"Domestic cooker not suitable for use on a boat"

[nicknorman]

3 minutes ago, StephenA said:

 

Or we're going to go up on Saturday, pay for what they've done and get the work done by someone else who isn't going to be a Prima Donna who makes up his own regulations because he doesn't actually want to do the work.

 

Then we'll get it re-tested, and if they tell us its a full rest charge we'll go to someone else.  We were going to buy some new batteries, but I think Norbury will have lost that business, and other future business.

We use a chap called Chris Williams for BSS. Our first BSS - whilst we agreed the price, he didn’t want money up front. He was entirely sensible, but adequately thorough - pointed out a few things I could improve but nevertheless it was a pass first time. He is also gas safe registered. What’s not to like?

 

My suggestion is to find a sensible BSS examiner and stick with him!

[frangar]

5 minutes ago, nicknorman said:

We use a chap called Chris Williams for BSS. Our first BSS - whilst we agreed the price, he didn’t want money up front. He was entirely sensible, but adequately thorough - pointed out a few things I could improve but nevertheless it was a pass first time. He is also gas safe registered. What’s not to like?

 

My suggestion is to find a sensible BSS examiner and stick with him!

Amazingly I agree with the above. 

[StephenA]

3 minutes ago, nicknorman said:

We use a chap called Chris Williams for BSS. Our first BSS - whilst we agreed the price, he didn’t want money up front. He was entirely sensible, but adequately thorough - pointed out a few things I could improve but nevertheless it was a pass first time. He is also gas safe registered. What’s not to like?

 

My suggestion is to find a sensible BSS examiner and stick with him!

 

The idea of leaving the boat at Norbury and getting the cert done was that if anything needed to be done then we'd pay for it and make the whole thing simple given that we both live over 100 miles from the boat and can only do things round some weekends.

[Mad Harold]

Trouble is,standards between BSS examiners vary,sometimes quite considerably.

I have had two BSS examinations on two boats by the same examiner,and was quite happy with him.

However,when I was looking for another boat,I viewed four all with a long BSC and three of them I would have failed had I been an examiner.

One had the (petrol ) tank sitting on a rear locker top with no outside vent,or spillage drain.

Another you could hardly get in the toilet compartment for the rat's nest of wires hanging down joined with insulating tape.

The other had a camping gas portable hob.

I was assured by all the vendors that they had passed with no advisories!

So,the vendors were either lying through their teeth,or there are some blind BSS examiners around.

[StephenA]

2 minutes ago, Mad Harold said:

Trouble is,standards between BSS examiners vary,sometimes quite considerably.

I have had two BSS examinations on two boats by the same examiner,and was quite happy with him.

However,when I was looking for another boat,I viewed four all with a long BSC and three of them I would have failed had I been an examiner.

One had the (petrol ) tank sitting on a rear locker top with no outside vent,or spillage drain.

Another you could hardly get in the toilet compartment for the rat's nest of wires hanging down joined with insulating tape.

The other had a camping gas portable hob.

I was assured by all the vendors that they had passed with no advisories!

So,the vendors were either lying through their teeth,or there are some blind BSS examiners around.

 

This isn't the BSS examiner - its the damned engineer Norbury employ to do their gas work for them. BSS examiner fails are perfectly reasonable, its the engineer who is supposed to be fixing them who is being the idiot.

[Momac]

5 hours ago, StephenA said:

....the main regulator  ( which needs replacing as its over 10 years old ) 

Its probably not an expensive item  but why replace the regulator if it is not faulty?

Edited April 29, 2021 by MartynG

[frangar]

6 minutes ago, MartynG said:

Its probably not an expensive item  but why replace the regulator if it is not faulty?

They have a suggested lifespan of around 10 years at most if memory serves. It’s better to replace before failure. 

[StephenA]

8 minutes ago, MartynG said:

Its probably not an expensive item  but why replace the regulator if it is not faulty?

 

Because its more than 10 years old.... as is the hose connecting it to the fixed pipework. If its more than 10 years old then its a warning but given their price it's not exactly a big deal.

 

Edited April 29, 2021 by StephenA

[Momac]

Just now, StephenA said:

 

Because its more than 10 years old.... as is the hose connecting it to the fixed pipework.

Age alone does  not necessarily require replacement under BSS requirements. 

[Momac]

31 minutes ago, Mad Harold said:

 

...............,or there are some blind BSS examiners around.

Probably  the offending items were not present at the time of the BSS examination. I have known people prepare a boat for the BSS and revert to non compliance after the exam

[Mad Harold]

Just now, MartynG said:

Probably  the offending items were not present at the time of the BSS examination. I have known people prepare a boat for the BSS and revert to non compliance after the exam

Yes,I think that is quite likely!

[Momac]

1 minute ago, Mad Harold said:

Yes,I think that is quite likely!

On the other had I have heard of BSS certs being issued without an inspection.... but  not recently.

[Alan de Enfield]

19 minutes ago, MartynG said:

Age alone does  not necessarily require replacement under BSS requirements. 

 

But it does go against the manufacturers recommendations, of which failure to follow could seriously damge your wallet in the event of an insurance claim.

 

From Calor :

 

How long do gas regulators last? When should I replace it?

Most gas regulators are guaranteed for 5 years and should be changed after 10 years at the most. However gas regulators should be regularly inspected for signs of damage or wear. 

 

4. The Regulator

A regulator must be included in the connection between the cylinder and the appliance, except for appliances designed to be supplied at cylinder pressure. The regulator is precisely set by the manufacturer to control the pressure of the supply and Must Not Be Adjusted. Select a regulator with a means of protecting the downstream pipework or appliance from overpressure in the event of regulator malfunction. If a Regulator shows signs of wear, it should be replaced. Regulators must be marked BS:3016 or BS:EN:12864 or BS:EN:16129. Any regulator marked BS:3016 will be over 10 years old and should be replaced.

