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a short 40ft 'ish historic wanted


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On 17/03/2022 at 04:24, Captain Pegg said:

 

Mine can be found quite easily, but alas it's not for sale. Anyway it's just old, rather than historic.

 

I just looked at the boat name and did a little Googling around. I knew a boat in the very (very) early 1970's called Vulpes that looked very like yours - although it was unfinished (brick ballast floor in the otherwise-empty cabin). I was lucky enough to be lent that boat several times by the first owner and have very happy memories of it, and still bear the scar on my thumb where I used an empty pineapple can to empty the aft bilge at Autherley. It would make me unreasonably happy to know it still exists.

 

I did what is now called the Four Counties Ring (including Thurlwood Steel Lock) and whatever the ring is called that goes down the Staffs & Worcs, up Stourbridge 16, Netherton Tunnel and back down the Wolverhampton 21 before returning to Wheaton Aston (my newbie crew were appalled to find that climbing the 16 required going back down the 21).

Edited by GilesMorris
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8 hours ago, David Mack said:

Best opportunity you'll get

Governor

 

 

You are probably right but we had the chance pre advert and declined - we are constrained by our mooring to 35-40 and not keen on riveted iron - luverly boat but its a bit too old for us (iron) and we are a bit too old for it (too heavy and too long) 10 years ago I would have bought it like a shot.

J

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23 hours ago, GilesMorris said:

 

I just looked at the boat name and did a little Googling around. I knew a boat in the very (very) early 1970's called Vulpes that looked very like yours - although it was unfinished (brick ballast floor in the otherwise-empty cabin). I was lucky enough to be lent that boat several times by the first owner and have very happy memories of it, and still bear the scar on my thumb where I used an empty pineapple can to empty the aft bilge at Autherley. It would make me unreasonably happy to know it still exists.

 

I did what is now called the Four Counties Ring (including Thurlwood Steel Lock) and whatever the ring is called that goes down the Staffs & Worcs, up Stourbridge 16, Netherton Tunnel and back down the Wolverhampton 21 before returning to Wheaton Aston (my newbie crew were appalled to find that climbing the 16 required going back down the 21).

 

Hello Giles,

 

Yes, it's the same boat. Originally owned by the Turner's of Wheaton Aston garage.

 

Jon Pegg

 

 

117949559_3403700536342834_7387044765296232425_n (2).jpg

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48 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

 

Hello Giles,

 

Yes, it's the same boat. Originally owned by the Turner's of Wheaton Aston garage.

 

Jon Pegg

 

 

117949559_3403700536342834_7387044765296232425_n (2).jpg

I thought, then and now, that it's an exceptionally beautiful boat, and a worthy successor to Fox. Derek fitted an engine (Petter?)  he said had spent it's early life in a dump truck before he bought it for peanuts. The gear lever was right beneath your foot as you steered and I wore a hole in the sole of a shoe from shifting it (no knob). The best part of one trip was borrowing a lovely scottie dog to go with the boat. I got shouted at for taking Vulpes through Harecastle by the light of an oil lamp with flashlight for backup, but it seemed fine to me. 

 

I'm SO glad that this boat still exists and looks so beautiful.

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2 minutes ago, GilesMorris said:

I thought, then and now, that it's an exceptionally beautiful boat, and a worthy successor to Fox. Derek fitted an engine (Petter?)  he said had spent it's early life in a dump truck before he bought it for peanuts. The gear lever was right beneath your foot as you steered and I wore a hole in the sole of a shoe from shifting it (no knob). The best part of one trip was borrowing a lovely scottie dog to go with the boat. I got shouted at for taking Vulpes through Harecastle by the light of an oil lamp with flashlight for backup, but it seemed fine to me. 

 

I'm SO glad that this boat still exists and looks so beautiful.

 

That air cooled Petter didn't last long and nor did it's similar replacement. It had a new water cooled Petter in 1975 and the block of that still remains with various replacement bits off a couple of other engines. The gearbox is slightly more modern, well it's controlled by a cable anyway.

 

There is also a replacement boat terrier.

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On 22/03/2022 at 23:18, GilesMorris said:

I thought, then and now, that it's an exceptionally beautiful boat, and a worthy successor to Fox. 

One of Denis Cooper's "Hampton" class tugs, usually 35' long. the fore-end of Vulpes can just be seen on the cover of the June 1973 Waterways World magazine. Denis had a leaflet where they were figured quite strongly. Timber top, usually with a PH2 Petter fitted. Great little boats, I don't know how many were made, but I wrote this here, in 2013:

  •  

"Denis Cooper WAS Canal Transport Services (CTS) at Pelsall. As far as I'm aware, CTS, now run by Denis's son, Matthew, is still going. I think Denis retired some years ago. They were one of the first builders of pleasure boats in the modern era, and specialised in delightful little 35' tugs called the Hampton class. They were well-built, handsome boats, and Denis, a straight speaking bloke, was always a pleasure to meet. In my opinion, you couldn't find a better boat if you're looking at one of his. His early ones were timber topped, with all that that implies, but lovely boats all the same. No connection whatsoever."

