Competent Surveyor Needed - Covering Cheshire

[Withywindle]

After 20 years of regular hiring my wife and I have just taken the plunge and are in the process of buying our first narrowboat - a 2005 Colecraft 50 footer.

 

I now need to engage my surveyor (full survey) and need recommendations for a good surveyor in the Cheshire area.

 

Ideally I want to be there myself for at least part of the survey, so someone who doesn't mind that and would be happy to discuss their findings with me 'on site' as well as providing a formal report would be good.

 

Some names I've already been given are...

 

Steve Hand

Mike Carter

John Crompton

Peter Tindall

Ricky Tropman

 

Endorsements for any of these would be very welcome together with any other names forum members can recommend?

 

 

[Tracy D'arth]

Mike Carter of Marine Surveys.   Very thorough and conscientious.

[enigmatic]

I was happy with Steve Hand. Didn't meet him onsite as it was a long way to drive when Venetian wouldn't let me in their dry dock anyway, but very happy to discuss over the phone and give additional recommendations and explanations about why certain things were the way they were.

[NB DW2]

I've used Ricky Tropman twice.  His surveys are very in depth, as are his written reports.  He's happy for you to be there in person and will talk you through his findings once done, and will give you a gentle steer as to whether what you're having surveyed fits with the price you're paying.

 

Thoroughly recommended.  

[zenataomm]

As opposed to a totally useless one then?

 

15 hours ago, Withywindle said:

After 20 years of regular hiring my wife ......

 I suppose it's better than renting her.

 

Apologies, you're a new member, it's a quarter past one in the morning.  Congratulations on your new boat, I do hope you both enjoy it.

[Withywindle]

21 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Mike Carter of Marine Surveys.   Very thorough and conscientious.

Thanks for the recommendation Tracy. Unfortunately Mike is booked solid for 7 weeks plus and isn't taking any more work right now. I guess that endorses what you say - he must be good!

[Keith M]

A name not mention yet P. Tindle (I am not if that is the correct spelling of his surname)?

[pete.i]

I've used Ricky Tropman a couple of times. Very thorough, fair and tells you exactly how it is, good and bad. I was also with him for most of the time that he carried out the surveys for me and he was more than willing to answer my questions.

[Nightwatch]

Here comes the miserable comment. We had a full survey when we bought Nightwatch. In my opinion, a complete waste of money. It seems most seals were not checked or were inaccessible, the electrics were defective to such an extent had to spend money sorting it.

 

The surveyor said all was well, that he could get to. Toilet seals duff. Domestic water pump seals duff. I won’t go on. Perhaps I got the wrong surveyor.

Hull survey only for me in the future. Just my opinion.

[Mad Harold]

2 hours ago, Nightwatch said:

Here comes the miserable comment. We had a full survey when we bought Nightwatch. In my opinion, a complete waste of money. 

 

The surveyor said all was well, that he could get to.

Hull survey only for me in the future. Just my opinion.

The trouble is,a great deal of the gubbins in the interior of a boat is generally inaccessable without major dismantling.

So for me too,just a hull survey,to ensure a sound hull.The rest,well look as best you can and hope.

When you have had the boat for a year or so,you will be more aware of it's problems.😄

[Jen-in-Wellies]

Weird that. No one advertises themselves as an Incompetent Surveyor. Could be a gap in the market for someone.

[Richard10002]

2 hours ago, Nightwatch said:

Here comes the miserable comment. We had a full survey when we bought Nightwatch. In my opinion, a complete waste of money. It seems most seals were not checked or were inaccessible, the electrics were defective to such an extent had to spend money sorting it.

 

The surveyor said all was well, that he could get to. Toilet seals duff. Domestic water pump seals duff. I won’t go on. Perhaps I got the wrong surveyor.

Hull survey only for me in the future. Just my opinion.

With respect, how do you suggest that a surveyor checks every seal that you speak of, amongst other stuff?

6 hours ago, Withywindle said:

Thanks for the recommendation Tracy. Unfortunately Mike is booked solid for 7 weeks plus and isn't taking any more work right now. I guess that endorses what you say - he must be good!

You will probably have to take what you can get in this respect. I tried to get Steve Hands to do our boat again* in a 3 week window in 2019, but he was equally busy.

 

He did our purchase survey in 2011 and was excellent! He wouldn't allow me to be on the boat while he did the survey, (which is understandable), but he spent the best part of an hour talking me through it, immediately after he had completed it.

[Nightwatch]

With equal respect, the toilet wasn’t retaining water in the bowl. The water pump was just not sealed and was leaking. A switch would have disclosed that. The electrics were part dismantled. A Sterling system.

