Explains my electrical system which is like no other

[PD1964]

18 minutes ago, LadyG said:

There one was a wiring diagram, very basic, and not very accurate. 

There are numerous isolator switches, at least six. 

There are dozens of other switches, most are obvious, some are not.

There are fuses from the ceramic era through the 1960s auto, to a few modern ones. 

None of the electricians have wanted the job of sorting the system, I've left the opportunity open to them, well to those I considered competent. 

I really don't want to spend any more time or money on the work, I just want to get the inside decor finished and get on with my retirement, stress free, that was the plan and still is. 

 

  I thought you were getting all this sorted and getting a new control panel custom designed and made by a top university in Scotland as in one of your previous Threads when you were confused about your electric switches and fuse types? I take it this didn’t materialise or did you find them as incompetent as all your electricians you’ve had on board?

Edited May 14, 2021 by PD1964

[LadyG]

3 hours ago, Loddon said:

I will put money on the bow batteries being charged from the battery charger running from a combi inverter/charger on the rear batteries.

As the boat appears to have been built to run off a landline this would make total sense ?

You lost, there is no invertor charger on the boat, the charger at the stern is 20 amps designed in the 1960' it boiled the LA batteries adequately. 

There once was an inverter charger, but it was mistakenly removed when I was told it was an invertor, in fact it was labelled charger, the label remains, but the unit has gone. 

Edited May 14, 2021 by LadyG

[restlessnomad]

2 hours ago, David Mack said:

Or post on here from your phone, compose your text, then click the "Add Files" button at the bottom of the new post box, navigate to where your phone stores its images and click on the relevant picture file(s), and then click Done, and the image(s) will upload to the forum. Then place your cursor in the message text where you want an image to appear and click the + symbol on the image, and it will appear in the text. And then click Submit. Robert is your mother's brother.

ya, that will work, is the file size issue of the forum sorted?

[Naughty Cal]

Earlier you said there was no immersion heater. Now you say it was left on. Which is it? ?

[matty40s]

4 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

Earlier you said there was no immersion heater. Now you say it was left on. Which is it? ?

Well, there was no working immersion heater after it had been left on a while....

[LadyG]

23 minutes ago, Naughty Cal said:

Earlier you said there was no immersion heater. Now you say it was left on. Which is it? ?

Somehow all the ducks got in a row two weeks ago, and the immersion heater has been sucking power of the batteries. This Co incided with my plan to do laundry on a daily basis, using more hot water than usual, you could not make it up

There are at least four heating systems on the boat, and something which is black box, under the sink, freeze preventer. 

The immersion switch is so labelled, but later up the line to the batteries it becomes Heater, I assumed this referred to Webasto, but apparently not. 

I think I might invest in a label maker, 

Edited May 14, 2021 by LadyG

[PD1964]

19 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Somehow all the ducks got in a row two weeks ago, and the immersion heater has been sucking power of the batteries. This Co incided with my plan to do laundry on a daily basis, using more hot water than usual, you could not make it up

There are at least four heating systems on the boat, and something which is black box, under the sink, freeze preventer. 

The immersion switch is so labelled, but later up the line to the batteries it becomes Heater, I assumed this referred to Webasto, but apparently not. 

I think I might invest in a label maker, 

Label Maker? I will repeat my last post.  I thought you were getting all this sorted and getting a new control panel custom designed and made by a top university in Scotland as in one of your previous Threads when you were confused about your electric switches and fuse types? I take it this didn’t materialise or did you find them asincompetent as all your electricians you’ve had onboard?

[Chagall]

29 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Somehow all the ducks got in a row two weeks ago, and the immersion heater has been sucking power of the batteries. This Co incided with my plan to do laundry on a daily basis, using more hot water than usual, you could not make it up

There are at least four heating systems on the boat, and something which is black box, under the sink, freeze preventer. 

The immersion switch is so labelled, but later up the line to the batteries it becomes Heater, I assumed this referred to Webasto, but apparently not. 

I think I might invest in a label maker, 

I suggest you invest in a shotgun, shoot the ruddy ducks! 

 

edit to add:  truthfully? I really don't think anybody that tried to help cares right now. 

Edited May 14, 2021 by Chagall

[Murflynn]

4 hours ago, restlessnomad said:

try https://postimages.org

upload your image, it will give you back a link and give the link to the image here. No need to send to your laptop.

 

do we really need to see her image?   

[LadyG]

5 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

And she seems remarkably reluctant to give voltage readings so we can see how likely that is.

It's the difficulty of testing the batteries with a multimeter

I cant access all the batteries, it takes half an hour even to get at them, I never use a multimeter, I don't know if it still works, I can't be sure how it works.

I have an LED voltmeter at the bow batteries, at this exact moment they are showing 12.25 the engine has been off for 90minutes, they were 10.6 this morning at 5.00 am, engine on for about seven hours. I will move the boat again on to some cat friendly moorings tomorrow, that should be another four hours, hopefully some sunshine. 

The LED seens to be the most precise gauge, the voltmeter at the back, is showing somewhere between 14.2 and 14.4 I think.

