New zero-emission fuel that can be used in post 2002 engines. Could it be the answer for boats ?

[Alan de Enfield]

 

Will blue gas kill Tesla? New emission-free liquid hydrocarbon can fuel a 300-mile trip on a full tank compared to the average Elon Musk-owned electric cars that go 250 miles on a single battery charge

 

Tesla is poised to become a powerhouse in the automobile industry as the world is ditching gas-powered vehicles for electric, but a new technology could overthrow the Elon Musk-owned company.

Called Blue gas, it is a liquid hydrocarbon fuel consisting of carbon monoxide and oxygen that can be used in vehicles built from 2002 – and it is 100 percent emissions free.

It also propels vehicles 300 miles on a full tank, while Tesla’s power system provides up to 250 miles on a full battery, on average.

 

However, Blue Gas is starting to make headway in the industry and could change the future of vehicles.

The innovation is different from regular hydrogen, as it is produced through a carbon neutral process that uses natural gas alongside carbon capture and storage.

 

Instead of giving off polluting exhaust like gas vehicles, those that run on blue gas emit water and heat, SpaceCoastDaily reports. 

Although Tesla is touted as being environmentally friendly, the firm uses lithium in its battery.

The extraction process requires 500,000 gallons of water per metric ton of lithium, harms the soil and causes air contamination.

And once a lithium battery dies it is discarded.

However, Tesla’s website states: ‘None of our scrapped lithium-ion batteries go to a land fill, and 100% are recycled.’

The new fuel also provides more miles on a full tank - about 50 more miles.

 

According to Solar Reviews: 'Much like a gasoline engine, the Tesla adjusts the available mile range up or down based on current driving conditions.

'With a full charge, it may say that you have 250 miles to go, but it could be slightly less if you are always stomping on the gas pedal and driving aggressively.'

Blue gas seems like the fuel source the world has been waiting for, but the issues with the innovation is that we will have to wait for it.

The fuel is still in its infancy and companies are learning how to move forward with it in a way its customers will want to buy in.

 

Will blue gas kill Tesla? New emission-free liquid hydrocarbon fuels a 300-mile trip on a full tank | Daily Mail Online

 

 

[Paul Evans]

Perhaps I'm missing something here. This fuel is said to be a hydrocarbon fuel but is, apparently, made from carbon monoxide and oxygen. An essential "ingredient" of a hydrocarbon is hydrogen - there is no hydrogen in either of the two stated components. It is said that the fuel, when burned, produces only water and heat. Water includes hydrogen. Where does it come from if it's not in the fuel? What happens to the carbon in the carbon monoxide, it certainly doesn't form part of the water and heat has no chemical composition. Has some miracle happened?

[Tracy D'arth]

I think the hydrogen comes from methane in natural gas.  

 

The innovation is different from regular hydrogen, as it is produced through a carbon neutral process that uses natural gas alongside carbon capture and storage.

 

TD'

[peterboat]

3 minutes ago, Paul Evans said:

Perhaps I'm missing something here. This fuel is said to be a hydrocarbon fuel but is, apparently, made from carbon monoxide and oxygen. An essential "ingredient" of a hydrocarbon is hydrogen - there is no hydrogen in either of the two stated components. It is said that the fuel, when burned, produces only water and heat. Water includes hydrogen. Where does it come from if it's not in the fuel? What happens to the carbon in the carbon monoxide, it certainly doesn't form part of the water and heat has no chemical composition. Has some miracle happened?

No miracle just Bxxxxs the old cars cant be used its for fuel cell cars which are eye wateringly expensive, make electric cars look cheap in fact Read the full article in the link, we in Rotherham have a hydrogen filling station powered by a wind turbine so its green Hydrogen, this is hydrogen from natural gas which is going to run out so its more pointless than ever

[ditchcrawler]

41 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

  

 

Will blue gas kill Tesla? New emission-free liquid hydrocarbon fuels a 300-mile trip on a full tank | Daily Mail Online

 

 

The Daily Mail were a bit late to the party with this one

[Alan de Enfield]

1 minute ago, ditchcrawler said:

The Daily Mail were a bit late to the party with this one

 

 

Yes, I see it has been going around the US investment market for some time, and now Budweiser has ordered 20x more 'blue-gas' trucks than they had planned for Tesla trucks, it seems to becoming available for early adopters.

[peterboat]

55 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

 

Yes, I see it has been going around the US investment market for some time, and now Budweiser has ordered 20x more 'blue-gas' trucks than they had planned for Tesla trucks, it seems to becoming available for early adopters.

