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?head gasket - advice please?


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7 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

If you don't want our advice, then we will not bother. Adding a spurious wonder goo to the water is daft.

i just asked for a plan - and why - please explain rather than assume i know why

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38 minutes ago, andy4502 said:

ok - so if the consensus is that it is not gasket what is my plan?

 

What does the air filter look like? Any signs of sump oil in there?

 

If you were burning coolant you'd smell it - it's got a very distinctive smell.

Edited by StephenA
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ok - check air filter - next on list (at least i know where that is, i am not sure you realise the depth of ignorance you are dealing with here)

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7 minutes ago, andy4502 said:

ok - check air filter - next on list (at least i know where that is, i am not sure you realise the depth of ignorance you are dealing with here)

 

I am afraid that realistically its either DIY, which you seem to indicate you can't do, or pay for professional advice. You could walk to Tewksbury marina if you wanted to get professional help there. Although they may not specialise in narrowboats the engine is used all over so they should be capable of sorting it.

 

Your engine has glow plugs so IF you can get hold of the equipment to do a compression test then it MIGHT rule out a head gasket problem.

 

What are the results of checking the prop for fouling (unlikely but worth checking)?

What is the result of checking the filter in the end of the lift pump (but again not likely)?

What are the answers to the questions Alan asked you several hours ago?

 

Diagnosing problems is a process with a number of steps, made harder without knowledge or suitable equipment. We have been trying to get you to follow a process but so far without any apparent action or answers from you. To be honest, I am moving towards Tracy's position. You are beginning to look like a time waster.

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Look i can do without the abuse tbf, I have done a basic course with RCR, I know if theory how it works - but in practice i have no idea. Actually if i wanted to be slated i could go elsewhere. I have previously found this site to be very helpful - but not this time.

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I have just been doing some calculations and the peak pressure in a diesel cylinder will be close to 900 psi. That is about 30 times more pressure than is in a car tyre. Whatever is happening in your engine, it is unlikely to be a minor head gasket leak or cracked head/block so ask your self just how likely that a liquid can hold against that sort of pressure, even when/if it solidifies.

 

Now, as long  as there is no head gasket leak I don't think adding the magic jollop into the coolant will do much harm in the SHORT term but given time may eventually clog small waterways in the engine or block calorfier circuits so its a short term measure that would require the system draining, flushing well and refilling with antifreeze mixture before very long. On the other hand, if the gasket is leaking then you stand a very good chance of not sealing it but instead gluing the head, block and gasket together as described by bee (I think).

 

Even IF it is  a head gasket problem and IF you managed to seal it ask yourself how long it is likely to last when faced with that pressure and a maximum temperature of maybe 750C (others here know more about the combustion precess than me) how long will it last before you need to get it seen to. Do you relish the problem reoccurring on the Severn? You mayn s well get it fixed properly now rather than risk more problems.

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ok thanks Tony - however marina does not have engineer so will have to talk to bloke who was planned to do work and see where we go from there. I gather from the rather universal opinion on here that no one thinks these products are any good or worth using.

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by the way everyone else - not everyone, or even the majority of people know how to do the things you so blithely describe. I am a paramedic and dont expect any of you know how to do some of the stuff i do. It takes time and effort to learn this stuff and i am trying so the general dismissal of what i thought was not an unreasonable question is not much fun or helpful.

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2 minutes ago, andy4502 said:

Look i can do without the abuse tbf, I have done a basic course with RCR, I know if theory how it works - but in practice i have no idea. Actually if i wanted to be slated i could go elsewhere. I have previously found this site to be very helpful - but not this time.

 

Try helping those that were willing to try to help you or explain why you can not. If you refuse then you can expect people to lose patience with you and so far I have seen no abuse. What I have seen is a person asking for help who, for some reason, refused to answer vital questions and keeps asking to be told its OK to pour the magic liquid in to his engine. Then when people lose patience with him he accuses those trying to help of abuse. The only abuse I see is coming from you. That is abuse of those trying to help you.

