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Faulty macerator toilet


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I don't see why it should take 7 weeks to sort out a macerator problem. A morning should either get it sorted or confirm what the fault is.

 

I no longer presume anything about what many so called professionals would do in the inland industry. If you are having a lot more work done maybe they are leaving what they think will be a simple fix until last. maybe, if your instructions went along the line of your initial post they may not fancy the job or be putting much effort into getting costings that you think will be too expensive and turn it down.

 

One thing is sure and that is that far too many yards and marinas seem to run on canal time where every hour is more like a week of real time. So if you need to solve a problem NOW the easiest and fastest way is to learn to DIY.

 

Have you the instruction manual for your toilet. It might just have a motor overheat reset button that needs pressing in or a self resetting overheat device that has not self reset. I don't know too much about the details of the variety of macerator toilets that are available but others here will so an you tell us the make and model of toilet? I assume that you press a button to flush but are there any warning lamps near the button and is so what do they do? Is there any chance the holding tank is full, just in case it has an automatic shut down to stop you spraying mess out of the tank breather?

 

I think that you really do need the manual because it probably has  a fault finding chart in it.

Edited by Tony Brooks
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21 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Not surprised as a dump though sits on to of the tank and your tank is remote. I suspect the best you could do is with a proper sea toilet emptying into the tank but then you may find it uses more water than is ideal.

 

Johnson Marine Sea Toilet Manual Compact Bowl | eBay

This is exactly the one I've had for 20 years. In that time one minor blockage ( not as bad as I had feared) when I also changed the flap valve and one change of the outlet pipe to the holding tank. To be honest the pump piston seal (not the pump handle seal) needs replacing but that part is now obsolete and I need to fit a new pump assembly, a summer job. In the meanwhile a drop of olive oil weekly keeps it smooth. 

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1 hour ago, Slim said:

This is exactly the one I've had for 20 years. In that time one minor blockage ( not as bad as I had feared) when I also changed the flap valve and one change of the outlet pipe to the holding tank. To be honest the pump piston seal (not the pump handle seal) needs replacing but that part is now obsolete and I need to fit a new pump assembly, a summer job. In the meanwhile a drop of olive oil weekly keeps it smooth. 

 

That image was just the first one I could easily grab off the net so the OP could see what a sea toilet looked like. There seems to be a fair number of different makes and models.

 

Given what the OP asked us I am still wondering why the marina/yard did not give it as an option. i think there is much we don't know about this but that is the OP's prerogative.

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Just a thought, but if you're struggling to recruit a pro for the job, and you dont fancy attempting a DIY fix, it might take some pressure off the situation if you buy a cheap camping porta potti that you can use for the time being, and then maybe sell on or give away when your macerator is fixed.

If you do go for that option, I would steer well clear of the very cheapest ones on amazon and ebay.  

 

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Hi everyone 

well the boatyard phoned today and they are proposing to just replace the current macerator toilet with … a new macerator toilet 

so I will go along with that and be very careful how I use it 

thinking of doing what they do in Greece in restaurants etc … where when you go to the toilet there is a bin for putting used toilet paper 

you are not supposed to put toilet paper down the toilet at all 

so we will see ..

thanks guys for all your advice etc much appreciated 🙂

 

 

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1 minute ago, Christine Burton said:

thinking of doing what they do in Greece in restaurants etc … where when you go to the toilet there is a bin for putting used toilet paper 

you are not supposed to put toilet paper down the toilet at all 

 

 

Keeping a separate paper/wipes bin in the bathroom is a teeny bit of a faff but not much once you get used to it.

I did this with my composting toilet using a little 20 litre bin, and now I do it with a cassette toilet to save on the volume of waste in the cassette (so that you need fewer trips to the dreaded elsan). 

I think if I had a macerator I might do the same thing, especially because I prefer to use toilet wipes as well as dry paper, and the wipes would probably cause issues for a macerator. 

