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Mickey17

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hi looking for some advice been looking at buying or been told it’s a mid 1970 canal boat fibre glass top and steal bottom not sure what the make or model it’s got 5 digit number starting with 7  it has no hull report or no history needs a little TLC  it has a log burner hot water cooker toilet shower all ready to go would be grateful if anyone can advice on if it’s worth the buy and if so or how much it would be worth it’s got a Isuzu engine and 3years safety certificate been told there’s a long waiting list to get the boats out the water in my area any info would be grate thanks 

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Dunno, all sounds a bit vague. 
I know Jack Shit about prices.  
7.5k is cheap, so I’d think there’ll be plenty of work to do on it. 

Take a look, take some photos and get some more precise details. 

You need to go see it and not rely on what you’ve been told. 

They’ll be others on here much more helpful than me. 
 

Good luck 👍

 

 

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I’ve been on it it drives well and just needs abit modernising and has slight leak in the roof were the round mushroom sits nothing that bad to be honest just bit worried about it sinking lol but it’s being used Until couple days ago they bought a upgrade everything works inside hot water fridge ect dunno wether just to gamble it they mite take 6k

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2 hours ago, Mickey17 said:

hi looking for some advice been looking at buying or been told it’s a mid 1970 canal boat fibre glass top and steal bottom not sure what the make or model it’s got 5 digit number starting with 7  it has no hull report or no history needs a little TLC  it has a log burner hot water cooker toilet shower all ready to go would be grateful if anyone can advice on if it’s worth the buy and if so or how much it would be worth it’s got a Isuzu engine and 3years safety certificate been told there’s a long waiting list to get the boats out the water in my area any info would be grate thanks 

 

Basically, you're gambling buying this. 

 

The hull could be fine or it could be within an ace of sinking. If the hull is fine then the boat is probably worth £25k not £7.5. If it's virtually a colander then 7.5k is top money as to put it right probably involves spending £20k in repairs. 

 

So, the prudent advice is spend £1k getting it surveyed. The trouble here is the seller will get wind of the result of the survey and if it is good, will probably raise the price accordingly. Hence the gamble. Do you feel lucky?

 

 

 

 

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Ino the older couple who have this have been using it as a first time boat tying the water so they now have bought a newer one and now selling this one I’ve done a mile in it with them and like I said it has everything in it to to go but the bad bits I can see is the top part needs work sealing ect just that it’s gonna be my first boat from what I seen on the net it’s really cheap I been told I could good money for it if I sold it 

Was gonna keep 12 months then upgrade if all well 

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Just now, Mickey17 said:

Ino the older couple who have this have been using it as a first time boat tying the water so they now have bought a newer one and now selling this one I’ve done a mile in it with them and like I said it has everything in it to to go but the bad bits I can see is the top part needs work sealing ect just that it’s gonna be my first boat from what I seen on the net it’s really cheap I been told I could good money for it if I sold it 

 

Sounds to me like you've decided to buy it! 

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1 hour ago, Goliath said:

Dunno 

 

if you can get it for 6k ? That’s as cheap as it gets. 
 

Are you gonna live in it ? 
do you see it as a project?

 

Wouldn’t be living on it would just be a project /weekend boat as would be my first boat so just getting a taste of things 👍🏻

13 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Sounds to me like you've decided to buy it! 

I’m still unsure as just with no history of not knowing if it’s been out the water before or plated /blacked it’s a big gamble it might sound cheap but it can all end up been a money pit 👍🏻 But just looking for as much info and advice as poss the couple who have it have used it daily over 2 yrs and had no problems 

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It’s a gamble, but as long as you are prepared for possible Hull or engine expenses it seems a great price. 
You would usually need a survey for fully comprehensive insurance for a boat more that 30 years old. I understand that third party insurance wouldn’t cover a  sinking .
 

However if you go down the survey before you buy they may look elsewhere to sell.

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7 minutes ago, Stroudwater1 said:

I understand that third party insurance wouldn’t cover a  sinking .

 

I understand the opposite, with the whole point of third party being to fund retrieval in the event of a sinking.

 

One or both of us should read a policy and find out for sure instead of promoting rumours! 

 

 

 

 

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Add said above buying it will simply be a gamble. Putting it simply an old boat will have significant rust. This could go through the hull tomorrow, it could be years away from doing it. 

 

If you want to see how much money (and work) a cheap old boat can absorb watch early episodes of  "The narrow boat the James built" on YouTube. This boat was up to over £27,000 long before it was finished/habitable - and then it sprang a leak and he needed to spend many more thousands more to solve that problem.

 

So be aware if you buy the boat the possible outcomes  range from you have a bargain to you lose everything - both are equally likely.

