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Jenna Patel

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11 hours ago, MtB said:

 

Move boat to where, when every useful mooring is given over to paying winter moorings?

 

the word useful is shirley very pertinent here.

 

perhaps the solution is for all winter moorings (many/most of which are just used as boat storage facilities) to be miles from anywhere, i.e. not useful for the genuine cruising boatowner.

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7 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

 

the word useful is shirley very pertinent here.

 

perhaps the solution is for all winter moorings (many/most of which are just used as boat storage facilities) to be miles from anywhere, i.e. not useful for the genuine cruising boatowner.

 

Yes this is my argument too. The well maintained visitor moorings with piling, rings, water points etc should be kept open for the year-round CCers to use as they actually need them. And the less desirable muddy towpath beyond the VMs allocated to the fair weather CCers to block up all winter.

 

I'd say 50% of the boats on WMs around here when I CCed remained unoccupied, yet they were clogging up prime visitor mooring space all winter. Meaning I had to moor on the rough towpath and trudge miles through mud to get to my van. Past long lines of unoccupied WM boats that would be there all winter instead of boaters being able to take turns on the good moorings like in summer. Poor me. 

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27 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Yes this is my argument too. The well maintained visitor moorings with piling, rings, water points etc should be kept open for the year-round CCers to use as they actually need them. And the less desirable muddy towpath beyond the VMs allocated to the fair weather CCers to block up all winter.

 

I'd say 50% of the boats on WMs around here when I CCed remained unoccupied, yet they were clogging up prime visitor mooring space all winter. Meaning I had to moor on the rough towpath and trudge miles through mud to get to my van. Past long lines of unoccupied WM boats that would be there all winter instead of boaters being able to take turns on the good moorings like in summer. Poor me. 

The problem is, how do you distinguish between the WM use you're describing -- basically, cheap unoccupied winter boat parking for people who live in a house in the winter -- from genuine WM use by liveaboard CCers who want to stay put in the cold winter months instead of continuing to travel round a freezing canal system with multiple maintenance blockages?

 

The only difference seems to be whether you live on the boat all year round or move back to a house in winter. Difficult to see how this could be made a condition of being allowed to use WMs, or separating them into good ones for all-year-round-liveaboards and remote muddy towpath ones for summer-liveaboards...

Edited by IanD
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11 minutes ago, IanD said:

The problem is, how do you distinguish between the WM use you're describing -- basically, cheap unoccupied winter boat parking for people who live in a house in the winter -- from genuine WM use by liveaboard CCers who want to stay put in the cold winter months instead of continuing to travel round a freezing canal system with multiple maintenance blockages?

 

Well one way is the smoke from the chimneys and the lights being on in the occupied boats, and the unoccupied boats all being dark and cold. All the more annoying as I trudged past the long line of dark and cold boats on my way to my own boat up the far end in the mud at 8pm after a hard day's boiler-mending. 

 

I'm not really seriously expecting anything to change, more of an opportunity to have a good ol' whinge about it presenting itself. Something actually useful that Nick could perhaps swing his guns around to aim at. 

 

It was only a problem for one winter. Two subsequent winters I joined 'em and took a winter mooring too, and then eventually got a proper CRT mooring. 

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16 hours ago, dmr said:

Not been down that way for a couple of years now, but used to know it well. The vat majority of local boaters are legal and obeying the terms of their licence, otherwise they would be removed. 20 miles is not that hard to do, its not far and maybe non "proper" CCing but it does get more younger people and families onto boats which is a good thing. Some make a significant contribution to the local communities, if nothing else the pub music scene would be in trouble without them.

 

At least part of the local congestion is down to the huge number of hire boats that head to Bath every weekend, and some are very badly behaved (seen this with my very own eyes.)

 

CRT do need to be challenged from time to time as they have done a few very wrong things, and NBTA are quite good at this. If only we could merge NABO and NBTA. However all this whinging about been a persecuted minority and claiming hate speech and discrimination when anybody challenges there arguments is tedious and does not endear the NBTA to the majority of boaters. Sadly it looks like the country is currently heading in that direction so maybe NBTA are just ahead of the game.

 

What saddens me most is their unqualified support for bad boaters no matter who is right or wrong. I have seen plenty of boaters with boats that are untidy beyond what is reasonable, and a lot of anti-social behaviour from boaters, and the usual result is a new set of new mooring signs, justified hostility from the locals, and another good mooring spot lost.

 

Sadly this thread only has two diametrically opposed views.


the thread’s more interesting with the addition of the experienced views being shared. 
And I share your sentiments with the top halves of your comments not so sure about the last bits.  
 
yea, CRT do need challenging and brought to task on plenty of the things they do, and because the NBTA are active in doing that I support them. 
Perhaps it’s time I got off my arse and became more active too.  It all seems to be going on down south though, I’ll find out what they’re up to in the Midlands and the North.  

 

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7 minutes ago, Goliath said:


the thread’s more interesting with the addition of the experienced views being shared. 
And I share your sentiments with the top halves of your comments not so sure about the last bits.  
 
yea, CRT do need challenging and brought to task on plenty of the things they do, and because the NBTA are active in doing that I support them. 
Perhaps it’s time I got off my arse and became more active too.  It all seems to be going on down south though, I’ll find out what they’re up to in the Midlands and the North.  

 

 

They would need to be a bit different to get a Northern section, Northerners tend to get on with stuff rather than complaining about getting treated as a minority (odd as this country does discriminate against Northerners).

 

Was recently talking to a long term K&A boat that had escaped to the North, they said "its different up here, down South CRT are the enemy, up here everybody works together". Interesting observation.

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12 minutes ago, Goliath said:

And I share your sentiments with the top halves of your comments not so sure about the last bits.  