 

 

[Alan de Enfield]

7 minutes ago, LadyG said:

I have an LED voltmeter at the bow batteries, at this exact moment they are showing 12.25 the engine has been off for 90minutes, they were 10.6 this morning at 5.00 am, engine on for about seven hours. I will move the boat again on to some cat friendly moorings tomorrow, that should be another four hours, hopefully some sunshine. 

The LED seens to be the most precise gauge, the voltmeter at the back, is showing somewhere between 14.2 and 14.4 I think.

 

I think your Bow LED voltmeter is showing the true voltage that is arriving at the end of very long thin wires and the 12.25v is (probably) correct.

The stern voltmeter is showing the true voltage 14.2-14.4v at the stern batteries and is (probably) showing the correct viltage.

 

This shows the problem of volt drop that several of us have been trying to get you to accept.

 

If the voltages are correct (and they will be measuring surface charge and not tru charge levels) this is why your bow batteries are never getting properly charged.

 

You appear to have a 2 volt volt-drop on the 120 foot circuit.

[Murflynn]

27 minutes ago, LadyG said:

It's the difficulty of testing the batteries with a multimeter

I cant access all the batteries, it takes half an hour even to get at them, I never use a multimeter, I don't know if it still works, I can't be sure how it works.

I have an LED voltmeter at the bow batteries, at this exact moment they are showing 12.25 the engine has been off for 90minutes, they were 10.6 this morning at 5.00 am, engine on for about seven hours. I will move the boat again on to some cat friendly moorings tomorrow, that should be another four hours, hopefully some sunshine. 

The LED seens to be the most precise gauge, the voltmeter at the back, is showing somewhere between 14.2 and 14.4 I think.

 

 

 

half an hour to get at your batteries?  where do you keep them?   Land's End?   ...................    well, that is quite ridiculous - as is your alleged inabilty to use a multimeter.

 

clearly those 43 years on the briny didn't teach you much about critical boat systems that may save your life one day  .....................   yes, you are not alone as a salty sailor, but most of us don't feel the need to brag about it.

 

Dear Honourable Ladyship - I know you have me on ignore but perhaps if you lifted some of those blocks you would realise what a pratt you appear to be.

[LadyG]

53 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

 

half an hour to get at your batteries?  where do you keep them?   Land's End?   ...................    well, that is quite ridiculous - as is your alleged inabilty to use a multimeter.

 

clearly those 43 years on the briny didn't teach you much about critical boat systems that may save your life one day  .....................   yes, you are not alone as a salty sailor, but most of us don't feel the need to brag about it.

 

Dear Honourable Ladyship - I know you have me on ignore but perhaps if you lifted some of those blocks you would realise what a pratt you appear to be.

See your above abusive post to se why you are on ignore, not constructive. 

Do you suppose I have just posted so eedjits like you can hurl abuse at me,  in fact Chagall pointed me in the right direction, ie the immersion water heater has been on for some indeterminate time, it is now off, and two of the three labels will  be will be changed from heater to immersion, though I won't forget it now. 

Electrician had his head in the wiring box for a couple of hours, worked out what was happening, he's an electrician, if it took him two hours, do you wonder it has taken me two years? 

I managed on my proper boat by using a good electrician to sort the electrics, a good mechanic to service the engine and so on, a good boatyard to lay a mooring, I did not sew my own sails either, I employed a sail maker.

The bow batteries are behind a large cupboard which first has to be emptied, then they are under the well deck, I can't actually reach them easily, just about reach the first one, the second one, I can just about see the wiring. 

The starter battery is on a shelf under the stern deck, I might just be able to reach it, but there is no point it fires up the engine no bother.

The other domestic bank has a cover which is screwed down, covering two batteries with another at arm's length. I don't think you need to know these things, best not to respond to my posts. 

Edited May 14, 2021 by LadyG

[Chagall]

10 minutes ago, LadyG said:

See your above abusive post to se why you are on ignore, not constructive. 

Do you suppose I have just posted so eedjits like you can hurl abuse at me,  in fact Chagall pointed me in the right direction, ie the immersion water heater has been on for some indeterminate time, it is now off, and two of the three labels will  be will be changed from heater to immersion, though I won't forget it now. 

Electrician had his head in the wiring box for a couple of hours, worked out what was happening, he's an electrician, if it took him two hours, do you wonder it has taken me two years? 

I managed on my proper boat by using a good electrician to sort the electrics, a good mechanic to service the engine and so on, a good boatyard to lay a mooring, I did not sew my own sails either, I employed a sail maker. 

I think you will find it was Naughty Cal, but if we are both "dreaded" then Im in with the best! 

[LadyG]

12 minutes ago, Chagall said:

I think you will find it was Naughty Cal, but if we are both "dreaded" then Im in with the best! 

Sorry, it's been a long day

[Chagall]

1 minute ago, LadyG said:

Sorry, it's been a long day

Get some sleep. 

[Tony Brooks]

1 hour ago, LadyG said:

It's the difficulty of testing the batteries with a multimeter

I cant access all the batteries, it takes half an hour even to get at them, I never use a multimeter, I don't know if it still works, I can't be sure how it works.

