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I am acquiring some property on the river bank in Bristol and would like to know what is possible and what you would do?.


Mr. Wharf

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I don't have much experience with boats apart from kayaking trips and owning a dinghy when I was younger that I would take out on lakes a lot in Germany. I live in Bristol and am moving into a property that is right on the banks on the River Avon. I've attached images so you can see the river bank my back gate will lead directly to. Due to my lack of experience I'm not really sure what is possible. I'd imagine I can launch kayaks from there easily enough but I'd really like to be able to launch a motorised dinghy so I could travel further, faster on the river and even out to the sea if that is possible? I'd just like to know how any enthusiasts would play it if they lived here as I don't know where to start. I'll have a garage, a small courtyard and space right next to the river for kayaks. Thanks for any tips, advice or recommendations. What would you do?

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That is on the semi tidal part of the Avon that is controlled by Bristol Council. Its a bit of an odd place as mooring is not really allowed though I think there is a canoe/rowing club not far away.

You can either do very small trips unofficially, you will likely get away with it, or talk to the harbourmaster to see what he says. There is some info on the www if you search for Bristol Harbour. If you want to go out to sea its a bit tricky round there and you will likely need to pay some sort of fee to go into the harbour and use the sea lock.

 

Mooring of boats is not usually allowed because it can be a nasty bit of river, especially when it goes tidal, but away from spring tides and times of heavy rain its fine.

 

If you want to go upstream and through the lock then you will need a licence from CRT, but again the chances of getting stopped on a day trip are almost nill, CRT no longer have a lock keeper and have sold his house.

 

................Dave

 

 

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Thanks for the reply and the info. I'd definitely want to pay all the yearly fees and get licensed etc because I like to be around the river a lot practicing photography. I did look into it before all seems fairly straight forward. I didn't know about the sea lock though, I'll have to look into that. 

 

That is interesting that the river is still tidal, I don't plan on mooring but I would like to know the best sort of boat I could launch from the bank I posted. I'll be doing stand up paddle and kayaking but they seems fairly straight forward.

 

I was hoping I could launch some sort of motorised dinghy straight from the pictured bank and cruise upstream to Bath or out to sea possibly when my confidence builds and I know what I'm doing a bit more. For this I'd need a pretty descent inflatable with a motor that I could store in the garage and that i could put launch on that bank and also get it out relatively easily as well. So was just wondering if that would be possible and what boat would suit that plan. Would love to try some sea fishing. 

 

 

Edited by Mr. Wharf
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Do you actually own the land to the water's edge? If so you will have riparian rights (and probably own up to the middle of the river).

If not, then you have no more right to use the river than anyone else. But you do have a convenient location for launching dinghies and canoes. As others have said, it is unlikely anyone will stop you.

35 minutes ago, dmr said:

Its a bit of an odd place as mooring is not really allowed

But is it actually prohibited? You might need permission for any sort of jetty within the water area though.

Edited by David Mack
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Hi David. No I don't own the land on the edge unfortunately. There is a small cycle path between my garden and the river you will see in the pictures. My back garden and garage would be right at the fence you can see on the lower left hand corner so just a few feet away from the bank. It's certainly convenient that I'll be able to launch from there (hopefully). I would just like to know a descent dinghy/motor combo that I could take out for long distances and that would be easy to get in and out of the water on my own at the bank in those pictures. I suppose it would need to be quite light weight or maybe there is some tricks to getting it in and out with minimal fuss or effort. 

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Lots of information on the Bristol City Harbour web site:

 

https://www.bristol.gov.uk/streets-travel/bristol-harbour

 

https://www.bristol.gov.uk/documents/20182/34144/Navigation+and+berthing+charges+2015+to+2016/a77ef5da-70b8-44fa-b955-4f071e8d4921

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15 minutes ago, David Mack said:

But is it actually prohibited? You might need permission for any sort of jetty within the water area though.

 

I think I read that mooring is not allowed, but maybe this is casual mooring. There are a couple of moorings just below Hanham lock that look sort of long term and official.

 

There is a strange Bar/Cafe/Wedding venue called Bessees on the river that has a mooring for visiting boats so mooring on the semi-tidal Avon must be possible. We have never stopped there but my daughter (who lives in Bristol) got banned for going for a swim from there ?

