Lister LPWS3 - blue smoke, black oil spray from exhaust

[EdwardMeades]

I have a Lister LPWS3 in my boat. Engine dates to 1990 and has a minimum of 2500 hours on it (hour meter was broken when I bought, didn't realise).

 

I start to get blue smoke at higher revs (1800+). This gradually gets worse until I dial it back again. The smoke then starts to reduce to almost nothing again. When cold I get very little smoke at all. This onky happens when warm.

 

In addition there is a black oil spraying from the exhaust. This is also weeping through the joints in the exhaust. I checked the oil last weekend and topped up about 200ml (after 45 hours running)

 

 

Everything seems to be pointing towards rings/ valves leaking and a rebuild.

 

Does the brain trust have any other ideas or quick fixes I csn check begird going down that route?

 

I'm on the Middlewich branch, Does anyone know a good engineer in my area? 

[Tony Brooks]

I suppose it might turn out to be glazed bores so I think a good blast on a river is unlikely to do much harm and just might do some good.

 

Are you sure its not overloading at speed.  That would indicate a fouled or oversized prop.

Edited June 4, 2021 by Tony Brooks

[Tracy D'arth]

18 minutes ago, EdwardMeades said:

I have a Lister LPWS3 in my boat. Engine dates to 1990 and has a minimum of 2500 hours on it (hour meter was broken when I bought, didn't realise).

 

I start to get blue smoke at higher revs (1800+). This gradually gets worse until I dial it back again. The smoke then starts to reduce to almost nothing again. When cold I get very little smoke at all. This onky happens when warm.

 

In addition there is a black oil spraying from the exhaust. This is also weeping through the joints in the exhaust. I checked the oil last weekend and topped up about 200ml (after 45 hours running)

 

 

Everything seems to be pointing towards rings/ valves leaking and a rebuild.

 

Does the brain trust have any other ideas or quick fixes I csn check begird going down that route?

 

I'm on the Middlewich branch, Does anyone know a good engineer in my area? 

 07964 103345    Dave and son Joe, local, 

[EdwardMeades]

26 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

I suppose it might turn out to be glazed bores so I think a good blast on a river is unlikely to do much harm and just might do some good.

 

Are you sure its not overloading at speed.  That would indicate a fouled or oversized prop.

I did give it a good rag up and down to the nearest winding hole, didn't seem to help much.

Checked the prop and it is clear. Don't think its oversize but maybe I can find a picture of it somewhere...

21 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

 07964 103345    Dave and son Joe, local, 

Many thanks

[Alan de Enfield]

When / Why are you needing to get up to 1800RPM + ?

 

I had an LPWS4, and even with the 'hire boat' 3:1 gearbox I don't ever remember needing to get above ~ 1500 (except in emergency)

 

[EdwardMeades]

7 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

When / Why are you needing to get up to 1800RPM + ?

 

I had an LPWS4, and even with the 'hire boat' 3:1 gearbox I don't ever remember needing to get above ~ 1500 (except in emergency)

 

 

Well depends on the circumstances I suppose. Sometimes I need a bit of extra power to get up to 4mph if there is a headwind or current. If I'm squeezing through an especially tight bridge or avoiding a hire boater. Maybe I'm just rushing to get to Sainsburys before it closes?

 

I've got a PRM delta (older version of the 150?) but not sure of the ratio.

[Alan de Enfield]

2 minutes ago, EdwardMeades said:

 

Well depends on the circumstances I suppose. Sometimes I need a bit of extra power to get up to 4mph if there is a headwind or current. If I'm squeezing through an especially tight bridge or avoiding a hire boater. Maybe I'm just rushing to get to Sainsburys before it closes?

 

I've got a PRM delta (older version of the 150?) but not sure of the ratio.

 

 

Mine was a PRM - I think it should have the ratio on the 'label' (plate)

[Ray T]

1 hour ago, EdwardMeades said:

I have a Lister LPWS3 in my boat. Engine dates to 1990 and has a minimum of 2500 hours on it (hour meter was broken when I bought, didn't realise).

 

I start to get blue smoke at higher revs (1800+). This gradually gets worse until I dial it back again. The smoke then starts to reduce to almost nothing again. When cold I get very little smoke at all. This onky happens when warm.

 

In addition there is a black oil spraying from the exhaust. This is also weeping through the joints in the exhaust. I checked the oil last weekend and topped up about 200ml (after 45 hours running)

 

 

Everything seems to be pointing towards rings/ valves leaking and a rebuild.

 

Does the brain trust have any other ideas or quick fixes I csn check begird going down that route?

 

I'm on the Middlewich branch, Does anyone know a good engineer in my area? 

 

Any help?

 

The Answer is in the Smoke

We can generally understand what is wrong with a diesel engine by the colour of smoke emitted from the exhaust. There are three basic colours - black, white and blue.

Black Smoke

This is due to a air to fuel ratio imbalance, either the fuel system is delivering too much fuel into the engine or there is not enough clean air (oxygen ) a few things to look for:

• Faulty injectors (injectors need attention at about 100.000 to 120 000 miles)
• Faulty injector pump
• Dirty air cleaner
• Turbocharger or intercooler faulty
• Problems within cylinder head, valves clogged up due to faulty EGR (exhaust gas recycling unit)

White Smoke

Normally means that the fuel injected into the cylinder is not burning correctly. The smoke will burn your eyes.

• Engine/pump timing out
• Fuel starvation to the pump causing the pumps timing not to operate correctly
• Low engine compression
• Water/petrol in the fuel

Blue Smoke

The engine is burning engine oil

• Worn cylinders or piston rings
• Faulty valves or valve stem seals
• Engine over full with engine oil
• Faulty injector pump/lift pump allowing engine oil to be mixed with the diesel

 

Also:

 

 

Edited June 4, 2021 by Ray T

[Tony Brooks]

54 minutes ago, EdwardMeades said:

 

Well depends on the circumstances I suppose. Sometimes I need a bit of extra power to get up to 4mph if there is a headwind or current. If I'm squeezing through an especially tight bridge or avoiding a hire boater. Maybe I'm just rushing to get to Sainsburys before it closes?

 

I've got a PRM delta (older version of the 150?) but not sure of the ratio.

 

If you are trying to reach 4mph on all but the Northern Commerical waterways than that may well be a large part of your "problem". You are trying to over drive the boat for the waterway you are on. On some canals 2 mph is a good speed. I certainly think you would have problems on the Middlewich branch to much more than 3 mph.

 

In fact you may be dragging the hull along the bottom because you are blowing the water away from the back of the boat faster than it can get around the boat.

 

If you have a GPS or a GPS function on your phone set it to display speed. Then periodically gradually open the throttle but stop opening the instance the engine revs rise but the sped does not. There is absolutely no point in trying to go faster, all you will do is waste fuel and help destroy the canal.

 

Most of us keep an eye on the wash and water draw to see when the boat speed through the water is at its maximum for the waterway.