I have an LED voltmeter at the bow batteries, at this exact moment they are showing 12.25 the engine has been off for 90minutes, they were 10.6 this morning at 5.00 am, engine on for about seven hours. I will move the boat again on to some cat friendly moorings tomorrow, that should be another four hours, hopefully some sunshine. 

The LED seens to be the most precise gauge, the voltmeter at the back, is showing somewhere between 14.2 and 14.4 I think.

 

 

 

It is not difficult getting the charging voltage for the charging source and the bow batteries. On a 12V boat is simply setting the meter to 20V DC, putting the leads into the meter and then touching the probes to any positive and negative in the bank and then on the charge source. Assuming a digital meter.

 

It may well be difficult to get access but that does not make the actual testing difficult.

 

I suspect Alan may well be correct in his post above about volt drop down the cable as I have been suggesting all along but it can not be proven without confirmatory voltage readings I asked for because none of us really knows much about the wiring.

Edited May 14, 2021 by Tony Brooks

[PD1964]

56 minutes ago, LadyG said:

See your above abusive post to se why you are on ignore, not constructive. 

Do you suppose I have just posted so eedjits like you can hurl abuse at me,  in fact Chagall pointed me in the right direction, ie the immersion water heater has been on for some indeterminate time, it is now off, and two of the three labels will  be will be changed from heater to immersion, though I won't forget it now. 

Electrician had his head in the wiring box for a couple of hours, worked out what was happening, he's an electrician, if it took him two hours, do you wonder it has taken me two years? 

I managed on my proper boat by using a good electrician to sort the electrics, a good mechanic to service the engine and so on, a good boatyard to lay a mooring, I did not sew my own sails either, I employed a sail maker.

The bow batteries are behind a large cupboard which first has to be emptied, then they are under the well deck, I can't actually reach them easily, just about reach the first one, the second one, I can just about see the wiring. 

The starter battery is on a shelf under the stern deck, I might just be able to reach it, but there is no point it fires up the engine no bother.

The other domestic bank has a cover which is screwed down, covering two batteries with another at arm's length. I don't think you need to know these things, best not to respond to my posts. 

  There you go again calling people “eefjits” who do you think you are? 

Edited May 14, 2021 by PD1964

[Chagall]

That detail wasn't really necessary. 

[LadyG]

3 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

It is not difficult getting the charging voltage for the charging source and the bow batteries. On a 12V boat is simply setting the meter to 20V DC, putting the leads into the meter and then touching the probes to any positive and negative in the bank and then on the charge source. Assuming a digital meter.

 

It may well be difficult to get access but that does not make the actual testing difficult.

 

I suspect Alan may well be correct in his post above about volt drop down the cable as I have been suggesting all along but it can not be proven without confirmatory voltage readings I asked for because none of us really knows much about the wiring.

I don't read Alan's posts, and I wish he would not comment on mine. I am prepared to have a big battery bank and keep the figures up to the best they have been in the past, I know the voltage will drop over 35ft direct, I have no reason to think the cable size is an issue, its been there for twenty years. I don't think there is any reason to replace it, or an electrician would have suggested it. That is their job, they know the batteries should be at the stern, I know it, everyone knows it by now. Let's hope no one goes down this route when fitting out their boat.

[PD1964]

19 minutes ago, Chagall said:

That detail wasn't really necessary. 

I have amended it.

[Slim]

If I were writing a Monty Python sketch I couldn't better this topic !

[MrsM]

1 hour ago, LadyG said:

I managed on my proper boat by using a good electrician to sort the electrics, a good mechanic to service the engine and so on, a good boatyard to lay a mooring, I did not sew my own sails either, I employed a sail maker.

If you were similarly prepared to pay for/engage appropriate "good" professionals to help you with your narrowboat, life would be very much easier and I expect you would feel much happier. You either need to master the skills/knowledge to manage on your own or you need to engage suitable professionals. I am usually very sympathetic but it has been quite frustrating following your threads and seeing how Tony and many others have tried to help you; they have repeatedly asked for simple and basic information, which you say you are not able to provide. You currently have access to a seemingly willing and able electrician. I really hope you take this opportunity to get on top of your systems. 

 

[blackrose]

Sorry but this electrial debacle is so convoluted and has been going on for so long I'm afraid I can't help thinking that it's at least partly self-inflicted. And in all this time she hasn't even bothered to learn how to use a multimeter to measure DC voltages? Why not just google some instructions or watch a YouTube video? Im afraid these sorts of attention-seeking threads are the rantings of someone who wants drama in their life.

[PD1964]

2 minutes ago, blackrose said:

Sorry but this electrial debacle is so convoluted and has been going on for so long I'm afraid I can't help thinking that it's at least partly self-inflicted. And in all this time she hasn't even bothered to learn how to use a multimeter to measure DC voltages? Why not just google some instructions or watch a YouTube video? Im afraid these sorts of attention-seeking threads are the rantings of someone who wants drama in their life.

You may be right. Go and have a look at her new one she’s just started.