Dredging finds at Cannock

[Tacet]

On 20/01/2022 at 16:33, Athy said:

 

   But then, gas mantles were a part of everyday life for many thousands of people a few generations ago, but I don't think I've ever seen one working except in a museum.

I installed a gas mantle lamp in my house.  Very nice - and reasonably useful in an electric power cut. 

Oddly, the gas safety chap seemed to not to notice it when providing his certificate; is lighting covered in the training?

[John Brightley]

On 20/01/2022 at 16:33, Athy said:

One doesn't know whether to laugh or cry. Coal was just part of the pattern of life for the great majority of British people until probably the 1980s - although I suppose our air is cleaner, it is sad to see it become a curio or a museum piece. I even note that some new houses are built without a chimney. I'd never want to live in a house without a fireplace or stove.

   But then, gas mantles were a part of everyday life for many thousands of people a few generations ago, but I don't think I've ever seen one working except in a museum.

I work for one of the major housebuilders. None of our houses are built with a 'real' chimney, though about 5% have dummy chimneys installed, insisted upon by the local authority planning departments.

Regarding gas lights, there are still a few properties in mid-Wales which aren't connected to electricity and use them, such as Dolgoch Youth Hostel https://www.elenydd-hostels.co.uk/en/our/dolgoch-hostel. Some of the traditional hardware shops in the area still stock the mantles.

[Tonka]

14 minutes ago, John Brightley said:

I work for one of the major housebuilders. None of our houses are built with a 'real' chimney, though about 5% have dummy chimneys installed, insisted upon by the local authority planning departments.

Regarding gas lights, there are still a few properties in mid-Wales which aren't connected to electricity and use them, such as Dolgoch Youth Hostel https://www.elenydd-hostels.co.uk/en/our/dolgoch-hostel. Some of the traditional hardware shops in the area still stock the mantles.

In 1978 Southall College used to have gas lighting as their emergency backup lighting. You got a right telling off from the head if you broke a mantle

On 20/01/2022 at 16:14, noddyboater said:

I was in a local solid fuel yard last year when a well dressed bloke came in and asked for a single piece of real coal.  It turned out he was a teacher and wanted to pass the lump around in class as his kids didn't have a clue what it was.

and did the coal yard give him one lump of coal or did they give him that smokeless look a likey coal

[Athy]

42 minutes ago, John Brightley said:

I work for one of the major housebuilders. None of our houses are built with a 'real' chimney,

Why not?

As a boy I lived in a Sheffield semi, one of an avenue of such houses built about 1919. Not only did they have fireplaces and (therefore) chimneys, but every one had a coalhouse attached. I wonder how many people know what a coalhouse is these days.

 

[Tonka]

20 minutes ago, Athy said:

Why not?

As a boy I lived in a Sheffield semi, one of an avenue of such houses built about 1919. Not only did they have fireplaces and (therefore) chimneys, but every one had a coalhouse attached. I wonder how many people know what a coalhouse is these days.

 

A lot of 2 ups/ 2 downs in Sheffield also had outside toilets and no bathrooms. I had a relation who used to live in Rudyard Terrace. She also had no fridge and used to hang stuff to be kept cold on cellar head  

[Athy]

10 minutes ago, Tonka said:

 

 

10 minutes ago, Tonka said:

She also had no fridge and used to hang stuff to be kept cold on cellar head  

We didn't get our first fridge until I was about 11. I remember it was a Bendix, a discontinued model which Dad had spotted greatly reduced in price in an electrical shop, and was so bulky that it had to live in the hall because it wouldn't fit into the kitchen. But our house, in common I think with most or all our neighbours', had the pantry under the stairs; in place of a glazed window, it had a mesh "window" which allowed air to circulate and thus helped keep food cool, though I think it used to fight a losing battle in the summer.

Edited January 23, 2022 by Athy

[ditchcrawler]

1 hour ago, Athy said:

Why not?

As a boy I lived in a Sheffield semi, one of an avenue of such houses built about 1919. Not only did they have fireplaces and (therefore) chimneys, but every one had a coalhouse attached. I wonder how many people know what a coalhouse is these days.

 

Why not, Maybe because houses are all central heated now, gas or electric. Burning stuff is now frowned upon with the coming of clean air acts.

[Athy]

3 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

Why not, Maybe because houses are all central heated now, gas or electric. Burning stuff is now frowned upon with the coming of clean air acts.

Central heating and living fires are not mutually exclusive: the house which my parents had built for them in 1963 had both, and the last three houses which Mrs. Athy and I have lived in have had both

   I'm sure that many people would prefer a new house with a fireplace: not only does it look and feel cosy when the fire or stove is lit, but it's extremely useful when you have a power cut! Our central heating is oil-fired, but it needs electricity to trigger it.