 

...............Dave

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Beeses is a nice pub. I'm not far from there. Not sure why she was banned thought. People are always swimming in that part of the river. Over the next couple of day it'll be full of people swimming that's for sure. She must have just got unlucky!

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As for what type of boat I would suggest it needs to be light enough for you to drag it up the bank unless you can run a winch line through the gate. Then I suspect it will need a bit of decking over the end that goes into the eater first so it does not flood as it goes in but does not yet have enough buoyancy to float. Finally and probably most important I think it would need a wooden bolt on keel plus similar runners on either side all with steel D section on the lower faces so as you drag it  up the bank and over the path the hull is protected. You can always carry a small outboard to the boat once its launched. Otherwise, its back to something you can carry like a canoe - I think you could put  a small electric outboard on the side of a Canadian canoe.

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8 hours ago, Mr. Wharf said:

I was hoping I could launch some sort of motorised dinghy straight from the pictured bank and cruise upstream to Bath or out to sea possibly when my confidence builds and I know what I'm doing a bit more.

 

I'd suggest that any motor boat you can launch singlehanded is very unlikely to be suitable for going 'to sea' with.

 

Going out at Avonmouth you are going out onto the river Severn which has the third highest tidal range in the world, only the bay of Fundy (north America) and Ungava bay ( Hudson straits) are bigger. The tidal range on the Severn can be as much as 15m (49ft), this combined to the 'funnel' shaped estuary causes the incoming tide to create great a bore.

You get very very strong currents which a small boat with a small engine will not be able to cope with.

 

It would be beneficial to get some experience (with other boaters, on sea-going boats) to understand how different the sea is to the inland rivers and canals.

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33 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

I'd suggest that any motor boat you can launch singlehanded is very unlikely to be suitable for going 'to sea' with.

 

Going out at Avonmouth you are going out onto the river Severn which has the third highest tidal range in the world, only the bay of Fundy (north America) and Ungava bay ( Hudson straits) are bigger. The tidal range on the Severn can be as much as 15m (49ft), this combined to the 'funnel' shaped estuary causes the incoming tide to create great a bore.

You get very very strong currents which a small boat with a small engine will not be able to cope with.

 

It would be beneficial to get some experience (with other boaters, on sea-going boats) to understand how different the sea is to the inland rivers and canals.

I fully endorse Alan's comments. The Estuary can be a very challenging place at times, especially for someone who has little or no experience, and please don't underestimate what can be involved in boating offshore. With some training and experience it can be a marvellous experience but without those two things it can quickly turn round and bite you.

 

Howard

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1 hour ago, Tony Brooks said:

As for what type of boat I would suggest it needs to be light enough for you to drag it up the bank unless you can run a winch line through the gate. Then I suspect it will need a bit of decking over the end that goes into the eater first so it does not flood as it goes in but does not yet have enough buoyancy to float. Finally and probably most important I think it would need a wooden bolt on keel plus similar runners on either side all with steel D section on the lower faces so as you drag it  up the bank and over the path the hull is protected. You can always carry a small outboard to the boat once its launched. Otherwise, its back to something you can carry like a canoe - I think you could put  a small electric outboard on the side of a Canadian canoe.

Since there is a footpath/cycle path between the OPs property and the river bank I doubt that he will actually own that part of the bank, so his building anything there is doubtful, and as for laying a winch line across it, as someone else suggested, forget it. That is part of the Bristol to Bath Cycleway and can get very busy.

1 hour ago, howardang said:

I fully endorse Alan's comments. The Estuary can be a very challenging place at times, especially for someone who has little or no experience, and please don't underestimate what can be involved in boating offshore. With some training and experience it can be a marvellous experience but without those two things it can quickly turn round and bite you.

 

Howard

Would they allow a small open boat through Cumberland Lock?

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33 minutes ago, Graham Davis said:

Since there is a footpath/cycle path between the OPs property and the river bank I doubt that he will actually own that part of the bank, so his building anything there is doubtful, and as for laying a winch line across it, as someone else suggested, forget it. That is part of the Bristol to Bath Cycleway and can get very busy.

Would they allow a small open boat through Cumberland Lock?

 

So that cycleway is busy 24/7?  I rather think not. The time taken to drag a boat up the bank and into the gate  would be what? 5 minutes maximum I would suggest and it would be very unfortunate that anyone even knew if a suitable time was chosen. Only an idiot would try it  on a day like today until very much later..

