Price of Vetus Spares

[MarkH2159]

This topic may have been highlighted before but I thought I would add my 2p worth on the subject of the price of Vetus spares.

My Bowthruster packed up last week and I nailed the fault down to the relay. Inspection showed that it had worn and the Positive in Pin was moving when the solenoids activated. A light tap to push the pin downwards made the thruster work but only until the opposite solenoid was used then the contacts moved back up out of place.

 

With the solenoid pack listed by Vetus at £241.74 I thought it was worth an attempt at a repair.

If not then I was considering  replacing it with an Off Road Winch 12v Switching Relay unit rated at 500 Amps which would do exactly the same job and cost me nearer to £35

 

Anyway I successfully diagnosed the reason for the existing relay failure and repaired it. A basic design fault causes the central input pin to wear in its bakelite case mounting which eventally allows the positive contacts to float about a bit too much and it fails. A little bit of work cleaning contacts and resetting the pin in its casing with some Gorilla Epoxy and it was as good as new.

 

Whilst I had the access open I thought it would be a good idea to check the motor brushes and found them to be about 40% worn, good for a few years maybe but it could be worth getting a spare set just in case.

This is when I realised that the Vetus price of £291.61 for a set of 4 carbon brushes was just ridiculous.

 

A quick search of the brush specifications and sizes revealed an almost exact match available on Amazon at a more realistic £12.22 for 4. - Ordered immediately.

I have read elswhere that the cheaper brushes fit and work just as well, so how are Vetus able to justify a price that is 24x higher ????

Even if they do not last as long, I can change them 20x and still work out as a saving.

 

[Mad Harold]

Like many suppliers of stuff for minority interests,they trade on lack of knowledge on the part of the customer,and jack up the prices.

Anything specified for marine use is an excuse to make more profit.

It is worse with aircraft stuff,it is frequently cheaper to buy aviation bits from the USA.

[Tony Brooks]

I am sure Vetus work on the old razor blade maker's pricing strategy (and printer manufacturers). Give the equipment away, sell the equipment cheaper or give a huge discount to the boat builder and make up for it with overpriced spares.

 

It does not help if a brand has  a large presence in the lumpy water leisure market that seem to me to be far less price conscious than the inland/canal market.

[cuthound]

Last year I finally got round to seeing why my Vetus Bowthruster was no longer working.

 

The armature had rusted solid, due to excessive condensation in the bowthruster compartment.

 

I couldn't free it off so took it to Cox Auto Electrics in Atherstone. They charged £10  for inspection and quote, refundable if the work went ahead.

 

They quoted me £380 to refurbish the motor, including new solenoid,  contactors and brushes and did an excellent job. The only penny pinching I could see, was that the motor was resprayed in battleship grey rather than the eyewateringly expensive yellow paint originally used by Vetus.

 

They also refurbish alternator and starter motors.

[Bee]

Vetus are known for their hefty price markups. Same goes for many car makers and in fact any original equipment suppliers.  Thing is that Vetus and many others are really just assemblers, there is almost certainly not a Vetus relay factory or, an Aquadrive CV joint factory, usually these things are off the shelf parts from somewhere else and if you can find something that fits it will be just as good. sometimes the tiny numbers marked on the parts are the clue. Sometimes though the parts really are made to fit, then you are stuffed.

[BrumBargee]

I've never owned any significant pieces of Vetus kit (mainly just small items like strainers etc.) but the running joke is that their business model is to paint existing kit yellow, slap on some Vetus stickers and quadruple the price.

 

I think it gives the end user the illusion of using OEM parts because they're all branded the same, even though it's often not the case.

[Machpoint005]

Isn't that similar to the Audi branding, which uses exactly the same components as Skoda but charges much more for them?

 

[BrumBargee]

I'd imagine so. I remember owning a Jag X-Type estate. Fantastic car but mostly made of Ford Mondeo parts, in fact most of the parts had the Ford logo stamped into them. I'm sure a Jag dealer would happily have charged more than a Ford dealer for them.

[MarkH2159]

6 hours ago, Machpoint005 said:

Isn't that similar to the Audi branding, which uses exactly the same components as Skoda but charges much more for them?

 

Not quite...

Although Audi and Skoda share similar base equipment, the levels of trim and equipment found in Audis is much higher than that of Skoda.

Resale values of Audi are also much better.

