Guidance for visitors to the Fenland Waterways

[doratheexplorer]

 

 

To add:

 

This:

https://goba.org.uk/a-guide-for-visitors-to-the-east/

Implies you need a short term EA licence AND an Anglian Pass.

 

This:

https://3rwzrk3imltm11ru71g1sxd1-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/210128_Information-for-web-sites.pdf

Implies that if you have an annual CRT licence (or any other statutory navigation authority licence), you don't need both, it's an either/or.

 

[Scholar Gypsy]

6 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

 

 

To add:

 

This:

https://goba.org.uk/a-guide-for-visitors-to-the-east/

Implies you need a short term EA licence AND an Anglian Pass.

 

This:

https://3rwzrk3imltm11ru71g1sxd1-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/210128_Information-for-web-sites.pdf

Implies that if you have an annual CRT licence (or any other statutory navigation authority licence), you don't need both, it's an either/or.

 

The pass works like this. If you have a licence for one of the three waterways (Anglian Environment Agency, Middle Level, Cam conservators) then the Anglian Pass will give you access to the other two.  A CRT licence (or a National trust licence for the Wey, etc etc) is not sufficient. A gold licence is, as that gives you access to the Nene and Ouse. 

I'm pretty sure I don't have the power to simplify the underlying situation here. I have tried to make the website as clear and simple as I can, and consulted the right people in writing it, but happy to take further comments of course! 

Edited February 23, 2021 by Scholar Gypsy

[doratheexplorer]

3 minutes ago, Scholar Gypsy said:

The pass works like this. If you have a licence for one of the three waterways (Anglian Environment Agency, Middle Level, Cam conservators) then the Anglian Pass will give you access to the other two.  A CRT licence (or a National trust licence for the Wey, etc etc) is not sufficient. A gold licence is, as that gives you access to the Nene and Ouse. 

I'm pretty sure I don't have the power to simplify the underlying situation here. I have tried to make the website as clear and simple as I can, and consulted the right people in writing it, but happy to take further comments of course! 

This implies that a CRT licence is an acceptable alternative.

 

But since I'm wrong about that, which of the three relevant waterways has the cheapest 1 or 2 month visitor licence?

[Scholar Gypsy]

56 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Hi Guys, I'm sort of keen to explore these very quiet waterways, when the pubs open.

Can anyone give me a Boat Map, I think I'll be starting on the Witham, is it critical when my CRT licence runs out, as obviously I'm not made of money,

Tx

Jo

There's a link on that website to my pages about crossing the Wash, which is quite an adventure...  https://scholargypsy.org.uk/washing/

[Alan de Enfield]

8 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

This implies that a CRT licence is an acceptable alternative.

 

No dog in the fight, but I read (3rd para from the bottom) exactly as you do.

 

If you have a C&RT licence than you only need the £100 'pass'

 

2nd para from the bottom appears to be an alternative for boats already on either the EA, MLC or CC and want to go on another waterway.

[doratheexplorer]

5 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

No dog in the fight, but I read (3rd para from the bottom) exactly as you do.

 

If you have a C&RT licence than you only need the £100 'pass'

 

2nd para from the bottom appears to be an alternative for boats already on either the EA, MLC or CC and want to go on another waterway.

Well there's the following possibilities:

 

1.  Scholar Gypsy is wrong (no offence!).

2. 2 months on the Fens would cost me £650 which is utterly extortionate.

 

Either way, the current info is highly confusing.

 

I had a look for Middle Level and Cam licencing costs.  Middle Level set their price to match the obscenely high EA price.  Which looks an awful lot like price fixing to me. 

 

I utterly failed to find out how much a short term Cam licence costs.  I found some evidence that it's about £50, but no detail on whether that's 1 day or 3 months.

 

Could it all be any more confusing?

Edited February 23, 2021 by doratheexplorer

[Scholar Gypsy]

I'm getting a definitive ruling, and will post again in due course.

[Chris Lowe]

1 hour ago, LadyG said:

Hi Guys, I'm sort of keen to explore these very quiet waterways, when the pubs open.

Can anyone give me a Boat Map, I think I'll be starting on the Witham, is it critical when my CRT licence runs out, as obviously I'm not made of money,

Tx

Jo

Jones Boatyard map is still online.

http://www.jonesboatyard.co.uk/river-great-ouse-map/

 

[PaulJ]

54 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

 

Oh and then I can pay an annual membership of Friends of the Nene but it's not clear what happens if I don't.  Am I excluded from water points, visitor moorings etc?

Nothing will happen -you can still get water and use the EA visitor moorings.

