Jump to content

Battery opinion


RickS

Featured Posts

These were recommended to me and wondered if they were any good - Leoch Adventurer SFL sealed lead acid batteries 130Ah.

I was going to post a link to the site where I have seen them but I think that might be against the rules.

If not liked, could anyone recommend others please. Doesn't have to be 130Ah, and happy to top up water rather than maintenance free 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Have to say you have lost me there David, I have no idea what the C20 rate is I'm afraid.

Seems a bit disingenuous of them to advertise them as 130Ah batteries doesn't it? Or do they assume that people who know about these things will, well . know about these things?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, Rick Savery said:

Have to say you have lost me there David, I have no idea what the C20 rate is I'm afraid.

Seems a bit disingenuous of them to advertise them as 130Ah batteries doesn't it? Or do they assume that people who know about these things will, well . know about these things?

C20 means that you discharge the entire capacity (C) at a rate such that it’s flat in 20 hours. If you discharge faster or slower, the usable capacity is different. C20 is the normal discharge rate. C100 means discharging at a slower rate, over 100hrs. At that rate the capacity will be more. 135Ah in this case. But by the normal measure of C20, the capacity is 100Ah. So I agree with David, it is rather disingenuous (or to be less polite, deceiving).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, nicknorman said:

C20 means that you discharge the entire capacity (C) at a rate such that it’s flat in 20 hours. If you discharge faster or slower, the usable capacity is different. C20 is the normal discharge rate. C100 means discharging at a slower rate, over 100hrs. At that rate the capacity will be more. 135Ah in this case. But by the normal measure of C20, the capacity is 100Ah. So I agree with David, it is rather disingenuous (or to be less polite, deceiving).

 

 

So given the apparent attempt to deceive customers by quoting the capacity at C100, would the OP trust them to be straight in other areas of the specification?

 

Also given the OP's declared low knowledge about batteries, I feel it should be pointed out that "maintenance free" simply means that these batteries are of the type that require occasional maintenance (i.e. topping up with distilled water), but this particular battery is sealed to prevent this being done. Hence the "maintenance free" claim. More disingenuity, some might decide. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Personally, I would never fit any sealed lead acid battery to a boat because they make it hard for an ordinary boater to do much in the way of diagnostics on them.

 

In fairness, I would say that lead calcium plates tend to give a higher gassing voltage than the old lead antinomy so in most charging systems without add-on controllers so the need to top up will be less until the battery is at the end of it's life.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

To be honest, If I was going to spend that kind of money on batteies I would pay a bit more and go for a tried and tested brand  of deep cycle batteries such as US battery Co, or Trojan. I had a pair of 6v US 125 batteries (242 Ah) in my boat and they were still holding a full charge after 11 years when I sold the boat, and hardly ever needed much topping up.

 

 

Edited by David Schweizer
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have been running three SFL130-DT since 2018, good batteries cost me just shy of £100 then. 

Still havent got them below 80% overnight so that works for me.

I charge them at 14.45v as reccomended by the importer.

I would buy them again........

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, David Schweizer said:

To be honest, If I was going to spend that kind of money on batteies I would pay a bit more and go for a tried and tested brand  of deep cycle batteries such as US battery Co, or Trojan. I had a pair of 6v US 125 batteries (242 Ah) in my boat and they were still holding a full charge after 9 years when I sold the boat, and hardly ever needed much topping up

The above - absolutely...

Nothing wrong with the Leoch style except -mebe - a bit over hyped to make them appear to be a 'cut above' the regular run of lead - acid batteries.

I was luck to find a source of NiFe batteries when I fitted out many, many years ago. Fiendishly expensive even then. But they still work 20 years later.

 

Bimble have written a 'paper' th the subject which might interest some - worth a read if nothing else.

 

BTW - it might be worth looking at Battery Megastore or mebe Tayna, as both of them have a wide range of labels at various prices. My engine starter battery is now seven years old and still works and was one of their mid range offerings!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, Rick Savery said:

These were recommended to me and wondered if they were any good - Leoch Adventurer SFL sealed lead acid batteries 130Ah.