For example Skoda have nothing to compare with the Audi Quattro system, the Yeti is 4WD but not on the same level.

 

With Vetus we are talking 'off the shelf' regular components, albeit of good quality, that appear to be generally painted yellow and badged for pricing.

My experience of the Vetus Carbon Brushes costing 24x more than an off the shelf set which will do exactly the same job is a prime example - No way are 4 brushes worth £290+ no matter how well they are made.

[Murflynn]

16 hours ago, MarkH2159 said:

This topic may have been highlighted before but I thought I would add my 2p worth on the subject of the price of Vetus spares.

My Bowthruster packed up last week and I nailed the fault down to the relay. Inspection showed that it had worn and the Positive in Pin was moving when the solenoids activated. A light tap to push the pin downwards made the thruster work but only until the opposite solenoid was used then the contacts moved back up out of place.

 

With the solenoid pack listed by Vetus at £241.74 I thought it was worth an attempt at a repair.

If not then I was considering  replacing it with an Off Road Winch 12v Switching Relay unit rated at 500 Amps which would do exactly the same job and cost me nearer to £35

 

Anyway I successfully diagnosed the reason for the existing relay failure and repaired it. A basic design fault causes the central input pin to wear in its bakelite case mounting which eventally allows the positive contacts to float about a bit too much and it fails. A little bit of work cleaning contacts and resetting the pin in its casing with some Gorilla Epoxy and it was as good as new.

 

Whilst I had the access open I thought it would be a good idea to check the motor brushes and found them to be about 40% worn, good for a few years maybe but it could be worth getting a spare set just in case.

This is when I realised that the Vetus price of £291.61 for a set of 4 carbon brushes was just ridiculous.

 

A quick search of the brush specifications and sizes revealed an almost exact match available on Amazon at a more realistic £12.22 for 4. - Ordered immediately.

I have read elswhere that the cheaper brushes fit and work just as well, so how are Vetus able to justify a price that is 24x higher ????

Even if they do not last as long, I can change them 20x and still work out as a saving.

 

 

I have been there.   The relay ("contactor") is manufactured by Allbright International.  In my case the components that failed were the silvered contact strips that chattered because of voltage drawdown when the button was pressed; replacements cost just a few quid.  When I needed help Allbright were brilliant - discussed on the phone, bought the recommended parts and never looked back.

[Phoenix_V]

17 hours ago, MarkH2159 said:

.

 

Whilst I had the access open I thought it would be a good idea to check the motor brushes and found them to be about 40% worn, good for a few years maybe but it could be worth getting a spare set just in case.

This is when I realised that the Vetus price of £291.61 for a set of 4 carbon brushes was just ridiculous.

 

A quick search of the brush specifications and sizes revealed an almost exact match available on Amazon at a more realistic £12.22 for 4. - Ordered immediately.

I have read elswhere that the cheaper brushes fit and work just as well, so how are Vetus able to justify a price that is 24x higher ????

Even if they do not last as long, I can change them 20x and still work out as a saving.

 

Not being as technical as you could you tell me the model of your bowthruster in case it is the same as mine and post a link to the amazon seller, thank you so much

[MarkH2159]

55 minutes ago, Phoenix_V said:

Not being as technical as you could you tell me the model of your bowthruster in case it is the same as mine and post a link to the amazon seller, thank you so much

Certainly, it is a standard Vetus 50 KGF unit, with the motor type being listed as SP50125 or something like that, sorry I am not sure. It is a 12v 3 KW unit.

 

The brushes are Bosch BX33 type and size is 9 x 20 x 27.5 mm (according to Vetus) there are 4 of them.

 

There was another post years ago in this forum where someone found replacement brushes of a slightly different size 9 x 20 x 28.5 mm but they fitted perfectly and being 1 mm longer made no difference.

 

I bought exactly the same set of 4 brushes here...

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Carbon-brushes-Starter-Bosch-9x20x28/dp/B00Y0QI9NA

[Machpoint005]

4 hours ago, MarkH2159 said:

Not quite...

Although Audi and Skoda share similar base equipment, the levels of trim and equipment found in Audis is much higher than that of Skoda.

Resale values of Audi are also much better.

For example Skoda have nothing to compare with the Audi Quattro system ....

 

Resale values have nothing to do with engineering and everything to do with fashion victimhood. 