 

 

Posted August 14, 2013Denis Cooper WAS Canal Transport Services (CTS) at Pelsall. As far as I'm aware, CTS, now run by Denis's son, Matthew, is still going. I think Denis retired some years ago. They were one of the first builders of pleasure boats in the modern era, and specialised in delightful little 35' tugs called the Hampton class. They were well-built, handsome boats, and Denis, a straight speaking bloke, was always a pleasure to meet. In my opinion, you couldn't find a better boat if you're looking at one of his. His early ones were timber topped, with all that that implies, but lovely boats all the same. No connection whatsoever.
Denis Cooper WAS Canal Transport Services (CTS) at Pelsall. As far as I'm aware, CTS, now run by Denis's son, Matthew, is still going. I think Denis retired some years ago. They were one of the first builders of pleasure boats in the modern era, and specialised in delightful little 35' tugs called the Hampton class. They were well-built, handsome boats, and Denis, a straight speaking bloke, was always a pleasure to meet. In my opinion, you couldn't find a better boat if you're looking at one of his. His early ones were timber topped, with all that that implies, but lovely boats all the same. No connection whatsoever.
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On 25/03/2022 at 09:08, johnthebridge said:

One of Denis Cooper's "Hampton" class tugs, usually 35' long. the fore-end of Vulpes can just be seen on the cover of the June 1973 Waterways World magazine. Denis had a leaflet where they were figured quite strongly. Timber top, usually with a PH2 Petter fitted. Great little boats, I don't know how many were made, but I wrote this here, in 2013:

  •  

"Denis Cooper WAS Canal Transport Services (CTS) at Pelsall. As far as I'm aware, CTS, now run by Denis's son, Matthew, is still going. I think Denis retired some years ago. They were one of the first builders of pleasure boats in the modern era, and specialised in delightful little 35' tugs called the Hampton class. They were well-built, handsome boats, and Denis, a straight speaking bloke, was always a pleasure to meet. In my opinion, you couldn't find a better boat if you're looking at one of his. His early ones were timber topped, with all that that implies, but lovely boats all the same. No connection whatsoever."

 

 

 
Posted August 14, 2013Denis Cooper WAS Canal Transport Services (CTS) at Pelsall. As far as I'm aware, CTS, now run by Denis's son, Matthew, is still going. I think Denis retired some years ago. They were one of the first builders of pleasure boats in the modern era, and specialised in delightful little 35' tugs called the Hampton class. They were well-built, handsome boats, and Denis, a straight speaking bloke, was always a pleasure to meet. In my opinion, you couldn't find a better boat if you're looking at one of his. His early ones were timber topped, with all that that implies, but lovely boats all the same. No connection whatsoever.
 
Denis Cooper WAS Canal Transport Services (CTS) at Pelsall. As far as I'm aware, CTS, now run by Denis's son, Matthew, is still going. I think Denis retired some years ago. They were one of the first builders of pleasure boats in the modern era, and specialised in delightful little 35' tugs called the Hampton class. They were well-built, handsome boats, and Denis, a straight speaking bloke, was always a pleasure to meet. In my opinion, you couldn't find a better boat if you're looking at one of his. His early ones were timber topped, with all that that implies, but lovely boats all the same. No connection whatsoever.

 

I think there were three such boats, Vulpes being the first built. At least one of the others still exists, Hexa, which was belonged to fender maker Alf Langford who featured in Waterways World and even on TV. It moors at Huddlesford and still retains a timber top, but appears to have been lengthened.

 

The steelwork was fabricated by Tony Wakeley who later moved to Water Travel at Autherley. The boat Omega which may be familiar to regular cruisers of the BCN was built there in 1983 according to the boat listing in Canal Plan and it has a very similar shape and dimensions to Vulpes. However the owner of that craft claims it was built by Les Allen in 1965.  

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1 hour ago, Captain Pegg said:

 

I think there were three such boats, Vulpes being the first built. At least one of the others still exists, Hexa, which was belonged to fender maker Alf Langford who featured in Waterways World and even on TV. It moors at Huddlesford and still retains a timber top, but appears to have been lengthened.

 

The steelwork was fabricated by Tony Wakeley who later moved to Water Travel at Autherley. The boat Omega which may be familiar to regular cruisers of the BCN was built there in 1983 according to the boat listing in Canal Plan and it has a very similar shape and dimensions to Vulpes. However the owner of that craft claims it was built by Les Allen in 1965.  

Yes, I remember those you mention. I seem to think Roger Hatchard's "Hasty" was another, but without speaking to him, I can't be certain.

"Omega" was most definitely one of Tim Cashin's boats and was originally fitted with a 9hp Bolinder pup. I nearly did a deal with the then (original) owner against Vulcan but, if I had to say, that was earlier than 1983. Maybe not!

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The dollies will tell you whether it was Allens of Oldbury or CTS. They are different shapes. Also the details of the plain bearing at the top of the elum tube. 

 

I had a nice old Les Allen boat for a while. It was an early one and someone told me it was Bob Allen who built it. Boat is still around and now called KERENSA it was originally called MALBEN and in my ownership I called it INFLEXIBLE. 