[Tonka]

17 minutes ago, Athy said:

Central heating and living fires are not mutually exclusive: the house which my parents had built for them in 1963 had both, and the last three houses which Mrs. Athy and I have lived in have had both

   I'm sure that many people would prefer a new house with a fireplace: not only does it look and feel cosy when the fire or stove is lit, but it's extremely useful when you have a power cut! Our central heating is oil-fired, but it needs electricity to trigger it.

and here am i sat in front of a Solid fuel fire with a back boiler which heats the house and water via a Dunsley Neutralizer 

[Athy]

20 minutes ago, Tonka said:

and here am i sat in front of a Solid fuel fire with a back boiler which heats the house and water via a Dunsley Neutralizer 

Our semi in Sheffield had a back boiler, which was the only means of heating water until my parents had an immersion heater installed. That meant that you had to keep a fire going in the lounge all the time if you wanted hot water. I remember summer days when we had all the lounge windows open because it was so blooming hot. My parents reckoned that if sunlight shone on the (coal) fire it would sulk and possibly go out, so they would draw a curtain to prevent sunlight shining on the fireplace. I dismissed this as tosh until I heard a line in a Bob Dylan song "Crying like a fire in the sun", so perhaps there was some truth in it.

   As well as the back boiler, the fire also drove a back oven in the kitchen, though I don't think Mum used it much. She would dry teatowels in it, and occasionally cook a rice pudding (which apparently are best when slow-cooked) in it.

   I'm not familiar with Mr. Dunsley and his neutraliser.

[Tonka]

17 minutes ago, Athy said:

Our semi in Sheffield had a back boiler, which was the only means of heating water until my parents had an immersion heater installed. That meant that you had to keep a fire going in the lounge all the time if you wanted hot water. I remember summer days when we had all the lounge windows open because it was so blooming hot. My parents reckoned that if sunlight shone on the (coal) fire it would sulk and possibly go out, so they would draw a curtain to prevent sunlight shining on the fireplace. I dismissed this as tosh until I heard a line in a Bob Dylan song "Crying like a fire in the sun", so perhaps there was some truth in it.

   As well as the back boiler, the fire also drove a back oven in the kitchen, though I don't think Mum used it much. She would dry teatowels in it, and occasionally cook a rice pudding (which apparently are best when slow-cooked) in it.

   I'm not familiar with Mr. Dunsley and his neutraliser.

We have an immersion which gets powered when the solar panels are exporting power via a solar controller. The Dunsley Neutraliser allows the back boiler or/and the oil boiler to heat house and water. We also have a stove in the front room which only gets used in very severe weather. 

[Dorlan]

On 20/01/2022 at 16:33, Athy said:

<snip>

   But then, gas mantles were a part of everyday life for many thousands of people a few generations ago, but I don't think I've ever seen one working except in a museum.

My aunt had gas lighting in her shop in the South Wales valleys, which was used when there were power cuts. The photo below was taken sometime in the 1990s...

[ditchcrawler]

4 hours ago, Athy said:

Central heating and living fires are not mutually exclusive: the house which my parents had built for them in 1963 had both, and the last three houses which Mrs. Athy and I have lived in have had both

   I'm sure that many people would prefer a new house with a fireplace: not only does it look and feel cosy when the fire or stove is lit, but it's extremely useful when you have a power cut! Our central heating is oil-fired, but it needs electricity to trigger it.

That was over 50 years ago, times have moved on

[Athy]

6 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

That was over 50 years ago, times have moved on

Are you suggesting that reducing from two sources of home heating to one is some sort of progress? I don't think so.

Regularly, in these pages, people are advised to have two (or more) ways of heating their boat - same applies to their home, it's just common sense. Add the enhanced quality of life which a living fire offers, and it's a no contest.

[David Mack]

We had a power cut 22 hours before my daughter's Masters dissertation was due to be submitted.That certainly makes you aware how dependent we are on a mains power supply.  No heating, no lighting, she could continue working only as long as the laptop battery lasted, but with the Internet router not working there would be no way to upload the final document.

[Tonka]

16 minutes ago, Athy said:

Are you suggesting that reducing from two sources of home heating to one is some sort of progress? I don't think so.

Regularly, in these pages, people are advised to have two (or more) ways of heating their boat - same applies to their home, it's just common sense. Add the enhanced quality of life which a living fire offers, and it's a no contest.

Also look at the price of gas at the moment and they reckon it will go up again in April.

[dave moore]

We have an open fire in our lounge, although this is the first winter for years that we haven’t lit it....a combination of a new carpet in front of the hearth and an abdominal hernia from previous surgery which makes me wary of lifting anything over heavy. Must be getting old.......

