There was a time when CRT were attaching notices to railings and egress ladders because idiots were using these to secure boats. 

 

I think they did quote a byelaw but not sure which one it was. 

 

 

1 minute ago, waterworks said:

Well thats a load of manure. 

 

They are trying to justify squatting in London without a long term mooring. 

The cut in London is full of squatters. Their parties were closed down squatting private residences so they turned up on boats. No rocket science. 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, magnetman said:

BW general canal byelaw no.29. 

 

"29. No mooring rope shall be affixed to any sluice lockgate, bridge or

other work of the Board not provided for the purpose of mooring."

 

---

 

I reckon a canal bank structure is an "other work of the board" and is not provided for the purpose of mooring.

Banging mooring pins into cracks in concrete is definitely liable to cause damage. Banging mooring pins into grass which is laid over stone canal bank structures is liable to cause damage. 

 

The Board will clearly need to be able to enforce against these sorts of things if they need to otherwise damage will be done to the works. 

 

Technically interesting when it comes to Armco type campshedding / piling. 

 

It's just a fluke that the horizontal rail is easy to attach to with chains or hooks. It is not provided for mooring. 

 

It is probably a byelaw infringement to secure vessels to the piling unless there are rings or bollards provided for the purpose of mooring. 

That interpretation would lead to the outcome that boats could only moor where there are rings or bollards which would be proposterous and also the fact that BW and CRT have never said anything about not using pins, possibly their " boating handbook " has even told boaters to do so ?

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