Porcupine Posted September 12, 2021 Report Share Posted September 12, 2021 Hi, I have a flimsy wooden front door with a padlock. I am looking to beef it up. I was thinking of getting a bar (maybe 2) that you can lock across the door. Does anyone know anyone who could make / fit these for me? My boat is around Berkhamsted on the GU. Alternatively. has anyone got any other suggestions? The doors are wooden and not thick enough to apply a proper lock. I could try steel doors? Wrought iron style metal gates? What d’you reckon? Thanks very much, Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracy D'arth Posted September 12, 2021 Report Share Posted September 12, 2021 Add a sheet steel outer lining with coach bolts through? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan de Enfield Posted September 12, 2021 Report Share Posted September 12, 2021 Why ? If you are worrying about break-ins then that will be of no help at all. Battery powered angle grinders will make short work of any steel bar, or padlock, or other security method you can think of. A hammer (or brick) thru the window will give a simple and quick entry. A narrowboat offers about the same level of security as a tent. If someone wants to 'get in' they will, and they will damage your boat resulting in a cost in fixing it, you'd be as well just to leave the doors open, you'll still lose your 'stuff' but you won't need to repair your boat. This is particularly true in London with all the dossers and ner-do-wells who have gone to the city to make their fortunes and ended up on the streets, the only way to save you boat is to take everything of value with you everytime you leave your boat. If you want security move into a house. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Machpoint005 Posted September 12, 2021 Report Share Posted September 12, 2021 A bar such as the OP envisages will work like any visible deterrent -- it'll make it more likely a miscreant will go for an easier-looking boat instead. The same applies to cars or houses, for that matter. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathanA Posted September 12, 2021 Report Share Posted September 12, 2021 I have/had the same problem, I made a bar to go across the front doors (inside). A 2 inch square 5mm steel plate welded to a 10 mm threaded bar is all that is visible outside but is much stronger than the lock and flimsy bolts that would otherwise secure the front door. It now needs said battery angle grinder and 30 mins rather than 2 mins with a crowbar or big screwdriver OP I made it myself it's not hard - few bits of scrap metal I scrounged Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jen-in-Wellies Posted September 12, 2021 Report Share Posted September 12, 2021 If the bar is in place while you are on board, then you cannot escape through the front doors in an emergency, like a fire. If you only fit the bar when you are not on board, you are advertising that the boat is empty. I'd suggest stronger internal door bolts to slow a miscreant down. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quattrodave Posted September 13, 2021 Report Share Posted September 13, 2021 (edited) Speak to Dave at DPC Engineering just down the road in Bourne End, he's usually up for doing something a bit different. Also ask him about metals that zip discs don't like cutting through, IIRC there are some 'softer' metals that clag up zip discs... Reference security, my take is make it difficult and they'll look for an easier target. What about some sort of alarm linked to a smoke bomb... ok not literally a bomb, not sure what else to call it... https://www.setik.biz/en/smoke-fogs/4549-smoke-100b-indoor-anti-theft-smoke-alarm-system-battery-union-smoke-100b-ur.html Edited September 13, 2021 by Quattrodave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEngo Posted September 13, 2021 Report Share Posted September 13, 2021 Talk to Trevor Oxley. He moors at Marsworth. Oxley Marine, Tring, Herts., Tel: 07931 339291 N Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracy D'arth Posted September 13, 2021 Report Share Posted September 13, 2021 Dog, not fed for a day. Leave the doors open. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porcupine Posted September 13, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 13, 2021 Hi, thanks everyone for your help. I’ll definitely look into all your suggestions. Matt x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackrose Posted September 13, 2021 Report Share Posted September 13, 2021 (edited) 17 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said: Why ? If you are worrying about break-ins then that will be of no help at all. Battery powered angle grinders will make short work of any steel bar, or padlock, or other security method you can think of. A hammer (or brick) thru the window will give a simple and quick entry. A narrowboat offers about the same level of security as a tent. If someone wants to 'get in' they will, and they will damage your boat resulting in a cost in fixing it, you'd be as well just to leave the doors open, you'll still lose your 'stuff' but you won't need to repair your boat. This is particularly true in London with all the dossers and ner-do-wells who have gone to the city to make their fortunes and ended up on the streets, the only way to save you boat is to take everything of value with you everytime you leave your boat. If you want security move into a house. I disagree with most of the above. Most boat burglaries are done by kids of opportunists who carry no more than a large screwdriver to prize off hinges and hasps unwisely screwed into wooden frames. They don't generally carry cordless angle grinders. If they did we'd all be in trouble. "Professional" burglars on the other hand, tend to stick to houses where pickings are richer. Bricks or hammers through windows are generally the choice of vandals, not burglars. Nobody trying to get into a boat wants to enter by crawling through a broken window. Believe me, I have never stolen from a house, but in my miss-spent youth I used to be quite good at getting into locked premises. I'll say no more about that. My boat is fairly secure and I've left it unattended for a week at a time on parts of the K&A where several years ago there were a spate of boat burglaries, without a problem. It's as difficult to get into as many houses. I do want security - everything I own which isn't that much is on my boat. It all comes down to deterrence: make it harder for someone to get in and they will be deterred. And