[Athy]

14 minutes ago, Tonka said:

Also look at the price of gas at the moment and they reckon it will go up again in April.

Yes, I'm pleased that we have no gas in the house (heating, hot water and cooking all oil-fired). Mind you, oil ain't cheap at the moment either!

Currently our wood for the stove is free. We had our landing stage rebuilt last summer, and the contractor sliced up the old decking planks into foot-long pieces at no extra charge, so we're burning those. I haven't counted them, but we probably still have a few hundred stacked up in the garage.

Edited January 23, 2022 by Athy

[Heartland]

I recall having to purchase coal on behalf of British Rail for Signal boxes on Leamington and Stratford upon Avon Line and gas oil for the lamp man some of which went into the early 1990's.

 

Some of the older boxes also had gas lighting, before BR provided electric. I still have a Great Western Railway gas mantle in its box. Others that came into my possession were sent on to the National Railway Museum

 

In the 1950's and 1960's my parents purchased coal which was stored in a coal house. Later we bought coke and then went onto gas heating

 

As to canal properties I wonder if any still need gas for lighting, in the out of the way locations.

 

There still seems to be need for coal supplied by Canal boat traders, perhaps again somebody can confirm.

[Derek R.]

As a nipper in N. London I can remember coalie with 1cwt sack on his shoulder, walking through the front door and two rooms to access the coal shed in the back yard. Outside toilet, no bathroom.

When my sister got married in '52, they lived in a basement flat in Primrose hill. Terraced houses of three floors (plus basement) and each house had a circular manhole in the pavement for coal to be tipped down.

Coalie still supplies us with 50kg open sacks tipped in the coal shed, though it's ovoids. Half a tonne £215.

 

Lots of boats use the black stuff as well as canaside properties. In the house we have a multi fuel in one room, an open fireplace (Edwardian) in another, and an oil fired (52p per litre) Rayburn in the kitchen that heats the water and we cook on. One upstairs bedroom has a Georgian Hob grate, titchy little thing, but the chimney for that has been capped. Stacks of free wood in the round, some of which I'll be chainsawing up this week. Carbon plenty.

[GilesMorris]

7 hours ago, dave moore said:

We have an open fire in our lounge, although this is the first winter for years that we haven’t lit it....a combination of a new carpet in front of the hearth and an abdominal hernia from previous surgery which makes me wary of lifting anything over heavy. Must be getting old.......

Decades ago I was lucky enough to live in a beautiful, and largely original, 18th century cottage (obligatory canal connection: it is very close to Great Haywood lock) whose only means of heating was an open coal fire. If I never have to clean and lay an open fire again it will be a day too soon. (As I write the central heating is keeping me warm and the gas hearth is feeling cozy.)

[mark99]

My farm house has fancy underfloor heating and heat pump, back up oil boiler 50kw.

 

I've never used it this winter for heating. 9kW multifuel burner - acres of overgrown woodland and a tonne Welsh anthracite has done me good. The main room tops 30c most nights forcing the doors to be opened.

 

There is no gas where we are. Well there is in the main village but its 1.5 miles away.

 

Was off power for this winter 22 hours. Warm and food cooked off the stove.

Edited January 24, 2022 by mark99

[Stroudwater1]

The houses just down from us have no mains gas either - its more common than people realise in villages. the village I used to live in had no gas at all.

 

Many of the Strett lights on the roads round Malvern are gas lamps. The numbers working seem to vary in quotes from 80-100 though there were upwards of 1000 originally. 

 

https://www.visitthemalverns.org/attraction/gas-lamps-in-malvern/

 

Ive stayed in a cottage above Aberdovey and in a caravan with gas lamps in the 1980s, they are lovely, the light is good and the noise is rather soothing. 

[David Mack]

3 hours ago, mark99 said:

There is no gas where we are. Well there is in the main village but its 1.5 miles away.

The gas supply to our house was taken out in about 1973, but next door still has gas. When the main was renewed about 5 years ago, I enquired about getting it extended the 75 yards or so to our house. They quoted £14,000! And that just to get a pipe to a meter box on the wall outside. Extra for a meter, new internal gas pipework and a new boiler. We decided to stick with oil!

[JamesWoolcock]

17 minutes ago, David Mack said:

The gas supply to our house was taken out in about 1973, but next door still has gas. When the main was renewed about 5 years ago, I enquired about getting it extended the 75 yards or so to our house. They quoted £14,000! And that just to get a pipe to a meter box on the wall outside. Extra for a meter, new internal gas pipework and a new boiler. We decided to stick with oil!

Or how not to gain a new customer.