New Foot Br over Duck Mill Lk Bedford.

[oboat]

We were much further up on the left in the shade. G Plant still on the roof.

[enigmatic]

10 hours ago, oboat said:

Boats just doing an about turn, I put down to a combination of:- 

 

A). All the negative stories about low headroom and no city moorings in guide books as mentioned on ML.
B). Rumour mongering by parochial cruiser owners who don’t go past Carlingford Lk but complain bitterly about Nb on their river.
C). A total marketing failure by Bedford CC staff who have no idea how the river could help the town.

 

 

Suspect you can add (D) Bedford itself doesn't have the greatest of reputations even though the waterfront's lovely and (E) Castle Mill lock is a bit deep and scary compared with other locks on that part of the system so very tempting to turn near Great Barford for a lot of people,. Possibly also (F) the town centre bit is dominated by rowers, though avoiding them is quite fun and probably not too challengig for any cruisers that can get through.

 

14 hours ago, oboat said:

 

Thanks.
I understand your reluctance to try the upstream Rail Bridge.
As I don’t think ML would have got under the old DML bridge, but they did get under the RE & the rail bridge.
Perhaps a marker is now required on the DML guillotine stanchion (as on the Sleaford) would help on this. 
Re GOBA mooring:  No nether did we.
 The old swimming pool mooring, is adjacent to the water point and is or was the official mooring for the town. (It was the site of the old wharf and a boat builder). See http://www.braggaboutlife.com/uk-waterways/great-ouse-bedford-to-kempston-mill for the funny story and our nights entertainment in it. 
It’s also the best mooring for the Market, Town, John Bunion Museum and the Station if you intend to take the opportunity of a trip to Bletchley Park.
Your choice of mooring location confirms Pauls comment about, boats being here today and gone tomorrow. I never gave that location a thought. 

I did stop there overnight but didn't see any water polo!

 

The pyramid was (and probably still is) an indoor swimming pool too.

 

 

[David Mack]

1 hour ago, enigmatic said:

Possibly also (F) the town centre bit is dominated by rowers,

 

We moored in the middle of Bedford on a Saturday night in August 2001, and woke up next morning to find 237 swimmers in the river, taking part in the Bedford Triathlon!

 

Edited December 5, 2021 by David Mack

[enigmatic]

49 minutes ago, David Mack said:

 

We moored in the middle of Bedford on a Saturday night in August 2001, and woke up next morning to find 237 swimmers in the river, taking part in the Bedford Triathlon!

 

Could have been interesting with the rowers and swimmers competing, but I think the swimmers were probably just happy enough at the lack of anglers

[oboat]

17 hours ago, enigmatic said:

 

Suspect you can add (D) Bedford itself doesn't have the greatest of reputations even though the waterfront's lovely and (E) Castle Mill lock is a bit deep and scary compared with other locks on that part of the system so very tempting to turn near Great Barford for a lot of people,. Possibly also (F) the town centre bit is dominated by rowers, though avoiding them is quite fun and probably not too challengig for any cruisers that can get through.

 

I did stop there overnight but didn't see any water polo!

 

The pyramid was (and probably still is) an indoor swimming pool too.

 

 

I have been desperately trying to confine my critique to the lower river and now failing.
Thus, for your (D), I would have to say that Bedford did have an appalling traffic problem which I hope has now been solved.
If not, it could take a leaf from Newbery on the K&A and close the town bridge between 7:30am and 6:30pm. Could be interesting!

With regard to (E) Castle Mill Lk, we did not notice anything special (other than the paddle gear) about it, however the EA only give a drop of 3’-11”? but Canal Plan gives as you say 8’-10”, very odd.
 If anything, Cardington should be (E) due to its width of only 10’-3”. I recently read a blog item regarding a GRP boat jammed in it. The top coping stone overhanging into the chamber by about 1”. Just looked for it again but could not find it again unfortunately.
It was recommended for widening in a consultant’s report some time back. 
So, another item lifting the RE bridge could shorten the odds on.
I do know the GRP boats don’t like this lock. May be worth an inspection to check its status now?
The EA need some new work to justify the new fees, LOL.