Have a look at this article Alan https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiCkLKc9fXuAhVUfMAKHeKnCNgQFjAAegQIAhAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.electrive.com%2F2019%2F06%2F11%2Fnorway-explosion-at-fuel-cell-filling-station%2F&usg=AOvVaw1Rr_GiJR5wKfRzio5P3S60

[Alan de Enfield]

18 minutes ago, peterboat said:

Have a look at this article Alan https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiCkLKc9fXuAhVUfMAKHeKnCNgQFjAAegQIAhAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.electrive.com%2F2019%2F06%2F11%2Fnorway-explosion-at-fuel-cell-filling-station%2F&usg=AOvVaw1Rr_GiJR5wKfRzio5P3S60

 

When equipment is incorrectly installed it result in problems / fire / explosions.

There have been fires / explosions in Petrol garages, and gas dealerships.

 

From your link :

 

The problem that led to an explosion at a hydrogen filling station on 10 June near Oslo was an incorrectly mounted plug in a hydrogen tank in a high-pressure storage tank. Manufacturer Nel made the inquiry public and is establishing precautions.

 

As the explosion was 3 years after installation, it would not appear to be a system failure, more likely 'a service engineer not concentrating on doing his job'

 

 

I know you are an early adopter of Lithiums and electric boating but you should not close your mind to other potential power sources that are being developed that can be even 'greener' that you.

Lithium mining and lithium battery production is environmentally 'expensive' and as you rightly say we should consider the full 'costs' from 'well to pump', for Dino-fuels we should also do the same for battery systems.

Edited February 19, 2021 by Alan de Enfield

[peterboat]

12 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

When equipment is incorrectly installed it result in problems / fire / explosions.

There have been fires / explosions in Petrol garages, and gas dealerships.

 

From your link :

 

The problem that led to an explosion at a hydrogen filling station on 10 June near Oslo was an incorrectly mounted plug in a hydrogen tank in a high-pressure storage tank. Manufacturer Nel made the inquiry public and is establishing precautions.

 

As the explosion was 3 years after installation, it would not appear to be a system failure, more likely 'a service engineer not concentrating on doing his job'

 

 

I know you are an early adopter of Lithiums and electric boating but you should not close your mind to other potential power sources that are being developed that can be even 'greener' that you.

Lithium mining and lithium battery production is environmentally 'expensive' and as you rightly say we should consider the full 'costs' from 'well to pump', for Dino-fuels we should also do the same for battery systems.

Its the cost of the vehicles and the specialised servicing that puts me off, the daughter has done research work on hydrogen at leeds uni they all say its a non starter but are taking the government money anyway. The figures and safety dont add up like they do for batteries, if I am honest batteries have won the race for transport, hydrogen has its uses power station near the interconnects using wind turbines to create Hydrogen instead of turning them off, wind slows power station starts all clean no waste and more important no transporting hydrogen allover the place

[Idle Days]

Composing poo gives off an inflatable gas; is there any mileage in it? 

[Bee]

Carbon Monoxide? Oxygen? I'm not a chemist but isn't this much the same as the old producer gas (think that's the name) made by roasting wood. Used to be stored in great big gas bags strapped to the roofs of vehicles in WW2?  Bizzard would probably know - he's probably got a gas plant somewhere made from Meccano. If it is then I might make some and run it through a compressor and squeeze it into those rusty old gas bottles behind the shed. What could possibly go wrong?

[ditchcrawler]

4 minutes ago, Bee said:

Carbon Monoxide? Oxygen? I'm not a chemist but isn't this much the same as the old producer gas (think that's the name) made by roasting wood. Used to be stored in great big gas bags strapped to the roofs of vehicles in WW2?  Bizzard would probably know - he's probably got a gas plant somewhere made from Meccano. If it is then I might make some and run it through a compressor and squeeze it into those rusty old gas bottles behind the shed. What could possibly go wrong?

https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2014/07/rolling-gasified-coal-gas-bag-vehicles/

 

[Alway Swilby]

What would you do with all the captured carbon? Maybe put it in CRT bins? ?

[IanD]

It's still either burning fossil fuels, or (like hydrogen) just acting as energy storage but using 3x as much energy as BEV.

 

Another pointless attempt by the fossil fuel industry to hang on to their existing business models. Go and read the Scania press release about why they've dropped hydrogen to see why it won't take off...

[Tony Brooks]

It seems this Blue gas is to be used in a fuel cell to produce electricity. In 2008 I investigated and wrote a piece on fuel cells and the one that had a larger output was diesel fueld.  They burned the fuel "rich" to make carbon monoxide  then mixed it with seam from the fuel cell exhaust to make hydrogen. The hydrogen was the fed to the fuel cell. The problem was that the whole process had to be exceptionally carefully controlled to ensure no carbon monoxide reached the cell pipe because if it did the pile would be "poisoned" and need replacing. After not so many months the whole ting went very quiet. I got the impression it was not reliable in the long term. Now, as carbon monoxide is still involved I suspect the same pile poisoning may be a problem so we need to sit on our hand., hope, and see how it develops.

[magpie patrick]

47 minutes ago, Idle Days said:

Composing poo 

Using waste to create energy is one thing, using it to create music really would be revolutionary! 