 

Well-equipped Skodas have exactly the same equipment levels. For example, the infotainment system on a 2012 Octavia is identical to the one on a 2009 A8. 

[MarkH2159]

21 minutes ago, Machpoint005 said:

 

Resale values have nothing to do with engineering and everything to do with fashion victimhood. 

 

Well-equipped Skodas have exactly the same equipment levels. For example, the infotainment system on a 2012 Octavia is identical to the one on a 2009 A8. 

Regardless of 2012 Octavias being compared to a 2009 A8, the comparison between Vetus pricing and other parts is very different.

Audi do not take off the shelf parts from other manufacturers, paint and sell them at highly inflated prices, whereas it appears that Vetus do.

The carbon brushes in my experience is just one example, the Albright relay unit is another.

 

As previously stated Vetus are only assemblers, using other manufacturers parts.

Audi are manufacturers.

[Phoenix_V]

On 16/04/2021 at 19:03, MarkH2159 said:

Certainly, it is a standard Vetus 50 KGF unit, with the motor type being listed as SP50125 or something like that, sorry I am not sure. It is a 12v 3 KW unit.

 

The brushes are Bosch BX33 type and size is 9 x 20 x 27.5 mm (according to Vetus) there are 4 of them.

 

There was another post years ago in this forum where someone found replacement brushes of a slightly different size 9 x 20 x 28.5 mm but they fitted perfectly and being 1 mm longer made no difference.

 

I bought exactly the same set of 4 brushes here...

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Carbon-brushes-Starter-Bosch-9x20x28/dp/B00Y0QI9NA

Thanks for that not quite the same numbers  (mine is a BOW5512A) but looking at the manual the physical size seems right I will order a set

[jonesthenuke]

I bought some of the replacement brushes as spares for our boat and used them this year to repair the thruster on a friend's boat. The amazon supplier no longer stocks them. but have found this supplier. https://www.carbon-brushes-gomes.com/carbon-brushes-9x20x28-5-compatible-starter-bosch-bsx33.html  

[Ronaldo47]

When I needed a set of brushes for our elderly electric lawnmower, spares were unavailable. As we are fortunate in still having a local electrical white goods repair shop that sells spares, I took the remains of the old brushes in on the offchance. They didn't have an exact match, but I was able to buy a set that was slightly bigger in all dimensions to cut down to size. Carbon brushes are quite soft and can be readily rough-cut using a junior hacksaw and then finished to size by rubbing on a piece of abrasive paper.

Edited May 18, 2022 by Ronaldo47
typos

[blackrose]

6 hours ago, jonesthenuke said:

I bought some of the replacement brushes as spares for our boat and used them this year to repair the thruster on a friend's boat. The amazon supplier no longer stocks them. but have found this supplier. https://www.carbon-brushes-gomes.com/carbon-brushes-9x20x28-5-compatible-starter-bosch-bsx33.html  

 

Which model of thruster are they for?

[jonesthenuke]

28 minutes ago, blackrose said:

 

Which model of thruster are they for?

They fit the 50kgf model (though ours is from circa 2006). I suggest you could check the dimensions of yours, they are not difficult to dismantle.

[blackrose]

Mine are a 3 wire version. I got some cheaper equivalent 3 wire spares for about 45 quid some time ago but wondered what the difference was between the 3 wire and 2 wire brushes and if they could be used interchangeably?

[jonesthenuke]

On 19/05/2022 at 10:19, blackrose said:

Mine are a 3 wire version. I got some cheaper equivalent 3 wire spares for about 45 quid some time ago but wondered what the difference was between the 3 wire and 2 wire brushes and if they could be used interchangeably?

I believe the number of wires relates to current carrying capacity. I have seen somewhere that the 12V Vetus bowthusters have brushes with two wires whilst the 24V version has brushes with one wire.

 

[jonesthenuke]

After a little research I have discovered that Vetus have been a little sneaky with the bowthruster contactor. It is an Allbright Ltd unit with part number  (Vetus rather than Allbright) DC182-116. This is a specific part number unique to Vetus. The original Allbright number for the same part is DC182-656 and these are available from Traction Power Ltd on 01618651319. Traction Power will supply a spares kit or a whole contactor, however note that the spares kit costs approx 75% of the whole unit so you may not consider this worthwhile.

 

Edited May 25, 2023 by jonesthenuke
Typos