 

5. Flexible Hoses

Use only certified hoses to BS:3212 or BS:EN:1763-1 or BS:EN:16436-1 which bear the year and name of manufacturer or stainless steel convoluted hoses marked EN:10380 as LPG attacks and erodes natural rubber. Keep hose lengths as short as possible. All hoses must be secured with proper hose clips. Make sure that the hoses are kept clear of ‘hot spots’ and inspect them from time to time. Replace any hose that shows signs of stiffness, wear, cracking, soft spots or other damage. It is recommended that rubber hoses should be replaced after 5 years service life

 

 

6 minutes ago, MartynG said:

On the other had I have heard of BSS certs being issued without an inspection.... but  not recently.

 

I personally experienced that in 2019 - is that recently ?

Edited April 29, 2021 by Alan de Enfield

[nicknorman]

1 hour ago, StephenA said:

The idea of leaving the boat at Norbury and getting the cert done was that if anything needed to be done then we'd pay for it and make the whole thing simple given that we both live over 100 miles from the boat and can only do things round some weekends.

Having a reasonable amount of money to award, and expecting a reasonable job done in return, only exists in a world that I have yet to discover! Well, with very few exceptions anyway.

 

eg I virtually never take my cars into a garage and if I ever do, every time they do something stupid. Like one time I took it in for a new rear copper brake pipe - difficult access as it routed over the fuel tank and it was 4x4 so fuel tank couldn’t be dropped easily. Brake pipe work was fine but they decided the engine oil level was low (it was) and without asking, topped it up. Well when I say “topped it up”, they added 7 litres of oil. Which was odd because it only held 5 litres from empty. Unfortunately I didn’t notice this on the invoice until I got home - checked the dipstick and it was nearly at the top, way, way above the full mark by several inches. Luckily the engine didn’t lock but I was not impressed at having to drain out about 5 litres of oil! Morons!

[StephenA]

9 minutes ago, nicknorman said:

Having a reasonable amount of money to award, and expecting a reasonable job done in return, only exists in a world that I have yet to discover! Well, with very few exceptions anyway.

 

eg I virtually never take my cars into a garage and if I ever do, every time they do something stupid. Like one time I took it in for a new rear copper brake pipe - difficult access as it routed over the fuel tank and it was 4x4 so fuel tank couldn’t be dropped easily. Brake pipe work was fine but they decided the engine oil level was low (it was) and without asking, topped it up. Well when I say “topped it up”, they added 7 litres of oil. Which was odd because it only held 5 litres from empty. Unfortunately I didn’t notice this on the invoice until I got home - checked the dipstick and it was nearly at the top, way, way above the full mark by several inches. Luckily the engine didn’t lock but I was not impressed at having to drain out about 5 litres of oil! Morons!

 

Whereas my local garage will do things like spot weld holes in exhaust pipes, drain and reuse coolant when changing the water pumps, extract and then re-use refrigerant when working on the A/C and will spend 30 on a bearing and do a bearing pull on an A/C pump rather than making me spend over 360 on a replacement unit, and weld up our broken fuel filter unit off our BMC for no cost at all

Edited April 29, 2021 by StephenA

[Momac]

34 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

 

I personally experienced that in 2019 - is that recently ?

Yes .

[Alan de Enfield]

Just now, MartynG said:

Yes .

 

Never left the saloon, just said 'it passed last time, I can see your Co alarms, thats the only change in the requirements, its a pass'.

Filled out the pass details on his laptop and off he went, under 30 minutes from me going and unlocking the marina gate, letting him in, to me closing it behind him as he left.

 

He had not seen the boat before, he was simply quoting the fact that it had passed last time because I had the previous documents out for him.

[Momac]

1 minute ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Never left the saloon, just said 'it passed last time, I can see your Co alarms, thats the only change in the requirements, its a pass'.

Filled out the pass details on his laptop and off he went, under 30 minutes from me going and unlocking the marina gate, letting him in, to me closing it behind him as he left.

 

He had not seen the boat before, he was simply quoting the fact that it had passed last time because I had the previous documents out for him.

Now you write that I think you may have mentioned it before . At least he did visit the boat.

[StephenA]

People keep going back to the BSS examiner - I'd like to make it clear that I have absolutely no problems with the BSS examiner, he did his job and flagged up some issues which needed to be resolved. We had taken the boat to Norbury as both my brother and I live over 100 miles away from the boat and have jobs that are not regular 9-5 jobs so getting a BSS arranged, then getting up to the boat to fix anything that we could fix, and arranging to get problems that we could not fix ourselves fixed by those who could, and getting people access to the boat (we are not in a marina) is just too much to do. So that is why we chose Norbury as we could drop the boat off there after the Easter break and collect it when it was ready.

 

The issue is with the gas engineer.  As they are a commercial boat yard running a hire fleet I can understand that they need to employ a fully qualified gas engineer who can carry out work to satisfy not only the BSS conditions that apply to hire boats, but also their business requirements and insurance. However he seems to have come up with something that does not make sense to myself, my brother and everyone on here, and David at Norbury also seems to be at a loss when it comes to explaining the situation and is trying to resolve it.

 

Norbury have done major  work on our boat in the past and we've always been happy with their service, and they have done some other work this time which we've no problem with, and I will admit that I might have laid the blame more at their door than I should have done.

 

Moderators - if you can please lock this thread I'd appreciate it.

Edited April 29, 2021 by StephenA

[David Mack]

So why can't you/Norbury get another Gas Safe bod to come and do what is required to get your existing cooker passed?