There are very few moorings  -joining both FOTRN or GOBA gives you more choices and in some lovely spots where you wouldnt otherwise be able to moor.

All ran by volunteers so your yearly (very cheap) sub helps keep them going ?

[Scholar Gypsy]

11 minutes ago, PaulJ said:

Nothing will happen -you can still get water and use the EA visitor moorings.

There are very few moorings  -joining both FOTRN or GOBA gives you more choices and in some lovely spots where you wouldnt otherwise be able to moor.

All ran by volunteers so your yearly (very cheap) sub helps keep them going ?

Time for some photos.  FOTRN mooring at Woodford

 

and GOBA at Bedford.

[Mike Todd]

2 hours ago, doratheexplorer said:

I found the whole thing utterly baffling.

 

What's the difference between an EA licence and an Anglian Pass?  If I have a licence, then what's the pass supposed to be for?

 

I have a CRT licence.  If I wanted to spend a couple of months exploring the fens on a 16m boat, would I really have to pay 2 x £272.90 plus £100 - total £645.80?

 

Or would it just be £100?

 

Or something else?

 

If it's £645.80 there's zero chance of me bothering.

 

Oh and then I can pay an annual membership of Friends of the Nene but it's not clear what happens if I don't.  Am I excluded from water points, visitor moorings etc?

 

Why not try and simplify it all a bit?

 

By comparison, a month on the Warwickshire Avon is a simple £70 for any powered boat.  Easy.

 

It used to be two licences for the Avon, separate for upper and lower until they merged. Now there is only the one in addition to the normal CaRT licence for adjacent waters.

 

In the case of the Nene - Great Ouse area there are four separate licences for contiguous waters, if you include the CaRT for the Northampton Arm. Should they at some stage merge then it will be simpler re licences even if there are bigger issues that might offset that.

 

The FORTN and GOBA moorings are independent trusts, doing the things that the EA do not consider their responsibility (they are primarily a water management operation with navigation as an add on) There are some public moorings but are precious few and sometimes well apart. You do not need either association membership to use them but, in my opinion, well worth having and surprisingly low priced. 

 

All are now available online - or at least all the ones we have used - and not really that difficult to manage, especially as it really does pay off to do quite a bit of planning overnight stops to ensure that you have at least Plan B if not C & D as well. The visitor moorings are mostly quite small.

[doratheexplorer]

12 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

It used to be two licences for the Avon, separate for upper and lower until they merged. Now there is only the one in addition to the normal CaRT licence for adjacent waters.

 

In the case of the Nene - Great Ouse area there are four separate licences for contiguous waters, if you include the CaRT for the Northampton Arm. Should they at some stage merge then it will be simpler re licences even if there are bigger issues that might offset that.

 

The FORTN and GOBA moorings are independent trusts, doing the things that the EA do not consider their responsibility (they are primarily a water management operation with navigation as an add on) There are some public moorings but are precious few and sometimes well apart. You do not need either association membership to use them but, in my opinion, well worth having and surprisingly low priced. 

 

All are now available online - or at least all the ones we have used - and not really that difficult to manage, especially as it really does pay off to do quite a bit of planning overnight stops to ensure that you have at least Plan B if not C & D as well. The visitor moorings are mostly quite small.

Thanks for the info.  Since it looks like a visit would be eye-wateringly expensive, it looks like I won't find out about those nice moorings.

[MIKE P]

I have a Cart license.   I would like to start at Gayton go to Ely, by boat. Stop over night and return to Cart waters at Gayton, What would be my cheapest licensing option?

 

[doratheexplorer]

3 minutes ago, MIKE P said:

I have a Cart license.   I would like to start at Gayton go to Ely, by boat. Stop over night and return to Cart waters at Gayton, What would be my cheapest licensing option?

 

Wouldn't it depend on how long you're off CRT waters?

[MIKE P]

Yes, but just as long as it takes there and back. 

[Rivelin]

It's a two-week trip (there and back).

[MIKE P]

33 minutes ago, nickhindle said:

It's a two-week trip (there and back).

Thanks for your reply, although my question was about cost of licensing. It was a bit confusing with the different bodies of water. 

