Words from our leader

[IanD]

12 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Irrespective of the much greater volume, the energy per gram is pretty poor compared to other fuels :

 

Wet (freshly cut) wood ~ 2Wh/gram

Properly dried wood ~ 4.2Wh/gram

Dried Cow / Camel dung ~ 4.3Wh/gram

Peat ~4 to 5Wh/gram

Anthracite ~ 8.6Wh/gram

Body fat ~10.6Wh/gram

Propane ~ 13.6 Wh/gram

 

Pretty much says it all (find a fat friend for Winter)

So dried firewood has about half the energy per gram of solid fuel, and is typically about a third the density (SG about 0.5 compared to 1.5), so it needs at least 6x the volume for the same calorific value. On top of this wood isn't usually as densely stacked (especially if bought in a bag) as solid fuel in a bag, so you're probably up to 8x the volume. If the firewood is cheap softwood like pine which is less dense, this would go up to 10x -- which is exactly what MtB said.

 

On top of this, if you're seasoning it yourself and this takes a year you need a 6-month sized woodpile, which is *quite* large -- 2 bags a week of coal = 20 bags a week of wood = a 500 bag woodpile, say a thousand cubic feet or so...

 

(yes I know you wouldn't burn 2 bags of coal a week all year and a year is a long time for seasoning split wood but we're still talking about an enormous woodpile, *far* bigger than most boaters have even if they have landside space for wood storage and composting...)

Edited November 23, 2021 by IanD

[Mike Todd]

13 hours ago, Ianws said:

That's fine as long as the flue is cleaned regularly. If not, the tar build up could be a problem.

I think the official concern is more about the environment than the boat.

[Grassman]

16 hours ago, ditchcrawler said:

There was a thread on here earlier where one of those chain saw wielding boat handlers saying how they were having to clear the towpath side and not the offside as usual.  

 

 

That was probably a group of volunteers I'm involved with currently working on the T&M and north part of the Coventry Canal. We start at 9am and finish around 3pm with a couple of breaks in between. We are trained to use pole-chainsaws, the wood chipper, and helm the workboat. For the last 4 years we've been doing the offside vegetation (we are all boat owners) but this year we've been instructed to do the towpath side. We initially refused but when it was obvious CRT weren't going to budge we reluctantly agreed after they promised we could revert to doing the offside next winter.

The main reason we agreed albeit reluctantly, was that if we came across any particularly bad overgrowth on the offside we could 'sneak' over and sort it .

 

Some of my fellow volunteers will have some of our wood for themselves but there's always more of it so we let boaters have some if they ask, and we will usually cut them down to more manageable sizes for them.

[George and Dragon]

4 hours ago, IanD said:

So dried firewood has about half the energy per gram of solid fuel, and is typically about a third the density (SG about 0.5 compared to 1.5), so it needs at least 6x the volume for the same calorific value. On top of this wood isn't usually as densely stacked (especially if bought in a bag) as solid fuel in a bag, so you're probably up to 8x the volume. If the firewood is cheap softwood like pine which is less dense, this would go up to 10x -- which is exactly what MtB said.

 

On top of this, if you're seasoning it yourself and this takes a year you need a 6-month sized woodpile, which is *quite* large -- 2 bags a week of coal = 20 bags a week of wood = a 500 bag woodpile, say a thousand cubic feet or so...

 

(yes I know you wouldn't burn 2 bags of coal a week all year and a year is a long time for seasoning split wood but we're still talking about an enormous woodpile, *far* bigger than most boaters have even if they have landside space for wood storage and composting...)

 

My home woodstore is approx 1 cubic metre and holds enough bought seasoned hardwood for about 2 months secondary heating (4-6 hours daily in a 4kW stove). When I get freshly cut wood I make sure to season it under cover for at least 2 summers. 

[IanD]

38 minutes ago, George and Dragon said:

 

My home woodstore is approx 1 cubic metre and holds enough bought seasoned hardwood for about 2 months secondary heating (4-6 hours daily in a 4kW stove). When I get freshly cut wood I make sure to season it under cover for at least 2 summers. 

So if you burned it at that rate for a year (secondary heating only, 4-6 hours a day average) that's about 200 cubic feet of wood. 2 summers seasoning means you need a total of 400 cubic feet of woodpile, more if it's your main heat source not secondary.

 

I'm impressed, that's the kind of size of woodpile you see in places like Sweden and Austria but not often in the UK -- and certainly not belonging to boaters... 😉

[Alan de Enfield]

1 minute ago, IanD said:

I'm impressed, that's the kind of size of woodpile you see in places like Sweden and Austria but not often in the UK -- and certainly not belonging to boaters... 😉

 

They'd never get under the bridges.

[IanD]

3 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

They'd never get under the bridges.

They'd get under some of them...

[George and Dragon]

9 minutes ago, IanD said:

So if you burned it at that rate for a year (secondary heating only, 4-6 hours a day average) that's about 200 cubic feet of wood. 2 summers seasoning means you need a total of 400 cubic feet of woodpile, more if it's your main heat source not secondary.

 

But as it's secondary heating it's only for about half the year, so 6 m^3 would be enough storage. 

8 minutes ago, IanD said:

They'd get under some of them...

 

[IanD]

8 minutes ago, George and Dragon said:

But as it's secondary heating it's only for about half the year, so 6 m^3 would be enough storage. 

And if it's primary heating it would probably be on for double that time each day, which cancels this out...

 

Either way, if you're using wood as your main heat source on a boat and it's seasoned properly, you need a bloody great woodpile... 😉

Edited November 23, 2021 by IanD

[cuthound]

On 22/11/2021 at 21:29, Arthur Marshall said:

I'd give you odds on 90% of boaters don't dry logs for a year before burning them. Of course they burn better and less smoky if you do. But by the smoke pouring out of wood burning boat chimbleys, pretending that anyone really bothers is daft. And the ash goes in the canal or the hedge. It's amazing how many people on this forum never do anything untoward, ever...

 

I thought they used the heat generated by the composting toilet to dry them? 🤔🤣😂😅

[MtB]

4 hours ago, cuthound said:

 

I thought they used the heat generated by the composting toilet to dry them? 🤔🤣😂😅

 

You donarf talk a load of sh * t sometimes! 🤣

[Hudds Lad]

On 23/11/2021 at 15:48, IanD said:

Either way, if you're using wood as your main heat source on a boat and it's seasoned properly, you need a bloody great woodpile... 😉

My Father-in-law, now retired gamekeeper, spent years living in houses where an open fire or stove was the only source of heating. He’s always maintained that as a good rule of thumb, to survive a winter using only wood, you needed a log pile that covered three sides of your house.