no it's not true that a more secure looking boat will motivate burglars to try and get in because as I've already inferred, if they wanted to put that much effort into it they'd go and rob a house. We've all got stuff we don't want to lose, even aboard our boats. The idea that you should just leave your doors open when moored on a canal towpath is frankly ridiculous. Edited September 13, 2021 by blackrose 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanderer Vagabond Posted September 14, 2021 Report Share Posted September 14, 2021 On 13/09/2021 at 14:26, blackrose said: I disagree with most of the above. Most boat burglaries are done by kids of opportunists who carry no more than a large screwdriver to prize off hinges and hasps unwisely screwed into wooden frames. They don't generally carry cordless angle grinders. If they did we'd all be in trouble. "Professional" burglars on the other hand, tend to stick to houses where pickings are richer. Bricks or hammers through windows are generally the choice of vandals, not burglars. Nobody trying to get into a boat wants to enter by crawling through a broken window. Believe me, I have never stolen from a house, but in my miss-spent youth I used to be quite good at getting into locked premises. I'll say no more about that. My boat is fairly secure and I've left it unattended for a week at a time on parts of the K&A where several years ago there were a spate of boat burglaries, without a problem. It's as difficult to get into as many houses. I do want security - everything I own which isn't that much is on my boat. It all comes down to deterrence: make it harder for someone to get in and they will be deterred. And no it's not true that a more secure looking boat will motivate burglars to try and get in because as I've already inferred, if they wanted to put that much effort into it they'd go and rob a house. We've all got stuff we don't want to lose, even aboard our boats. The idea that you should just leave your doors open when moored on a canal towpath is frankly ridiculous. I would agree with your comments, and have also legitimately spent time working out how to get into locked premises. That is often a good place to start with any security assessment whether it is your house or your boat, if you lost your keys, how would you get in? It helps you to identify security weaknesses. My own advice would be to have the majority of any security features on the inside of the boat as far as possible since you shouldn't then find yourself locked in, in the event of an emergency, and it doesn't give potential thieves a clue of what security they might be up against. Padlocks on the outside of the boat simply telegraph that either the boat is unoccupied,( or is occupied by an idiot). My front doors have a mortice lock on them and if I lost the keys I have no idea how I'd get through them without a proper locksmith. The other doors are secured by a variety of means that I don't feel inclined to divulge, but always on the inside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightwatch Posted September 15, 2021 Report Share Posted September 15, 2021 There’s was once a boat near where I used to moor the owner of which left his boat unlocked. His logic was……………………..resulting in less damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetzi Posted September 20, 2021 Report Share Posted September 20, 2021 It's my belief that anything that makes you look like you're not on your boat does more harm than good, this is particularly true for boats with padlocks and bolts across the doors - whenever I pass one of these I tut. Lights on a timer is more effective IMHO than any deadbolt. Your aim is first to deter, and then second to slow them down. Looking like you're home is the best deterrent, because most burglars are after stuff, not people. Boats that are obviously locked from the outside have a negative impact on deterrence. If I was in the OP's position and the doors were really that flimsy that they couldn't be locked with a mortise type lock, I would replace them with steel doors. You'd have to have them fabricated though so won't be as affordable or as DIYable as a bar across the door. On 12/09/2021 at 20:31, Alan de Enfield said: A narrowboat offers about the same level of security as a tent. If someone wants to 'get in' they will, and they will damage your boat resulting in a cost in fixing it, you'd be as well just to leave the doors open, you'll still lose your 'stuff' but you won't need to repair your boat. This is particularly true in London This is obviously hyperbole, but there is a ring of truth to it. If someone is determined enough to get in, they will, and this applies equally to tents, boats, houses and even bank vaults. I'd hazard that a steel narrowboat with portholes too small to climb through and lockable steel doors is just as secure as a house (bricks through windows work with houses too). The real risk with boating in my view is that it's often done in secluded areas that are good hunting grounds for opportunists. Ironically, despite all the London-bashers on this forum who seem to have no experience of it, London is very much not that. On the contrary, the boating community is very strong in London, even if only because you need to coordinate breasting up. In London I always know my neighbours, and they tend to be younger, fitter and more streetwise than the retirees on the rest of the network. As a result, if I was going away for a week, I would sooner leave my boat in London than on a towpath on the L&L. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porcupine Posted September 20, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 20, 2021 Thanks, lots of really interesting opinions. Ultimately, the best option seems like replacing my wooden doors with steel ones. I’m going to look into doing that. Thanks so much to everyone who’s shared their pearls of wisdom with me. Matt x Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheshire cat Posted September 20, 2021 Report Share Posted September 20, 2021 A couple of years ago I left my keys in my coat in the pub. I got back to the boat moored in Etruria and convinced myself I'd locked myself out. I went to a local shop and bought the cheapest of screwdrivers. Using the screwdriver I managed to take the bathroom window out. Dozens of people passed on the towpath and no one batted an eyelid. You'd better weld up your windows too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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