 

 

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34 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

I did this with my composting toilet using a little 20 litre bin, and now I do it with a cassette toilet to save on the volume of waste in the cassette (so that you need fewer trips to the dreaded elsan). 

Does paper really make a significant difference to the volume (in compost or cassette loo)?

35 minutes ago, Tony1 said:

I think if I had a macerator I might do the same thing, especially because I prefer to use toilet wipes as well as dry paper, and the wipes would probably cause issues for a macerator. 

Wet wipes of any sort are a no-no for a macerator toilet.

And for a dump through, because while they may not cause any problems on the way into the tank, they could well do so when pumping out.

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8 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Does paper really make a significant difference to the volume (in compost or cassette loo)?

 

I have asked that many times unless you use a full roll every time you go and flush the cardboard centre as well.

 

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9 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Does paper really make a significant difference to the volume (in compost or cassette loo)?

Wet wipes of any sort are a no-no for a macerator toilet.

And for a dump through, because while they may not cause any problems on the way into the tank, they could well do so when pumping out.

 

Also wet wipes are a major problem in our mains sewer system, being the foundation of the massive 'fat-bergs' that grow in them. so much so that the Thames Water vans have sign-writing on them imploring people not to put wet-wipes down the toilet. So the same must apply to elsans disposal points which connect to the main sewer system.

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19 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Does paper really make a significant difference to the volume (in compost or cassette loo)?

 

I've never not used a separate paper bin the bathroom (on the boat). With the composting toilet it was because I didnt think toilet wipes would help with the composting process (and yes, I know composting doesn't even get started on the boat itself, but my hope was it might make things easier to manage further downstream).  So to be honest I don't have an accurate idea of the difference it makes.

The paper bin is small but it does compress down easily and lasts for a couple of weeks, so in truth it probably wouldn't make that much difference to the waste volume if the paper and wipes were placed in the cassette. 

But it probably reduces the number of visits to the elsan, and allows me to stay in a nice spot for a bit longer, so I'm prepared to give it a try.

I also use a separate container for urine (mostly), in order to further reduce the waste volume and reduce the elsan visits, and there have been a few times when I'd have been stuffed if I had to visit an elsan every 3 or 4 days. 

With my 3 spare cassettes and the current approach I'm using, I can stretch for two weeks between elsan trips. The increased flexibility to stay in a nice/convenient location is a major benefit, and saves me hours of cruising just to reach the nearest CRT facilities, and more so given that elsans can be scarce (eg the Llan) or out of order.  

 

 

Edited by Tony1
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2 hours ago, Christine Burton said:

Hi everyone 

well the boatyard phoned today and they are proposing to just replace the current macerator toilet with … a new macerator toilet 

so I will go along with that and be very careful how I use it 

thinking of doing what they do in Greece in restaurants etc … where when you go to the toilet there is a bin for putting used toilet paper 

you are not supposed to put toilet paper down the toilet at all 

so we will see ..

thanks guys for all your advice etc much appreciated 🙂

 

 

Glad that it looks like some progress for you.

I can only speak from my experience but I don't find the type of paper makes any difference and never had any problem with paper. Wet wipes however are the work of the devil... 

The biggest factor for me is the amount of flush water and how many ladies are on board 🙂

 

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3 hours ago, Tony1 said:

With the composting toilet it was because I didnt think toilet wipes would help with the composting process (and yes, I know composting doesn't even get started on the boat itself, but my hope was it might make things easier to manage further downstream).

People add material like sawdust or coconut husk to a compost loo. Is paper really any different?

Toilet wipes certainly won't compost, being made of some plastic material.

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We have had mascerator toilets for about 16 or more years in two different boats. 

 

We experienced 2 problems in that time, one was a microswitch that had failed, inexpensive to replace frustratingly awkward to get to and even more frustrating that we did not have an operational loo while the fault was fixed. 