[David Mack]

54 minutes ago, Idle Days said:

Composing poo

 

5 minutes ago, magpie patrick said:

Using waste to create energy is one thing, using it to create music really would be revolutionary! 

 

Isn't it decomposing?

[ditchcrawler]

1 hour ago, magpie patrick said:

Using waste to create energy is one thing, using it to create music really would be revolutionary! 

 

[Alan de Enfield]

 

A man traveling by plane and in urgent need to use the mens room is nervously tapping his foot on the floor of the aircraft. Each time he tried the mens room door, it was "OCCUPIED".

The stewardess, aware of his predicament suggested that he go ahead and use the ladies room, but cautioned him against using any of the buttons inside.

The buttons were marked "WW, WA, PP and ATR".

Making the mistake that so many men make in disregarding the importance of what a woman says, the man let his curiosity get the best of him and decided to try the buttons anyway.

He carefully pressed the first button marked "WW" and immediately warm water sprayed all over his entire bottom.

He thought, "WOW, the women really have it made!".

Still curious, he pressed the button marked "WA" and a gentle breeze of warm air quickly dried his hind quarters.

He thought that was out of this world! The button marked "PP" yielded a large powder puff which delicately applied a soft talc to his rear.

Well, naturally he couldn't resist the last button marked "ATR".

When he woke up in the hospital he panicked and buzzed for the nurse.

When she appeared, he cried out, "What happened to me?! The last thing I remember is I was in the ladies room on a business trip!"

The nurse replied, "Yes, you were having a great time until you pressed the 'ATR' button which stands for Automatic Tampon Remover... Your penis is under your pillow!"

[Mike Todd]

4 hours ago, peterboat said:

Its the cost of the vehicles and the specialised servicing that puts me off, the daughter has done research work on hydrogen at leeds uni they all say its a non starter but are taking the government money anyway. The figures and safety dont add up like they do for batteries, if I am honest batteries have won the race for transport, hydrogen has its uses power station near the interconnects using wind turbines to create Hydrogen instead of turning them off, wind slows power station starts all clean no waste and more important no transporting hydrogen allover the place

Did you see the item on BBC  (yesterday?) or was it another channel (?!?) that sampled the ability to get an electric car serviced. It appeared to say that very few garages will touch them - too much investment for too few customers was the charge.

[lepus]

I think you might find its nearer 500,000 gallons per tonne

[peterboat]

1 hour ago, Mike Todd said:

Did you see the item on BBC  (yesterday?) or was it another channel (?!?) that sampled the ability to get an electric car serviced. It appeared to say that very few garages will touch them - too much investment for too few customers was the charge.

Why didn't they ring the car makers franchise? Often the service is very cheap as it has so little done on it.  Mine has a pollen filter and brake fluid change every 2 years along with it's inspection, 40 mins apparently, I will service mine myself as its not complicated. Ultimately the garages that don't train up will be gone, that and so little to do will make life easier and cheaper for us

[alias]

2 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

A man traveling by plane and in urgent need to use the mens room is nervously tapping his foot on the floor of the aircraft. Each time he tried the mens room door, it was "OCCUPIED".

The stewardess, aware of his predicament suggested that he go ahead and use the ladies room, but cautioned him against using any of the buttons inside.

The buttons were marked "WW, WA, PP and ATR".

Making the mistake that so many men make in disregarding the importance of what a woman says, the man let his curiosity get the best of him and decided to try the buttons anyway.

He carefully pressed the first button marked "WW" and immediately warm water sprayed all over his entire bottom.

He thought, "WOW, the women really have it made!".

Still curious, he pressed the button marked "WA" and a gentle breeze of warm air quickly dried his hind quarters.

He thought that was out of this world! The button marked "PP" yielded a large powder puff which delicately applied a soft talc to his rear.

Well, naturally he couldn't resist the last button marked "ATR".

When he woke up in the hospital he panicked and buzzed for the nurse.

When she appeared, he cried out, "What happened to me?! The last thing I remember is I was in the ladies room on a business trip!"

The nurse replied, "Yes, you were having a great time until you pressed the 'ATR' button which stands for Automatic Tampon Remover... Your penis is under your pillow!"

 

My first experience of a Japanese toilet with a control panel mounted on one side of the seat was in a hotel in Osaka. 

 

On arrival I unpacked my shirts and hung them on the back of the bathroom door thinking that steam from the shower might help any creases fall out. Then my eye was caught by the complicated W.C. with numerous buttons with undecipherable labels.

 

Not wanting any unfortunate surprises, I stood to one side to see what the buttons did. This was working fine until I pressed the button that gave a surprisingly strong jet of water, and scored a direct hit on my clean shirts hanging on the back of the door... 

 

[enigmatic]

19 hours ago, ditchcrawler said:

 

 

Do Thetford do one of these for boats?