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One of my daughters lives in Bristol and does a lot of paddle boarding on that stretch and elsewhere. She is a good kid so has several licences including one from CART for the canals and one from Bristol harbour office for the avon so I suggest giving them a bell.

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2 hours ago, Graham Davis said:

Since there is a footpath/cycle path between the OPs property and the river bank I doubt that he will actually own that part of the bank, so his building anything there is doubtful, and as for laying a winch line across it, as someone else suggested, forget it. That is part of the Bristol to Bath Cycleway and can get very busy.

Would they allow a small open boat through Cumberland Lock?

Hi. I could probably get away with building something there as long as it didn't obstruct the path obviously and wasn't ugly. That cycle path is actually tucked away and quiet. Quite far away from the Bristol to Bath Railway path cycle path you are thinking of. As I said don't own any of the riverbank unfortunately.

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4 hours ago, howardang said:

I fully endorse Alan's comments. The Estuary can be a very challenging place at times, especially for someone who has little or no experience, and please don't underestimate what can be involved in boating offshore. With some training and experience it can be a marvellous experience but without those two things it can quickly turn round and bite you.

 

Howard

 

 

4 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

I'd suggest that any motor boat you can launch singlehanded is very unlikely to be suitable for going 'to sea' with.

 

Going out at Avonmouth you are going out onto the river Severn which has the third highest tidal range in the world, only the bay of Fundy (north America) and Ungava bay ( Hudson straits) are bigger. The tidal range on the Severn can be as much as 15m (49ft), this combined to the 'funnel' shaped estuary causes the incoming tide to create great a bore.

You get very very strong currents which a small boat with a small engine will not be able to cope with.

 

It would be beneficial to get some experience (with other boaters, on sea-going boats) to understand how different the sea is to the inland rivers and canals.

Thanks Guys. Point taken! I'll stick to the river ways and canals then. Still plenty to explore though and I'd still want a motorised dinghy for day trips as I'd love to be able to visit leigh woods via the water.  So The main issue I'd have is getting a dinghy with a descent motor in and out of the water right outside my back gate. 

 

5 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

As for what type of boat I would suggest it needs to be light enough for you to drag it up the bank unless you can run a winch line through the gate. Then I suspect it will need a bit of decking over the end that goes into the eater first so it does not flood as it goes in but does not yet have enough buoyancy to float. Finally and probably most important I think it would need a wooden bolt on keel plus similar runners on either side all with steel D section on the lower faces so as you drag it  up the bank and over the path the hull is protected. You can always carry a small outboard to the boat once its launched. Otherwise, its back to something you can carry like a canoe - I think you could put  a small electric outboard on the side of a Canadian canoe.

Thanks Tony this is what I'm really interested in. Ways of getting a boat with a motor in and out of the water and what type of boat it should be. Thinking about it, I doubt I would get away with building anything on the bank as it may well be a conservation area. I could use a winch but that sounds like more infrastructure is needed. I guess I'd be using an inflatable boat light enough to carry to the water (unless there is another way that hasn't been discussed) but heavy duty enough to secure a mid range motor to. I think a kayak/canoe with a small electric motor would work well but I'd like something that went a bit quicker as those motors seem to be quite slow. Be interested in any suggestions or examples of a dinghy and motor pairing that might work. Thanks for the replies. 

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Having spent many years of my youth sailing boats of various sizes on the Bristol Channel from Newport to Lands End I can assure you any small portable boat is not really up to it unless you have an escort boat with a big engine. We never went out in dingys unless there were a few of us or there was a support boat. The tidal current can easily reach 7 knots at headlands which basically means you need a RIB or similar with a big engine to go against it, in a good breeze you can get 1.5 to 2 metre high wave when you have wind against tide which I have seen coming over the deck on a 32 foot boat. The waves will be smaller up by bristol but the currents can be faster.

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7 minutes ago, Mr. Wharf said:

 

 

Thanks Guys. Point taken! I'll stick to the river ways and canals then. Still plenty to explore though and I'd still want a motorised dinghy for day trips as I'd love to be able to visit leigh woods via the water.  So The main issue I'd have is getting a dinghy with a descent motor in and out of the water right outside my back gate. 