 

We see it all the time, a relatively new poster does not get the answer they think they want and are entitled to so starts throwing accusations of abuse about.

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Just now, Tony Brooks said:

 

Try helping those that were willing to try to help you or explain why you can not. If you refuse then you can expect people to lose patience with you and so far I have seen no abuse. What I have seen is a person asking for help who, for some reason, refused to answer vital questions and keeps asking to be told its OK to pour the magic liquid in to his engine. Then when people lose patience with him he accuses those trying to help of abuse. The only abuse I see is coming from you. That is abuse of those trying to help you.

 

We see it all the time, a relatively new poster does not get the answer they think they want and are entitled to so starts throwing accusations of abuse about.

Tony - if i have to explain something i understand to someone who has no experience of it i do not just put complex shit in there then tell them they are stupid and wasting my time when they dont understand it. I understand that people dont want to condescend but you have to find a balance - and this thread has not been reasonable.

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3 minutes ago, andy4502 said:

by the way everyone else - not everyone, or even the majority of people know how to do the things you so blithely describe. I am a paramedic and dont expect any of you know how to do some of the stuff i do. It takes time and effort to learn this stuff and i am trying so the general dismissal of what i thought was not an unreasonable question is not much fun or helpful.

 

If you were within about 30 miles of Reading I would happily come and have a look FOC but you are not so that will not help. I think this topic has run its course. You won't answer questions for whatever reason and don't know how to do something simple like taking a bayonet cap off or checking the prop so all you are left with is paying for professional help.

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4 minutes ago, andy4502 said:

I am a paramedic and dont expect any of you know how to do some of the stuff i do

Most of us can't do the stuff you do, and some of us have cause to be thankful for the skills of you and your colleagues.

 

Before responding, just take a deep breath and consider. We have now, after some toing and froing, got some pictures of your engine, so those that recognise it ( I don't) can now start to point out some possible issues. If they are to be successful, they will need answers to the supplementary questions that have been asked. If you were having to deal with an ill or injured patient over the phone you would be asking the person with them to describe what is wrong, you might ask them to do something and report back on the patient's response. This is really little different.

 

So when you say your engine is struggling, what do you actually mean? Is it overheating? smoking? failing to rev up? sounding laboured? stopping without warning?  thrashing furiously while the boat hardly moves through the water? Give us a clue!

 

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4 minutes ago, andy4502 said:

Tony - if i have to explain something i understand to someone who has no experience of it i do not just put complex shit in there then tell them they are stupid and wasting my time when they dont understand it. I understand that people dont want to condescend but you have to find a balance - and this thread has not been reasonable.

 

You have never said you don't understand or asked for clarification, so how do you expect forum members to know you don't understand or don't know how to do something.

 

I am sure that you would not even try to tell a random person you don't know and can't see how to do a tracheotomy and from your symptoms that is exactly similar to what you are asking the forum to do for you. A compression tester is probably needed so that is a bit like you telling someone to defibrillate a person without a defibrillator. Liquid to test the coolant for hydrocarbon content may also be needed so that is a bit like you telling someone to administer adrenaline who has no equipment and has never done it. Basically those are examples of what you are expecting the forum to do. It's simply not possible.

 

So ask for clarification or ask how to do things and then we may be able to help but I suspect you will still need a professional to sort it out.

 

I think

10 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Most of us can't do the stuff you do, and some of us have cause to be thankful for the skills of you and your colleagues.

 

Before responding, just take a deep breath and consider. We have now, after some toing and froing, got some pictures of your engine, so those that recognise it ( I don't) can now start to point out some possible issues. If they are to be successful, they will need answers to the supplementary questions that have been asked. If you were having to deal with an ill or injured patient over the phone you would be asking the person with them to describe what is wrong, you might ask them to do something and report back on the patient's response. This is really little different.

 

So when you say your engine is struggling, what do you actually mean? Is it overheating? smoking? failing to rev up? sounding laboured? stopping without warning?  thrashing furiously while the boat hardly moves through the water? Give us a clue!