 

These 70s and 80s proper modern boats are really nice items. Allen's, CTS, GM engineering, water travel and a few others did know what to do and it shows. Getting a bit old now though so some of them will be burdened by bad over plating I suppose. 

 

 

 

Edited by magnetman
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This is the Omega I am referring to. Not sure on reflection why I thought it was built in 1983 but given the similarity between the boats in question and registration information stating that Omega was built at the yard where the fabricator of CTS's Hampton tugs later worked it all adds up. Vulpes was built by CTS and overplated at Water Travel by the same steel fabricator.

 

The Mailbox - Gas Street Basin - narrowboat - Omega Ashwoo… | Flickr

 

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1 hour ago, johnthebridge said:

Yes, I remember those you mention. I seem to think Roger Hatchard's "Hasty" was another, but without speaking to him, I can't be certain.

"Omega" was most definitely one of Tim Cashin's boats and was originally fitted with a 9hp Bolinder pup. I nearly did a deal with the then (original) owner against Vulcan but, if I had to say, that was earlier than 1983. Maybe not!

 

1 minute ago, Captain Pegg said:

This is the Omega I am referring to. Not sure on reflection why I thought it was built in 1983 but given the similarity between the boats in question and registration information stating that Omega was built at the yard where the fabricator of CTS's Hampton tugs later worked it all adds up. Vulpes was built by CTS and overplated at Water Travel by the same steel fabricator.

 

The Mailbox - Gas Street Basin - narrowboat - Omega Ashwoo… | Flickr

 

John Parrott (spelling?) was the owner who I tried to do a deal with. I now can't remember if he had anything to with it but David Harris worked for Tim Cashin for a while. Omega had less freeboard than Denis Cooper's boats and the plating was pretty wavy if I remember correctly and her plating thickness was fairly "economical". To my eye she didn't have quite the lines of the CTS boats.

  • Greenie 1
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We have a sister boat to Vulpes

Have owned vessel for the last 7 years

Dennis Cooper ( CTS ) built 1960s

Originally 35 ft open tug , extended to 42 ft

Now has full metal cabin and a single cylinder lister jp engine installed .

Boat is now named Turmoil

CRT index number 66890

Unfortunately boat will soon be up for sale

After survey etc

  • Greenie 1
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5 minutes ago, Fugly said:

We have a sister boat to Vulpes

Have owned vessel for the last 7 years

Dennis Cooper ( CTS ) built 1960s

Originally 35 ft open tug , extended to 42 ft

Now has full metal cabin and a single cylinder lister jp engine installed .

Boat is now named Turmoil

CRT index number 66890

Unfortunately boat will soon be up for sale

After survey etc

 

I have PM'd you - shame she has been extended 😂

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13 minutes ago, Fugly said:

We have a sister boat to Vulpes

Have owned vessel for the last 7 years

Dennis Cooper ( CTS ) built 1960s

Originally 35 ft open tug , extended to 42 ft

Now has full metal cabin and a single cylinder lister jp engine installed .

Boat is now named Turmoil

CRT index number 66890

Unfortunately boat will soon be up for sale

After survey etc

I don't think I've ever seen a Lister JP1 - must be a rare bird.

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Update

 

We have just bought a new 4m RIB/15hp Honda to keep us afloat, take the pressure off buying and allow us to wait for the "right" boat - this will be our last proper boat (if indeed it happens at all) and the more we reflect, our "needs" are pretty specific - and we're not interested in compromising.........

 

I have always had a soft spot for "special" short boats and that is what we really want as we are unlikely to stay more than 1-2 nights at a time on her in our ownership.

 

Its already interesting what this 'topic" has generated..............

 

Good to see "Governor" has quickly gone to a new home - she/he was never going to hang about......................

 

J

Edited by Movin' on
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3 hours ago, Athy said:

I don't think I've ever seen a Lister JP1 - must be a rare bird.

I've seen a couple come up on ebay over the years. Both industrials - I don't imagine they made a marine version. One of them came from a technical college or similar where it had been used to train mechanics on diesel engines, so it had probably been stripped down and reassembled many times.

  • Greenie 1
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On 26/03/2022 at 20:23, Captain Pegg said:

This is the Omega I am referring to. Not sure on reflection why I thought it was built in 1983 but given the similarity between the boats in question and registration information stating that Omega was built at the yard where the fabricator of CTS's Hampton tugs later worked it all adds up. Vulpes was built by CTS and overplated at Water Travel by the same steel fabricator.

 

The Mailbox - Gas Street Basin - narrowboat - Omega Ashwoo… | Flickr

 

Those dollies are not from CTS. I think that particular shape was from Water Travel at Autherley. Might be wrong but usually CTS boats had more of a dumbbell shape. 

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1 hour ago, David Mack said:

I've seen a couple come up on ebay over the years. Both industrials - I don't imagine they made a marine version. One of them came from a technical college or similar where it had been used to train mechanics on diesel engines, so it had probably been stripped down and reassembled many times.

So, a similar animal to Gardner's 1L2 which was classified, I think, as a "laboratory engine", though I have seen one in a narrowboat. I've also seen a single-cylinder RN, dunno what that was built for.

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