 

Thanks Tony this is what I'm really interested in. Ways of getting a boat with a motor in and out of the water and what type of boat it should be. Thinking about it, I doubt I would get away with building anything on the bank as it may well be a conservation area. I could use a winch but that sounds like more infrastructure is needed. I guess I'd be using an inflatable boat light enough to carry to the water (unless there is another way that hasn't been discussed) but heavy duty enough to secure a mid range motor to. I think a kayak/canoe with a small electric motor would work well but I'd like something that went a bit quicker as those motors seem to be quite slow. Be interested in any suggestions or examples of a dinghy and motor pairing that might work. Thanks for the replies. 

 

I don't think that you will move virtually any boat with the motor aboard but 9.9 Mercury outboards were perfectly carryable so launch first and the fit OB.

 

I don't understand the bit about infrastructure for a winch apart from getting a winch and bolting it down on your property. You think a suitable (electric) winch would easily pull a dingy up that bank.

 

I agree that going down the tidal Avon and Severn is unlikely to be done safely in anything you can launch at that spot.

 

 

Edited by Tony Brooks
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1 minute ago, Detling said:

Having spent many years of my youth sailing boats of various sizes on the Bristol Channel from Newport to Lands End I can assure you any small portable boat is not really up to it unless you have an escort boat with a big engine. We never went out in dingys unless there were a few of us or there was a support boat. The tidal current can easily reach 7 knots at headlands which basically means you need a RIB or similar with a big engine to go against it, in a good breeze you can get 1.5 to 2 metre high wave when you have wind against tide which I have seen coming over the deck on a 32 foot boat. The waves will be smaller up by bristol but the currents can be faster.

Thanks for the warning. I already ruled that out in the post above yours. I'm happy with the fastest most heavy duty dinghy and motor that I could launch and retrieve from the bank outside my property. Hopefully I'm able to do that anyway. 

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We have an inflatable with a 2hp 4-stroke engine used as a tender to get us from the 'big boat' to the shore to take the dog ashore, walks etc etc. It performs well enough on the 'open sea' at 4mph so although slow going against a 3mph tide you can make headway.

There is no way it would be safe to use on the Severn.

 

Its is 32kg + engine and manageable by one person (one advantage is that if the worst does happen you have a big red air-bubble to hang onto, even if one of the chambers is punctured).

 

I take the engine off and lift it onto the back of the boat by myself. Not easy, but not impossible.

 

 

 

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Edited by Alan de Enfield
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3 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

I don't think that you will move virtually any boat with the motor aboard but 9.9 Mercury outboards were perfectly carryable so launch first and the fit OB.

 

I don't understand the bit about infrastructure for a winch apart from getting a winch and bolting it down on your property. You think a suitable (electric) winch would easily pull a dingy up that bank.

 

 

I think I misunderstood your original post because I'm not familiar with all the terminology. I thought it involved making adjustments to the bank but reading it again I think you are just referring to adjustments or specifics on the boat. I probably could bolt a winch down on the courtyard of my property to drag an inflatable out when I think about it. 

 

So in this case the method would be to lower the motorised inflatable into the water and remove it with the winch, but in order to do this without flooding the boat or damaging it, I'd have to make alterations? Or can I purchase an inflatable that would be already suitable? 

 

Thanks for the help.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Mr. Wharf said:

Or can I purchase an inflatable that would be already suitable? 

 

Yes - see above.

 

But - dont drag it across a road or anywhere where the bottom will abrade. You can easily lift it onto a trolley (wheel barrow type thing) once its out of the water. No winch needed.

 

 

Deluxe Launching Trolley Sling For Laser PICO Dinghy Sailing Boat

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14 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Yes - see above.

 

But - dont drag it across a road or anywhere where the bottom will abrade. You can easily lift it onto a trolley (wheel barrow type thing) once its out of the water. No winch needed.

Thanks. Looks good but I don't think I would need a trolley as my house is about 15 foot away from the water. I'd just need to be able to get the dinghy in and out of that bank pictured.

 

So I'm thinking I would - carry the dinghy and plop it in the water and somehow secure it to the bank, Then take the motor down and mount it. Then do the reverse while retrieving the dinghy. Not sure I could achieve this without some sort dragging. I guess I'll only know for sure once I've tried it. Good to know something will in all likelihood be possible. 

 

Just seen the pic of the trolley. Maybe something like that could be useful. I do have a back problem so that is worry for getting a dinghy like that in and out of that bank. Maybe the winch idea is worth exploring. 

Edited by Mr. Wharf
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