 

You cannot pick and choose which facts you want to support, both sets of facts are correct - there are some good boaters and good things that NBTA do, there are also some boaters that do not play by the rules, claim to have rights they do not have, and some NBTA activities & members that support them.

 

It is the diversity of the waterways, but, it would be good to get rid of the latter and make it better for all.

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I’m laffing at the ‘get rid of’. 
Easy answer to anything : don’t like it, get rid of!

Easier than solving a problem or helping. 
 

I shouldn’t laff.  it’s more of a laff of disbelief than humour though. 
 

 

Edited by Goliath
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16 minutes ago, Goliath said:

I’m laffing at the ‘get rid of’. 

 

"Get rid" as in enforce the law so that they either do what is needed and morally acceptable or get off the water.

 

I think C&RT would only have to make examples of a couple, for the rest of the Non-Itinerants to see that their way of boating is not acceptable.

 

It is not so long ago that C&RT had a 'purge' on the K&A.

 

Kennet & Avon interim 12-month local plan: guidance for boaters without a home mooring

The western end of the Kennet & Avon Canal between Bath and Foxhangers is an attractive and popular stretch of canal that attracts a large number of boats. Following consultation with local boaters, the Kennet & Avon Waterways Partnership and the Canal & River Trust has created an interim 12-month local plan for the area aimed at reducing the congestion that is affecting the canal. Many boaters already navigate the canal in a way that is consistent with this guidance, so they probably won’t need to do anything different. It’s important however that everyone understands how the plan is being monitored and knows how to comply so as to avoid the attention of our enforcement officers. The 12-month local plan From 1 st May 2014 boats between Bath and Foxhangers are expected to:

1. Move to a new neighbourhood every 14 days

2. Spread their mooring pattern evenly across 14 different neighbourhoods (see map) covering a range of at least 20km

Our checkers record the location of each boat at least once every 14 days and our analysis of the resulting data shows us the extent to which you have met the terms of the plan.

 

 

Over the 1st 3 month period :

 

During this period 199 unique boats were identified that did not move between two or more sightings Boat owners have been contacted by text, email or letter to remind them to move, or to contact the trust if there is a reason that they cannot move. 95 have been contacted once 40 have been contacted twice 16 have been contacted three times 18 have been contacted four or more times The Trust is in contact with the owners of the remaining 30 boats for a number of different reasons. Allowances were made when ice on the canal made movement difficult or dangerous. All of the boats that received multiple 14 day reminders in this period were already in the enforcement process.

 

Several boats were sold, some left the waters completely others started to move at acceptable frequency, others just carried on as before.

 

Surely you can agree that 199 boats (not 199 sightings) not moving on a small length of the K&A  is neither acceptable, within the spirit of CCing and certainly not within the law.

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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19 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

"Get rid" as in enforce the law so that they either do what is needed and morally acceptable or get off the water.

 

I think C&RT would only have to make examples of a couple, for the rest of the Non-Itinerants to see that their way of boating is not acceptable.

 

It is not so long ago that C&RT had a 'purge' on the K&A.

 

Kennet & Avon interim 12-month local plan: guidance for boaters without a home mooring

The western end of the Kennet & Avon Canal between Bath and Foxhangers is an attractive and popular stretch of canal that attracts a large number of boats. Following consultation with local boaters, the Kennet & Avon Waterways Partnership and the Canal & River Trust has created an interim 12-month local plan for the area aimed at reducing the congestion that is affecting the canal. Many boaters already navigate the canal in a way that is consistent with this guidance, so they probably won’t need to do anything different. It’s important however that everyone understands how the plan is being monitored and knows how to comply so as to avoid the attention of our enforcement officers. The 12-month local plan From 1 st May 2014 boats between Bath and Foxhangers are expected to:

1. Move to a new neighbourhood every 14 days

2. Spread their mooring pattern evenly across 14 different neighbourhoods (see map) covering a range of at least 20km

Our checkers record the location of each boat at least once every 14 days and our analysis of the resulting data shows us the extent to which you have met the terms of the plan.

 

 

Over the 1st 3 month period :

 

During this period 199 unique boats were identified that did not move between two or more sightings Boat owners have been contacted by text, email or letter to remind them to move, or to contact the trust if there is a reason that they cannot move. 95 have been contacted once 40 have been contacted twice 16 have been contacted three times 18 have been contacted four or more times The Trust is in contact with the owners of the remaining 30 boats for a number of different reasons. Allowances were made when ice on the canal made movement difficult or dangerous. All of the boats that received multiple 14 day reminders in this period were already in the enforcement process.

 

Several boats were sold, some left the waters completely others started to move at acceptable frequency, others just carried on as before.

 

Surely you can agree that 199 boats (not 199 sightings) not moving on a small length of the K&A  is neither acceptable, within the spirit of CCing and certainly not within the law.


2014?

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Referring to the Bonzos earlier in the thread reminded me of this, perhaps more appropriate to this thread 

 

There has also been much play on "signed the contract" and "abiding by the law". Yet CRT are not abiding by The Act when claiming that one must accept the contract in order to have a licence. 

 

 

 

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19 hours ago, ditchcrawler said:

I am moored on a winter mooring right now. There are two of us here, I suspect the other may be here for the winter, there is still room for one more boat and I will be leaving tomorrow.

Checked when I left this morning and only half the 14 day moorings are signed as winter moorings

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1 hour ago, ditchcrawler said:

Checked when I left this morning and only half the 14 day moorings are signed as winter moorings

Thast's what CRT have always said. Only half of designated moorings are winter moorings, the other half are always available. Well, until they get boats dumped on them and left there for the winter, obviously.

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