 

 

That is a good thought, could be gearbox slipping  but not sure how the smoke fits in unless its badly over revving but that would implicate the governor .

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There is a certain procedure for bunging goo into an engines cooling system. the main point is to remove the thermostat first or it's very likely to get goo'd up and jamb. If there's been and external coolant leak on the engine dribbling from somewhere the antifreeze content baked on the engine externals should stink of curry when the engine is hot. When I opened a cars bonnets in the garage and smelt curry I always knew there was or had been a leak.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi all, thank you for the advice, have edited first post with update

On 30/05/2021 at 18:32, andy4502 said:

Hi hive mind,

 

Have a 1990's 3 cyl diesel (either vetus or thorny 3DM - not sure). Over last few trips have had occasional white smoke bursts with strange running (speeding up). It was due to go for service/clean bay/and bottom engine gasket),.....however......on trip today vast white smoke, engine runs high and out of control, took a while for engine stop to work. On restarting still smoking if try to use high revs. Got back to marina on low tickover etc.

 

Question is - do you think its worth trying this:

 

KALIMEX LTD ST5501 Coolant Leak Repair

my logic is - do the easiest thing first - what do you reckon?

Update: have come back to the boat and found that the air filter is shockingly filthy. Have ordered new one! This may explain pattern of issue and problem initially I came on for as it has occurred after I have been running the engine for a number of hours.

 

currently plan - new filter, run engine at load for hours to see if problem reoccurs. Have not put that stuff in :)

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32 minutes ago, andy4502 said:

Hi all, thank you for the advice, have edited first post with update

Update: have come back to the boat and found that the air filter is shockingly filthy. Have ordered new one! This may explain pattern of issue and problem initially I came on for as it has occurred after I have been running the engine for a number of hours.

 

currently plan - new filter, run engine at load for hours to see if problem reoccurs. Have not put that stuff in :)

 

You can run the engine without am air cleaner for now, many boats do not have them. That should indicate if it is the problem.

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Update: changed air filter and went out for 90 mins with engine under load. No smoke and tick over better. When I pushed the engine it did smoke but at standard revs no smoke. So I think the main issue was air filter but there are obviously other issues. Main thing is that I can move her for servicing which will hopefully sort out the other issues. Thanks for advice all.

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8 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Subscribe the money you saved, not buying radiator sealer, to the forum in thanks for the accurate advice that you got for free?

That's another greeny I have had to give you

7 hours ago, Machpoint005 said:

...having subtracted the cost of an air filter, of course!

Well as he would have needed an air cleaner anyway and he hasn't had to pay to have all the crap cleaned out of his cooling system or his new engine because the crap wouldn't have fixed it, he will still be well on the right side

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5 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

That's another greeny I have had to give you

Well as he would have needed an air cleaner anyway and he hasn't had to pay to have all the crap cleaned out of his cooling system or his new engine because the crap wouldn't have fixed it, he will still be well on the right side

Greenie returned with alacrity.  He is technically ahead then.

 

I had a friend who used 6 bottles of Holts Rad weld in a Morris Minor, we had to replace the radiator core. Fortunately it was in the days when you could get rads rebuilt. It didn't fix the leaking water pump either of course!

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6 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

 . Fortunately it was in the days when you could get rads rebuilt. It didn't fix the leaking water pump either of course!

Watched the local rad place doing that more than once as a teenager

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On 11/06/2021 at 09:20, andy4502 said:

Update: changed air filter and went out for 90 mins with engine under load. No smoke and tick over better. When I pushed the engine it did smoke but at standard revs no smoke. So I think the main issue was air filter but there are obviously other issues. Main thing is that I can move her for servicing which will hopefully sort out the other issues. Thanks for advice all.

Just in the same place, engine started fine  and tick over fine, vibrating under load at different revs, pulled the ait cleaner out and instant tune up. I will take it home and give it a going over with the Dyson and an air line. Beta one about £100 and Inline filters about £35

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