[Scholar Gypsy]

Licencing: I have had some further clarification from the EA, which is now reflected on the website. You're not going to like it. The main change is that the Anglian pass is only available to those who hold one of the following four annual licences: EA Anglian, Middle Level, Cam Conservators, or EA/CRT Gold.  For others the only option is short term licences for the EA and MLC.  My revised text is below.

https://goba.org.uk/a-guide-for-visitors-to-the-east/
 

The licencing situation changed in 2021, following new legislation that requires a licence to use the Middle Level. For boats visiting from the CRT canal system, you have broadly two options. EITHER:

1. For holders of a CRT/EA gold licence, or an EA Anglian annual licence, you need to buy an Anglian Pass, which will then also allow you to use the Middle Level Navigations, and the Cam Conservators’ waters (above Bottisham lock).
   • The CRT/EA gold licence is available via the CRT licencing website, and will cover you for all EA and CRT waterways. A gold licence is only available from 1 January to 31 December (though you can upgrade from a normal CRT licence at any time during the year). Gold licences are not refundable.
   • Details of the annual EA Anglian Waterways licence (which runs from 1 April to 31 March) are at https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/anglian-waterways-registration-charges  
   • Details of the Anglian pass are here. The cost is £75 (for 12 months, from 1 April to 31 March) for boats between 10 and 15 metres, and £100 for boats over 15 metres.  This pass can be bought via the EA’s National Customer Call Centre.
     
     OR
2. You can buy short term licences from the EA, and from the MLC.
   • The easiest way to buy an EA visitor licence is from Northampton Marina. The maximum period is three months. Details at https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/anglian-waterways-registration-charges
   • Information on MLC licences is here https://middlelevel.gov.uk/navigation/ (I will add a clearer link to short term licences, when I can find one).

 

[David Mack]

6 hours ago, doratheexplorer said:

 

I have a CRT licence.  If I wanted to spend a couple of months exploring the fens on a 16m boat, would I really have to pay 2 x £272.90 plus £100 - total £645.80?

The way I read it is you could trade in your CRT licence (£990 for a 16m boat at 2021-2 prices) for a 2021 Gold licence (£1210), and that would enable you to boat CRT and EA waterways until the end of December. (You would get a pro rata refund on your existing CRT licence backdated to 1 January).  You could then buy an Anglian Pass at £100 for the year April 2021 to March 2022 (but in effect only valid until the end of December if you do not get a Gold or EA licence beyond then), to cover the Middle Level and Cam.

So the extra cost over your CRT licence would be £429, but would give you access to the Anglian waterways for 9 months.

If you only want a short visit it may be cheaper to pay EA, MLC and Cam visitor rates.

[Rivelin]

I'm currently moored on the Great Ouse network, so if I was to move over to the Nene in July 2021, does this mean I would need an Anglian Pass for the one-way trip across the middle levels?

(Sorry, I can't figure this out from the info above).

 

 

 

[GUMPY]

2 minutes ago, nickhindle said:

I'm currently moored on the Great Ouse network, so if I was to move over to the Nene in July 2021, does this mean I would need an Anglian Pass for the one-way trip across the middle levels?

(Sorry, I can't figure this out from the info above).

 

 

 

As I understand it yes, we are coming the opposite way but will be coming back so for us its only £50 each way

 

[nbfiresprite]

 

15 minutes ago, nickhindle said:

I'm currently moored on the Great Ouse network, so if I was to move over to the Nene in July 2021, does this mean I would need an Anglian Pass for the one-way trip across the middle levels?

(Sorry, I can't figure this out from the info above).

 

 

 

No you don't, you can buy either a couple of daily licences (You can travel from Salters Lode to Stanground in

two days with a night stop at March) or a weekly licence if you taking your time.

 

You don't need to buy an Anglian Pass if you aready have a Gold licence. The Middle Level offer a shorter term llicence between September and December last year for people intending to buy a Gold licance in the new year.

Edited February 23, 2021 by nbfiresprite

[Rivelin]

5 minutes ago, nbfiresprite said:

No you don't, you can buy either a couple of daily licences (You can travel from Staler Lode to Stanground in

two days with a night stop at March) or a weekly llicence if you taking your time.

Thanks - that sounds more like it ?

[Scholar Gypsy]

8 minutes ago, nbfiresprite said:

 

No you don't, you can buy either a couple of daily licences (You can travel from Salters Lode to Stanground in

two days with a night stop at March) or a weekly licence if you taking your time.

 

You don't need to buy an Anglian Pass if you aready have a Gold licence. The Middle Level offer a shorter term llicence between September and December last year for people intending to buy a Gold licance in the new year.

I can't find any information on the MLC website about short term licences in 2021. (the arrangements in 2020 were a bit ad hoc, I think).    

[Rivelin]

5 minutes ago, Scholar Gypsy said:

I can't find any information on the MLC website about short term licences in 2021. (the arrangements in 2020 were a bit ad hoc, I think).    

Probably just go for it then and see what happens...