I was going to post a link to the site where I have seen them but I think that might be against the rules.

If not liked, could anyone recommend others please. Doesn't have to be 130Ah, and happy to top up water rather than maintenance free 

 

 

The best way to buy batteries is probably the same as most things - by personal recommendation.   If someone you know/trust thinks these are a bargain then buy them.

 

There has been a lot of discussion on this subject over the years.  FWIW my personal conclusion is buy cheap batteries which may wear out quicker than more expensive types but it's more economic in the long run.  There is also the consideration that to derive the benefit of expensive batteries you have to be certain of keeping the boat for many years.  

 

As for "maintenance free" well you really need to be looking at AGM or gel batteries which are much more expensive.  As others have said these sealed batteries are just that, wet batteries with no facility for checking/topping up.  But, the problem with so many boats is the batteries ore often squirrelled away somewhere where it's damn near impossible to check them, so these sealed batteries are often the only practical choice.  

Edited by Neil2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hate buying batteries, its so hard to research and compare plus I think a lot of batts are the same but with different labels. I reckon they should be sold by the kilo like cheese. it seems to me that big, heavy batteries are better than smaller ones no matter what the labels or advertised amp hour is.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

56 minutes ago, Bee said:

Hate buying batteries, its so hard to research and compare plus I think a lot of batts are the same but with different labels. I reckon they should be sold by the kilo like cheese. it seems to me that big, heavy batteries are better than smaller ones no matter what the labels or advertised amp hour is.

 

I seem to remember in Nigel Calder's "Mechanical & Electrical Manual" he says something along the lines of you could do much worse than buy batteries on weight ie just get the heaviest...

 

Our village golf club has a few electric carts, and the batteries they use are incredibly heavy - I reckon they would be a good choice.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you have a good charging system/routine which properly charges/equalises the batteries then it's worth investing in expensive long-life ones (e.g. lead-carbon, AGM, Rolls...), they'll last a lot longer than cheap ones and probably save money overall.

 

If you don't then you might as well buy cheap ones and throw them away when they die from overcharging/undercharging/sulphation, at least you're not throwing away expensive ones which will also die quickly...

Edited by IanD
  • Greenie 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's worth watching Charles Sterling's Youtube discussion -

It's some years old but the princples are the same.

OK he's an acquired taste and has quite positive views about a lot of things.

Having known the man since I met him at several Earl's Court boat shows many, many years ago - I realise hea means well and has a helluva lot of knowledge about battery technoligy. It's up to you - what you absorb and filter. It's a good guide...

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Bee said:

Hate buying batteries, its so hard to research and compare plus I think a lot of batts are the same but with different labels. I reckon they should be sold by the kilo like cheese. it seems to me that big, heavy batteries are better than smaller ones no matter what the labels or advertised amp hour is.

Unless part of the battery contains concrete as happened recently when someone purchased a ‘drop in’ lifepo4 battery sourced from China.  When the battery didn’t perform as expected it was dismantled where the concrete was discovered😂😂

  • Horror 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

26 minutes ago, Dartagnan said:

Unless part of the battery contains concrete as happened recently when someone purchased a ‘drop in’ lifepo4 battery sourced from China.  When the battery didn’t perform as expected it was dismantled where the concrete was discovered😂😂

 

Or bocks of wood as alleged found in the bottom of Gamages cheap batteries - remember Gamages of High Holburn?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just to add from my experience, I bought these batteries,(12V 130AH Leoch Adventurer AGM Leisure Battery (LAGM130) NCC Class A) from that company to replace an identical set that I had bought in June 2013 (from the now departed Chandlery at Braunston bottom lock) and had given me excellent service until April 2020 (so about 7 years). In that time I hadn't looked at the batteries once (they are a bit of a faff to get to, so never bothered to try). They cost more than bog standard lead acid, but it really was a 'fit and forget' for me. My view is that 7 years is a reasonable lifespan for a set of batteries, other views are available.;) 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

Just to add from my experience, I bought these batteries,(12V 130AH Leoch Adventurer AGM Leisure Battery (LAGM130) NCC Class A) from that company 

 

But Sir, Sir, those are not the same battery. Yours are AGM not FLA. 