[enigmatic]

Castle Mill is about 16' to the bottom if you include the 8' of concrete wall above the highest water level. Behaves well, but it's a lot more ladder and rope involved than elsewhere on the Gt Ouse. Cardington I remember mainly for the really, really stiff bottom gate

 

[Scholar Gypsy]

Castle Mill: in case anyone wants to estimate the depth themselves, you can see the water line. Looks like about a 7 or 8 foot  rise with same again on top to allow for flooding.

 

Edited December 6, 2021 by Scholar Gypsy

[PaulJ]

On 05/12/2021 at 17:52, enigmatic said:

 

Suspect you can add (D) Bedford itself doesn't have the greatest of reputations even though the waterfront's lovely and (E) Castle Mill lock is a bit deep and scary compared with other locks on that part of the system so very tempting to turn near Great Barford for a lot of people,. Possibly also (F) the town centre bit is dominated by rowers, though avoiding them is quite fun and probably not too challengig for any cruisers that can get through.

 

I did stop there overnight but didn't see any water polo!

 

The pyramid was (and probably still is) an indoor swimming pool too.

 

 

Id add a 'G' to the list and probably the main reason cruisers turn at Barford- and thats Barford Bridge. I have earnt a good few thousand repairing damage caused by people hitting this.

Taken out many a windscreen..

[ditchcrawler]

2 hours ago, PaulJ said:

Id add a 'G' to the list and probably the main reason cruisers turn at Barford- and thats Barford Bridge. I have earnt a good few thousand repairing damage caused by people hitting this.

Taken out many a windscreen..

And I have sat on the grass and watched a few

[enigmatic]

And I have actually scraped paintwork on it!

 

(River levels were high and my concentration was affected by passengers - that's my excuse and I'm sticking to it!)

 

Not sure it's that much lower than St Ives bridge or the average canal bridge though tbh

[oboat]

On 06/12/2021 at 23:10, Scholar Gypsy said:

Castle Mill: in case anyone wants to estimate the depth themselves, you can see the water line. Looks like about a 7 or 8 foot  rise with same again on top to allow for flooding.

 

 

Considering it was only built in the 1990’s for recreation it’s a little odd that it doesn’t have inverted lock sides as on the Thames, as say Marlow.

[enigmatic]

Think it's a bit older than that most of the locks down that way seem to have been rebuilt in the 70s and it looks like the main objective was to use as little of the channel as possible for the lock and as much as possible for the massive sluices

 

I like the unusual Little Paxton lock way of helping out boaters that don't like ladders by providing flights of stairs, but that one's from the early 00s

 

 

 

[oboat]

10 minutes ago, enigmatic said:

Think it's a bit older than that most of the locks down that way seem to have been rebuilt in the 70s and it looks like the main objective was to use as little of the channel as possible for the lock and as much as possible for the massive sluices

 

I like the unusual Little Paxton lock way of helping out boaters that don't like ladders by providing flights of stairs, but that one's from the early 00s

 

 

 

Yes designed in the 80's opened in 90. Lock steps are OK but they need to be self draining & non slip. If they were Gal grates they would be OK. I have seen some which have been lethal.

[magpie patrick]

14 hours ago, oboat said:

Yes designed in the 80's opened in 90. Lock steps are OK but they need to be self draining & non slip. If they were Gal grates they would be OK. I have seen some which have been lethal.

They're not a new idea - Locks on the Bristol Avon has them, stone built in the 1720's - must say I'm not keen on using them

 

 

[Scholar Gypsy]

52 minutes ago, magpie patrick said:

They're not a new idea - Locks on the Bristol Avon has them, stone built in the 1720's - must say I'm not keen on using them

 

 

 

I rather agree. Reaching for the handrail (if there is one - I can't see a stone one on this lock!) never feels very safe to me. And the steps are often not at quite the right height. I prefer a good ladder with two free hands...

[oboat]

20 hours ago, magpie patrick said:

They're not a new idea - Locks on the Bristol Avon has them, stone built in the 1720's - must say I'm not keen on using them

 

 

 

Yes they were the ones I was thinking about. 

 

[PaulJ]

@oboat

As promised, pic of the new mooring at Kempston Mill. Not quite finished yet but its a mooring more than we had before!