 

The other problem was when my daughter flushed a sanitary item down there, frustrating that she had visited the boat on numerous occasions and should have known better, frustrating that we had to strip the loo down to retrieve the blockage, frustrating to have to cross our legs until the job was done but, it didn't cost anything to fix. 

 

When I have visited boats with dump through loos I really find the smell that goes with the toilet system unpleasant. That is a big tick in a box for me with regard a mascerator. When we need to empty the loo on a boat we volunteer with I hate having to try and lift a great box of crap and urine out of the boat and trundle it along the towpath to the facilities then gag as the contents glug their way into the Elsan, assuming the elsan is not blocked or splattered with other people's excrement when you arrive. 

If you have any reason to think there might be a baby wipe, an ear bud or ladies sanitary item in there then you might do well to have a read up on how to dismantle the loo, get your marigolds on and go for it. 

I certainly would not be throwing the baby out with the bathwater and looking at completely changing to a different kind of loo at this point. I do understand your frustration though. 

Our microswitch problem was fixed quickly and easily by Oxley Marine who are also on The Staffs and Worcs near Autherley Junction. In my experience a good old jobbing boatyard will tackle this sort of problem with much less drama than a posh marina will. 

 

I hope you get it sorted very soon 

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8 hours ago, David Mack said:

People add material like sawdust or coconut husk to a compost loo. Is paper really any different?

 

 

I'm reluctant to further derail the OPs thread or indeed to get into a Q+A session, but I will indulge your curiosity a final time regarding these grisly details.

And this was only my own procedure, I cant speak for others: 

 

I used a sort of ground up coco coir, formed into solid bricks that needed to be partially rehydrated and broken up. 

This thick powdery material was decanted onto the solid waste after using the toilet, and covered the waste completely- this prevents any smells escaping. 

 

The problem with paper is that it obstructs the flow of the powder material, prevents it from settling around the waste and covering it. I found that paper was not compressed by the very lightweight coco coir, and instead it forms structures and air pockets. In my case this necessitated the use of much larger amounts of coco coir to form an effective covering, requiring the waste bag to be changed every week or so, rather than 3-4 weeks without paper. 

 

So yes. Paper is very different to coco coir. 

 

 

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I trust that the paper bin proponents are aware that our continental cousins use a little hose pipe or a bidet to rinse their botties and the paper is only used to pat their botties dry.

They must be very confused when they first use a UK toilet where neither botty cleaning method is provided.  I have visions of them trying to get their bums over the wash basin which would be a little embarrassing in a motorway service station.

They consider UK toileting habits to be mediaeval.

Edited by Murflynn
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3 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

I trust that the paper bin users are aware that our continental cousins use a little hose pipe or a bidet to rinse their botties and the paper is only used to pat their botties dry.

 

 

The issue of bidets is perhaps one involving all paper users, rather than specifically those using paper bins.

 

In fact the absence of bidets in the UK, for me personally, gives a strong case for the use of wet wipes. 

 

The problem for wet wipes seems to be their indestructibility and challenges for the sewerage system for household-based flushing toilet users. 

Its a small comfort to know that by using a bin and bag to dispose of wet wipes, I am reducing the stress on our sewerage systems. Perhaps all household users should be given this message and much more loudly, instead of it being written on the side of a van.

But the idea of not using wet wipes at all is not a welcome one, to be honest. I pined for this kind of product for decades before it became a reality, and made several botched attempts to improvise a wet wipe system.

Wet wipes do a better job, and they do it more quickly and comfortably, than dry paper ever could. 

 

Long live wet wipes (until we all get bidets)!

 

 

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3 hours ago, cheshire~rose said:

When I have visited boats with dump through loos I really find the smell that goes with the toilet system unpleasant. That is a big tick in a box for me with regard a mascerator.

When I was fitting VS out in my ignorance I bought a dump through. Fortunately before fitting it I found myself on a boat with one. I also found the smell unpleasant and had a re-think before dumping it 😁 and buying a sea toilet. Never regretted it.