 

From the OP's link:

 

12V 130 Ah fit-and-forget flooded lead-acid battery for leisure use

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

But Sir, Sir, those are not the same battery. Yours are AGM not FLA. 

 

From the OP's link:

 

12V 130 Ah fit-and-forget flooded lead-acid battery for leisure use

 

Might have been why I put the bit about,"......They cost more than bog standard lead acid....." in the post;). In fairness I was quite impressed, given the weight of 4 batteries, that they will give free delivery. I upgraded to the next day delivery option and it nearly broke the bank with a charge of £3.99!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

Might have been why I put the bit about,"......They cost more than bog standard lead acid....." in the post;). In fairness I was quite impressed, given the weight of 4 batteries, that they will give free delivery. I upgraded to the next day delivery option and it nearly broke the bank with a charge of £3.99!!

 

Ok, so to summarise... "I bought different batts from the same supplier", might not be totally amazingly helpful to the OP.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just a boring technical note, batteries are specified by a number of cycles (discharge-charge) to a specified depth of discharge. For most standard flooded batteries (sealed or not) this is about 300 cycles. So....., anybody who say their batteries are great and have lasted for XX years are saying Nothing about the batteries but are just saying that they don't use their boats very much, or live in a marina with a permanent 240 volt connection.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Ok, so to summarise... "I bought different batts from the same supplier", might not be totally amazingly helpful to the OP.

In terms of the supplier, suggestions were made some that they were trying to deceive, whereas my dealing with them were straightforward and they did exactly as they were contracted to do. I don't suppose that suppliers write their own sales blurb for whatever batteries they may be selling, they will simply regurgitate whatever the manufacturer specifications are, so I don't hold the supplier responsible for what the manufacturer may have said.

 

In summary, the supply company concerned were, in my experience, OK and the Leoch Batteries that I bought were also OK.

2 minutes ago, dmr said:

Just a boring technical note, batteries are specified by a number of cycles (discharge-charge) to a specified depth of discharge. For most standard flooded batteries (sealed or not) this is about 300 cycles. So....., anybody who say their batteries are great and have lasted for XX years are saying Nothing about the batteries but are just saying that they don't use their boats very much, or live in a marina with a permanent 240 volt connection.

For mine that was more or less  7 years of continuous cruising. My understanding however is that batteries benefit from use rather that sitting degrading in a marina without being used, but then I could be wrong.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, dmr said:

Just a boring technical note, batteries are specified by a number of cycles (discharge-charge) to a specified depth of discharge. For most standard flooded batteries (sealed or not) this is about 300 cycles. So....., anybody who say their batteries are great and have lasted for XX years are saying Nothing about the batteries but are just saying that they don't use their boats very much, or live in a marina with a permanent 240 volt connection.

 

Or, as in my case with wet Exide leisures take a bit of care about fully charging and never going below 50% charge each day whenever possible. I thnk 6 or 7 years when we sold the  boat.

9 hours ago, Wanderer Vagabond said:

In terms of the supplier, suggestions were made some that they were trying to deceive, whereas my dealing with them were straightforward and they did exactly as they were contracted to do. I don't suppose that suppliers write their own sales blurb for whatever batteries they may be selling, they will simply regurgitate whatever the manufacturer specifications are, so I don't hold the supplier responsible for what the manufacturer may have said.

 

In summary, the supply company concerned were, in my experience, OK and the Leoch Batteries that I bought were also OK.

For mine that was more or less  7 years of continuous cruising. My understanding however is that batteries benefit from use rather that sitting degrading in a marina without being used, but then I could be wrong.

 

All that might be correct but using the C100 rate is deceiving, especially if you have a meaty inverter aboard and use it at high output, as many  boats do nowadays. I also noted they gave 200 cycles to 50% DOD rather than the 40% of my Exides. Both seem to me to be trying to big up the actual performance.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.