[matty40s]

Bedford river was absolutely packed with rowing teams on Sunday, lovely to see. We actually felt like we were in Italy for about 2 hours as didnt hear an English voice until we went into the museum.

[PaulJ]

53 minutes ago, matty40s said:

Bedford river was absolutely packed with rowing teams on Sunday, lovely to see. We actually felt like we were in Italy for about 2 hours as didnt hear an English voice until we went into the museum.

Id have made you a cuppa if Id known 😀

[oboat]

On 03/12/2021 at 04:50, PaulJ said:

But what could you gain by lifting it more ?

The bridges either side of it are lower now and Im going to (wild) guess its now set at about the same height as the old railway bridge next to Priory. 

 

I now have a reply from the EA. Extracts from the reply are below and should be of interest.
1). "the old pre 2019 bridge headroom height being 2.14 metres / 6’11” whereas the new bridge affords 2.38 metres or 7’9” of clearance.  This equates to 24cm 9.5” minimum headroom improvement at this bridge.

2).  However the new Bedford Lock Footbridge is higher than the old railway footbridge level by 8cm at 2.38 metres as opposed to the 2.3 metres the old railway footbridge consists of so based on this it doesn’t appear it has been used to set the new Bedford Lock Footbridge height. 

I have also requested that the EA update the Bridge Schedule to include the bridges above Duck Mill Lock.
This they are putting in hand some of the numbers will be of interest.

This needs to be taken as a Draft.

Location                                                                            Headway          Headway

                                                                                          (metres)       (feet)

Kempston Mill Vehicular Track / Footbridge                          1.0               3’3”

Queens Park Footbridge                                                      2.7               8’10”

Mainline Railway Bridge I                                                     2.0               6’6”

Mainline Railway Bridge II                                                    2.0               6’6”

Footbridge between railways bridges                                    Awaiting        Data

Branch Line Railway Bridge                                                  2.0               6’6”

[oboat]

On 20/01/2022 at 04:23, PaulJ said:

@oboat

As promised, pic of the new mooring at Kempston Mill. Not quite finished yet but its a mooring more than we had before!

 

Looking good 

 

[PaulJ]

8 hours ago, oboat said:

I now have a reply from the EA. Extracts from the reply are below and should be of interest.
...

I have also requested that the EA update the Bridge Schedule to include the bridges above Duck Mill Lock.
This they are putting in hand some of the numbers will be of interest.

Well done on that.

You will find the bit on this notice possibly good news (bottom right regarding Kempston Mill Bridge)

[Scholar Gypsy]

It's a good job the Government funds are for levelling up rather than levelling down ...

[matty40s]

 

.but no money for flood risers...

[oboat]

On 03/12/2021 at 04:10, ditchcrawler said:

This was my effort

 

Edit, helps to put the link in 

Harnser's Travels: Goldington GOBA mooring Wednesday 17 July 2013 (nbharnser.blogspot.com) 

 

As a result of your blog & other info I added your concerns to my communication with the EA.
An extract of the reply is below

My Waterways Assets Colleagues have looked into Cardington Lock and visited site as a result of your comments to confirm dimension measurements of the width of the lock.  As well as attaching some photos (attached to this response and shown below) they also measured the lock width along its length between the copings and interestingly the lock is narrower at one end than the other. The narrowest point being 3.11m between the copings the widest being 3.28m (170mm difference).  The narrowest point within published guides being advertised as 3.15 metres so a 4cm / 1.5” variation at the narrowest point of the lock.  As per the below EA River guidance note update I have also suggested that the information on gov.uk page is amended accordingly.  Our Assets are monitored for changes and changes in the dimensions of our structures can show variation and sometimes this can even be seasonally dependent so information is kept updated on a best endeavours basis but now that this has been checked and found to be slightly different we will make every effort to update the published dimension although this make some time to filter through to printed publications.

In the 2011 R Glen Report it recommends is reconstruction. Item 16. Page 35. 
In 2011 this had a LOW PRIORITY.

 

The recent EA survey and growing number of problems would suggest that the lock walls are moving inwards and that design work for a new lock (say 4.5m wide) should now become a HIGH PRIORITY item, before the lock is closed due to a lack of stability.

 

 

 

 

 

26 minutes ago, matty40s said:

 

.but no money for flood risers...

 

Can you elucidate please.