Mourning the disappearance of laundry tablets.

[David Mack]

2 hours ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

If I remember right, thermal decomposition of PVA takes place around 200 to 300C, which is a warmer wash than many clothes are comfortable with.

To wash your clothes at 200-300C you would need quite a pressure cooker! At those temperatures you'd probably get thermal decomposition of your clothes!

Edited May 19, 2021 by David Mack

[tree monkey]

2 hours ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

If I remember right, thermal decomposition of PVA takes place around 200 to 300C, which is a warmer wash than many clothes are comfortable with. Have used it in the past as a binder for pressed ceramic powder that then gets removed entirely as it is sintered at over 1,000C. There may be a UV, or biological degradation mechanism that decomposes the PVA.

My cynical side says this: Soap powder companies have a naturally limited market that they are all trying to get a slice of. Ways of getting a bigger profit might be to use advertising to prime people to pick their pack out of the supermarket aisle, rather than someone else. Soap powder was one of the products on which modern advertising was developed. Related to this are efforts to persuade people that their clothes are filthier than they are and need washing more often. Another is to change the format, so powder to tablets to capsules to whatever, which gives a higher profit margin. I stick with powder in my twin tub and half the packet recommended quantity. The fact that people keep their distance from me is purely from coronavirus precautions and nothing else! ?

I really am talking here about something I know very little about, not that has ever stopped me

anyway angling uses PVA bags to carry bait and ground bait to the swim because it quickly breaks down in water, apparently the residue is quickly degraded into water and carbon dioxide

[Jen-in-Wellies]

5 minutes ago, David Mack said:

To wash your clothes at 200-300C you would need quite a pressure cooker! At those temperatures you'd probably get thermal decomposition of your clothes!

Clothes that disintegrate after one wash. The Primark approach!

[cuthound]

8 hours ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

If I remember right, thermal decomposition of PVA takes place around 200 to 300C, which is a warmer wash than many clothes are comfortable with. Have used it in the past as a binder for pressed ceramic powder that then gets removed entirely as it is sintered at over 1,000C. There may be a UV, or biological degradation mechanism that decomposes the PVA.

My cynical side says this: Soap powder companies have a naturally limited market that they are all trying to get a slice of. Ways of getting a bigger profit might be to use advertising to prime people to pick their pack out of the supermarket aisle, rather than someone else. Soap powder was one of the products on which modern advertising was developed. Related to this are efforts to persuade people that their clothes are filthier than they are and need washing more often. Another is to change the format, so powder to tablets to capsules to whatever, which gives a higher profit margin. I stick with powder in my twin tub and half the packet recommended quantity. The fact that people keep their distance from me is purely from coronavirus precautions and nothing else! ?

 

Many years ago I used to subscribe to Which magazine.

 

They recommeded repeatedly halving the quantity of washing powder until the clothes were not clean and then going back one step.

 

The fact that you can't  easily do this with capsules or tablets isn't lost on the manufacturer.

Edited May 19, 2021 by cuthound
Spillung

[Hudds Lad]

55 minutes ago, cuthound said:

 

Many years ago I used to subscribe to Which magazine.

 

They recommeded repeatedly halving the quantity of washing powder until the clothes were not clean and then going back one step.

 

The fact that you can't  easily do this with capsules or tablets isn't lost on the manufacturer.

 

This relies on you wearing exactly the same amount and type of clothes every time you do a wash as well shirley?

[blackrose]

On 19/05/2021 at 08:48, Jen-in-Wellies said:

If I remember right, thermal decomposition of PVA takes place around 200 to 300C, which is a warmer wash than many clothes are comfortable with. Have used it in the past as a binder for pressed ceramic powder that then gets removed entirely as it is sintered at over 1,000C. There may be a UV, or biological degradation mechanism that decomposes the PVA.

?

 

PVOH, not PVA. It dissolves in very low temperatures, well below 60C

[Machpoint005]

That's why the Smol dishwasher tablets are sticky/slimy to the touch. Better than handling caustic chemicals though. Sorry that's going again.

 

The Smol laundry capsules are non-bio, BTW.

[restlessnomad]

what is the difference between bio and non-bio? I just buy which ever is on offer.

[Tony Brooks]

15 minutes ago, restlessnomad said:

what is the difference between bio and non-bio? I just buy which ever is on offer.

 

I understand Bio ones have enzymes in them that help break down soiling from organic sources.

[restlessnomad]

Just now, Tony Brooks said:

 

I understand Bio ones have enzymes in them that help break down soiling from organic sources.

so bio is good for environment?

are boat people allowed to release the dirty water from washing machine to canal(if it is bio)

[Tony Brooks]

2 minutes ago, restlessnomad said:

so bio is good for environment?

are boat people allowed to release the dirty water from washing machine to canal(if it is bio)

 

I suspect its neither good nor bad. What may be bad for the environment are the phosphates most cleaning products seem to contain. But note those phosphates are strictly limited in the UK

[Jerra]

52 minutes ago, restlessnomad said:

what is the difference between bio and non-bio? I just buy which ever is on offer.

Bio contains enzymes and causes an allergic skin reaction in some people.

[TheBiscuits]

On 19/05/2021 at 11:35, Jen-in-Wellies said:

Clothes that disintegrate after one wash. The Primark approach!

 

Wash?  That's not a boater's approach ...

[Hudds Lad]

We switched to non-bio when daughter was born as its supposed to be better for baby stuff, we just never switched back and she’s 16 in Nov.  

[Jerra]

56 minutes ago, Hudds Lad said:

We switched to non-bio when daughter was born as its supposed to be better for baby stuff, we just never switched back and she’s 16 in Nov.  

We switched to non bio when Mrs J started to develop rashes with newly washed clothes.   No problems since.

[Jen-in-Wellies]

On 21/05/2021 at 16:54, Jerra said:

We switched to non bio when Mrs J started to develop rashes with newly washed clothes.   No problems since.

Had a similar experience. Can't use bio washing powders for this reason.

[manxmike]

On 19/05/2021 at 08:48, Jen-in-Wellies said:

Soap powder was one of the products on which modern advertising was developed.

Hence the dreadful TV programmes that were supported by detergent advertising (aimed at bored housewives who watched daytime telly back in the 50s and 60s) were called "soaps". Even though you rarely see detergent adverts during them nowadays they (the TV dreadfuls) retain the name "soaps". I expect the reason the detergent manufacturers stopped being the only advertisers is because everyone watches the horrible TV programmes now.

[Graham Davis]

On 18/05/2021 at 18:29, Machpoint005 said:

Still capsules, rather than tablets, but they are very good, according to the Memsahib:

https://smolproducts.com/

They claim to be environmentally friendly, being made of biodegradable (not merely soluble) plastic, and the packaging is entirely cardboard.

 

Their dishwasher tablets (which really are tablets) are also very good -- that's my department.

 

 

We've recently moved to using Smol for both washing and dishes and have found them excellent.
Also n ow bought some of their other cleaning products and they provide spray bottles and refill units for them.

Edited May 26, 2021 by Graham Davis

[blackrose]

On 21/05/2021 at 13:05, restlessnomad said:

what is the difference between bio and non-bio? I just buy which ever is on offer.

 

If you look at the instructions for some wool garments and also some synthetics it says to use non-bio as the enzymes in biological washing detergents can damage delicate items. 

On 21/05/2021 at 13:26, restlessnomad said:

so bio is good for environment?

are boat people allowed to release the dirty water from washing machine to canal(if it is bio)

 

Bio or non-bio is nothing to do with the environment, it's about the method that the detergent washes the clothes. 

 

You can release both into a canal but neither are particularly good for the water quality.