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7 minutes ago, Slim said:

When I was fitting VS out in my ignorance I bought a dump through. Fortunately before fitting it I found myself on a boat with one. I also found the smell unpleasant and had a re-think before dumping it 😁 and buying a sea toilet. Never regretted it.

 

Unfortunately the smell is often because the hull builders/boat fitters only fit a single and very much undersized tank breather. You need two, the larger the better so at least 1" ID, at opposite ends of the tank so you get a free flow of air  across the contents. It is even better if you fit a computer fan in one breather to extract air from the tank. Mine was controlled by a simple time switch that you pressed as you entered the compartment and it ran for about 20 minutes. If that is not long enough just press it again.  Don't blame the toilet systems for incorrect installation.

 

On  several occasions we moored close to boats with macerators or vacuum toilets and when the toilets were flushed the stink outside the b  at was almost gut wrenching. That is because the tank breather was inadequate so the tank was stabved of oxygen and anaerobic decomposition was taking place in the tank.

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1 hour ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Unfortunately the smell is often because the hull builders/boat fitters only fit a single and very much undersized tank breather. You need two, the larger the better so at least 1" ID, at opposite ends of the tank so you get a free flow of air  across the contents. It is even better if you fit a computer fan in one breather to extract air from the tank. Mine was controlled by a simple time switch that you pressed as you entered the compartment and it ran for about 20 minutes. If that is not long enough just press it again.  Don't blame the toilet systems for incorrect installation.

 

On  several occasions we moored close to boats with macerators or vacuum toilets and when the toilets were flushed the stink outside the b  at was almost gut wrenching. That is because the tank breather was inadequate so the tank was stabved of oxygen and anaerobic decomposition was taking place in the tank.

Or perhaps that the owner had used insufficient Elsan Blue?

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3 hours ago, Tony1 said:

The problem for wet wipes seems to be their indestructibility and challenges for the sewerage system for household-based flushing toilet users. 

Its a small comfort to know that by using a bin and bag to dispose of wet wipes, I am reducing the stress on our sewerage systems. Perhaps all household users should be given this message and much more loudly, instead of it being written on the side of a van.

 

It would help if it didn't say "Flushable" on the packaging

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49 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

It would help if it didn't say "Flushable" on the packaging

And biodegradable!  It does not say how long they take to biodegrade, I believe it is years.

I knew of a farm where they sometimes sprayed sewage sludge on the fields. The wipes are lying out in the open for months and only disappear when the cattle tread them into the mud or they blow away.

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  • 7 months later...

After 3 years and 2 replacements we have finally ditched the Vetus macerator toilet system. We have replaced it with a Seperatte Tiny compost/separator toilet. 
 

the advantages are as follows. 
 

1 no pump outs required 

2 no smell as long as you keep the 12v fan running  and have it vented. 

3 can’t block it with wet wipes 

4. As there is no flush the liquid waste is max 2 litres per person per day. 
5. No water supply needed. 
6. It looks like a normal toilet and not a cassette 

 

Disadvantages are as follows 

 

1. You need to dispose of solid waste eg in a compost bin every few days. That’s still easier than getting a pump out. 
 

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1 minute ago, LiverpoolBoat said:

After 3 years and 2 replacements we have finally ditched the Vetus macerator toilet system. We have replaced it with a Seperatte Tiny compost/separator toilet. 
 

the advantages are as follows. 
 

1 no pump outs required 

2 no smell as long as you keep the 12v fan running  and have it vented. 

3 can’t block it with wet wipes 

4. As there is no flush the liquid waste is max 2 litres per person per day. 
5. No water supply needed. 
6. It looks like a normal toilet and not a cassette 

 

Disadvantages are as follows 

 

1. You need to dispose of solid waste eg in a compost bin every few days. That’s still easier than getting a pump out. 
 

 

If you have a legal means of disposing of said compost -- some boaters do, many don't (or didn't)... 😉

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