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Identify engine :)


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Hi all,

 

I am trying to definitively identify my engine as it is old and tired and I may need to replace/upgrade. The boat was built in 1993 in Wales as a hire boat and I have been told by a number of engineers it is a thornycroft/vetus/Mitsubishi. I do not have a manual and I believe it may be a Mitsubishi K3 but don’t know model, the heat exchanger part no is for a k3 and this (photo ) number is stamped on the back of the engine above the gearbox.

 

 Any ideas on this? Power? 

2C555FF3-83B2-4860-893E-036B6153D848.jpeg

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If the oil filler cap is dished in downwards with knurled finger grips around the edge and has an electric fuel pump almost certainly a Mitsubishi

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5 minutes ago, bizzard said:

If the oil filler cap is dished in downwards with knurled finger grips around the edge and has an electric fuel pump almost certainly a Mitsubishi


Tony Brooks has already identified it as a Mitsubishi in the thread about the head gasket which relates to the same engine. OP seems keener to pay for a new engine than pay for someone who knows what they are doing to look at the one they already have.

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Why? I know about switch and tie down on battery, in answer to the other snide comment I think I am going to try for a refurb. However todo that I need to know make etc surely?

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1 minute ago, andy4502 said:

Why? I know about switch and tie down on battery, in answer to the other snide comment I think I am going to try for a refurb. However todo that I need to know make etc surely?

Methinks you don't understand forums.

'We' don't just sit here at the whim of aqnyone who comes online - without making any comment.

It a discussion group where members HELP each other and we all have to suffer the occasional jibe....

The comment about engine number was out of focus and impossible to make any sensible suggestion, methinks

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So vetus was obviously working in 1993, however did thornycroft (and others maybe) convert/use mitsubishi as a base or is it likely to be a Mitsubishi marine engine? Any idea of power? I see that the current vetus 3cylr are 27hp

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2 minutes ago, bizzard said:

Definitely 3 cyl Mitsubishi.

If you hold a mirror in front of that number it might read right although still upside down. First letter M for Mitsubishi.

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Just now, andy4502 said:

So vetus was obviously working in 1993, however did thornycroft (and others maybe) convert/use mitsubishi as a base or is it likely to be a Mitsubishi marine engine? Any idea of power? I see that the current vetus 3cylr are 27hp

 

Mitsubishi DO NOT MAKE marine engines, at least in the sizes we use. They make industrial engines that they will sell to almost anyone to do what they will with. That ranges across generators, agricultural equipment, probably rail equipment and all sorts of other applications. One very small application base is for small marine engines. Vetus is just one mariniser buying engines form Mitsubishi, as were Thorneycroft and I think Beta at some time in the past.

 

You need the Mitsubishi engine number, not the Thorneycroft one, although some here may know which Mitsubishi engine that refers to. Once you have that you might be able to find what is known as a short engine (block, pistons shafts etc.) and have the other parts changed from your existing engine.

 

No idea of power but the same base engines seem to be given different powers by different marinisers. What you need to know is the overall dimensions, including the mounting centres and the position of the centre of the flywheel relative to the engine mounts.

 

Be very wary about so called overhauled or reconditioned engines. Some are very good, some OK and some have just been steam cleaned and spray-painted. I suspect you would do far better to have the existing engine sorted out by a known good mechanic rather than buy something you know little about.

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4 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

I have had a go at that number:

 

It looks like Mx180185 with x needing cleaning more. it may be an 8,9,6, or zero.

ENo.jpg

Ah, the Nancy Blackett method.

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14 hours ago, andy4502 said:

I will try cleaning it up tomorrow - on wine now :)

 

And once you have the correct number, find a Mitsubishi agent to talk to. On no account Vetus unless you have very deep pockets and long arms.

 

https://www.diamonddiesels.co.uk/

 

There are others like West diesel, google for them.

Edited by Tony Brooks
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Actually, what Tony said earlier is interesting about Vetus (and Beta and others). They marinise base engines. It is not very hard to do it yourself, bell housing, gearbox, suitable heat exchanger and plumbing and there you have it. For canal boats that is pretty much it. It is quite basic engineering. There is a bit more to it but back in the day I did that to a couple of BMC's  and friends attached gearboxes to any number of Perkins, Armstrongs and anything else that came along. So long as you spray the entire collection of pieces the same colour nobody will ever know that it hasn't got all the silly paperwork that everything seems to need these days.

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There used to be an interesting book on marinsing car engines.  Numerous useful tips but the ones I recall best related to the gearbox.  Paddle wheelers were simple by positioning the live axle and differential athwartships.  For those with more expensive taste, you could machine the teeth off 2nd or 3rd gears and bolt sprockets, thus reversing the drive.  Keep the foot operated clutch of course, but it was admitted to be a bit awkward to stand on one leg to do so, if your boat is rolling heavily.

 

 

 

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Useful things differentials. You still see a few on older  peniches operating the rudder, its those right angled gears that make them so useful. Also I assume but am not certain that the right angled drive found use on Dutch  sailing barges, stick a motor on the front deck athwart ships, use those useful diff. gears to drive a long shaft alongside the boat with a prop on it and you have a sort of motor boat. Called a 'lame arm' There is a small reference to this dangerous device here https://zuiderzee.eu/en/ship-zuiderzee/history-sailingvessel/

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1 hour ago, Tacet said:

There used to be an interesting book on marinsing car engines.  Numerous useful tips but the ones I recall best related to the gearbox.  Paddle wheelers were simple by positioning the live axle and differential athwartships.  For those with more expensive taste, you could machine the teeth off 2nd or 3rd gears and bolt sprockets, thus reversing the drive.  Keep the foot operated clutch of course, but it was admitted to be a bit awkward to stand on one leg to do so, if your boat is rolling heavily.

 

 

 

I used to have a 1960s boating magazine with a lengthy article on how to marinise vehicle gearboxes. It discussed how to modify the gears to get similar forward and reverse ratios, with a direct fore and aft movement of the gear lever (rather than across the gate). Another suggestion was a bike brake lever clamped to the gear lever to operate the clutch.

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