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You can spend 20k and its a gamble, in fact you could argue that anything more than 5 years old is a risk, maybe not paper thin hull but plenty of other stuff can go wrong. Some things though we do know. The boat is 40 + years old. That is an old boat, it is very unlikely to be without overplating somewhere.. It is very likely to need overplating in places right now.  Steel is endlessly repairable but of course it costs money. It has a f/glass top,  That is not great but then my first boat was an unconverted wooden boat - no top at all - so for the money you are probably getting a better boat that you can just start using.  I think I would go for it then take a deep breath and be prepared for some expense when you do take it out of the water. I would also buy a welding set and learn to weld. That's what I did with the present boat, it was the most basic shell possible, no gas locker, no bollards, no hand rails, no engine bearers (Its not a narrowboat ) no water tank, no stern gear or skeg or anything that went over a very , very tight budget so I needed to weld stuff. Its a useful life skill anyway and on an old boat it is really useful. 

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I would go for it, and make sure my third party insurance included recovery if it sinks. Once you get to know the boat you can then decide whether to keep it or if it was a mistake. If a mistake someone will almost certainly buy it from you for similar money, even if you fess up to all the faults you might have uncovered. 

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9 hours ago, MtB said:

 

I understand the opposite, with the whole point of third party being to fund retrieval in the event of a sinking.

 

One or both of us should read a policy and find out for sure instead of promoting rumours! 

 

 

 

 

I’m going partly on the recent example quoted on here where the boat sank on the Thames and third party insurance didn’t cover their refloat.
Additionally why are boats over 30 years  old requiring a Hull survey other than to check the Hull is viable for comprehensive insurance? 
then on here https://www.thefitoutpontoon.co.uk/finance-costs/narrowboat-insurance/

  • If you have third party only cover, re-floating is likely to be covered only where the canal boat is causing an obstruction or potential damage to a third-party property. Details would be found under the wreck removal or salvage clause of your policy

I could well be wrong hence my stating I understand but the above seems to go along with my understanding. Your reasons for understanding otherwise would be gratefully received by many hoping fir cheaper insurance I expect ! 
perhaps you know of insurance companies who do insure third party and cover refloating? 
Doesn’t third party just cover accidental injury/ damage to others as with car third party? 

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38 minutes ago, Stroudwater1 said:

I’m going partly on the recent example quoted on here where the boat sank on the Thames and third party insurance didn’t cover their refloat.
Additionally why are boats over 30 years  old requiring a Hull survey other than to check the Hull is viable for comprehensive insurance? 
then on here https://www.thefitoutpontoon.co.uk/finance-costs/narrowboat-insurance/

  • If you have third party only cover, re-floating is likely to be covered only where the canal boat is causing an obstruction or potential damage to a third-party property. Details would be found under the wreck removal or salvage clause of your policy

I could well be wrong hence my stating I understand but the above seems to go along with my understanding. Your reasons for understanding otherwise would be gratefully received by many hoping fir cheaper insurance I expect ! 
perhaps you know of insurance companies who do insure third party and cover refloating? 
Doesn’t third party just cover accidental injury/ damage to others as with car third party? 

There is only one answer, check your own policy 

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2 hours ago, Tom Morgan said:

I just checked mine!  50 year-old GRP cruiser, third party insurance includes
"Wreck removal costs up to £ 50,000 (if you are legally liable for these costs)"


Tom

 

Yep thanks, just checked my own TP insurance policies on two steel narrowboats, and they say much the same.

 

They also say the insured must take reasonable care to maintain the craft in good condition, but I suspect comprehensive policies say that too. 

 

 

Edited by MtB
Add a detail.
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In the event of it sinking the insurers may well invoke the "maintain in good condition" clause, and unless there is a very recent survey to show what the hull condition actually is, how can that be shown?

 

I guess what I'm saying is "have it surveyed"

 

Tam

Edited by Tam & Di
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👍🏻Thanks everyone for the advice I’m still unsure as there a waiting list to get the boat out the water in my area and a lot could of happens by then such as sinking  it’s a gamble with out it been looked at  or knowing any history of it but like some one said due to its age I can’t see why it’s not been  plated or blacked at some point and by be a great little boat 🛥 

On 02/11/2021 at 11:48, MtB said:

I would go for it, and make sure my third party insurance included recovery if it sinks. Once you get to know the boat you can then decide whether to keep it or if it was a mistake. If a mistake someone will almost certainly buy it from you for similar money, even if you fess up to all the faults you might have uncovered. 

Yes already been thinking about doing that but still unsure 😐 6k still a lot to just watch it go under water 😂

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18 minutes ago, Mickey17 said:

Thanks everyone for the advice I’m still unsure as there a waiting list to get the boat out the water in my area and a lot could of happens by then such as sinking

 

Probably as good a reason as any to get the survey done - it it sinks before the survey its not your problem.

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At that price, I would take the risk. I would offer a price without a survey, then get it surveyed, then expect to either have to do/pay for welding work.

 

Find a shallow mooring and you will be fine even if it does sink - just more pumping and fit-out work to do. If ours went under, I don't think it would go down by more than two inches, having had to dredge out our mooring with the prop just to get in there.


Alec

 

edit - if you post up the registration number (the one which begins with 7) then it may be possible to tell you something about it.

Edited by agg221
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It's undeniably cheap boat, but it might cost a lot more than 7.5k in repair work and still not be worth over 20k when you've finished.

 

Steel hulls with fibreglass tops are notorious for leaks between the fibreglass parts and the steel parts, so worth having a close look at those parts.

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