 

I believe the surveyor, on my behalf, in return for a fair wedge of readies, look out for these sort of things. If they don’t, that’s fine. Hull survey from now on.

Just had an insurance hull survey. Excellent value. You have to pay people to do things you can’t. But I soon found the missed defects. Anyway that was early 16 years ago.

[David Mack]

Before you commit to a hull only survey, check with your insurance company that is sufficient. Someone here recently was complaining that their insurer needed a 'full' survey, and they only had a hull survey.

[Keith M]

Insurance companies are changing there requirements some are now asking for independent electrical reports.
I have already carried more than six this year.
I am in the middle of one at the moment.

[PD1964]

 

42 minutes ago, Keith M said:

Insurance companies are changing there requirements some are now asking for independent electrical reports.
I have already carried more than six this year.
I am in the middle of one at the moment.

I wonder if this is a reflection on the market over the last couple of years with lots of cheap boats getting passed about on a regular basis. Boats that are being bought as projects and are being done up for cheap accommodation only, by people with no concept of any regulations or BSS requirements who don’t move and find it cheaper then renting a bed sit/flat, then when it has served it’s purpose sell it to the next young person and on it goes.

[Keith M]

Difficult to tell.

I have also completed electrical inspection of craft trying claim from there insurance companies.

To see if the installations are up to standards.

[Alan de Enfield]

6 minutes ago, Keith M said:

Difficult to tell.

I have also completed electrical inspection of craft trying claim from there insurance companies.

To see if the installations are up to standards.

 

Just as a matter of interest, to what standards do you assess the suitability or acceptability of a boat wiring system ?

Or, maybe the same question but differently phrased : "To what standards do insurers require boat wiring to be inspected to, and comply with ?"

 

Obviously BSS requirements are extremely basic when compared to RCD requirements.

For example, what would you suggest or comment if you found a NB with T&E cabling ?

[Keith M]

Ask me that question when I have finished my current report over 75% of the cabling is T & E. which should be some time today.

 

Sorry Alan it is no longer the RCD it is now RCR Recreational Craft Regulations. 

 

I would take a very common sense  view. 

Using the current Boat Conformity Check list as found within the BMEEA C Of P which is soon to be reviewed. 

[Alan de Enfield]

3 minutes ago, Keith M said:

Sorry Alan it is no longer the RCD it is now RCR Recreational Craft Regulations. 

 

I am aware of that - have you had to evaluate, or report on any canal boats been built under the RCR requirements yet ?

 

Presumably, any boat built since 1998 should not have any T&E (or other non compliances) unless the owners have been doing DIY, 

[Alan de Enfield]

10 minutes ago, Keith M said:

Using the current Boat Conformity Check list as found within the BMEEA C Of P which is soon to be reviewed. 

 

I note that this, unsurprisingly, cites the same ISO specifications as the RCD / RCD which does not allow for T&E.

 

Interested to see what your conclusions will be.

[Keith M]

1 minute ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

I am aware of that - have you had to evaluate, or report on any canal boats been built under the RCR requirements yet ?

 

Presumably, any boat built since 1998 should not have any T&E (or other non compliances) unless the owners have been doing DIY, 

I have have completed Boat Conformity inspection on two new Craft using the new ISO 13297: 2021. One of which was electrically propelled.

You still find T & E in craft  built after 1998 both professional and DIY.

I include this in the report it is up to the insurance as to what they take. 

[Alan de Enfield]

3 minutes ago, Keith M said:

I have have completed Boat Conformity inspection on two new Craft using the new ISO 13297: 2021. One of which was electrically propelled.

 

Presumably that was for the general wiring, but BS EN ISO 16315 would be the relevant spec for "Small Craft Electric Propulsion Systems"

[Keith M]

Just now, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Presumably that was for the general wiring, but BS EN ISO 16315 would be the relevant spec for "Small Craft Electric Propulsion Systems"

Correct, you still have to use ISO 13297: 2021  as well.

Also checking that the correct voltage fuses are being used.

Have ferrules been used so simple so many installers do not use them.

[Alan de Enfield]

2 minutes ago, Keith M said:

Correct, you still have to use ISO 13297: 2021  as well.

Also checking that the correct voltage fuses are being used.

Have ferrules been used so simple so many installers do not use them.

 

And in my experience it is even worse for those home-builds who make a self-declaration of compliance never having even looked at any specifications, and just shrug their shoulders and say "its only a Category D muddy ditch, paperwork is irrelevant"