Toddy II - is anyone familiar with this boat or know the owner?

[NB DW]

I'd be hugely grateful if anyone could help put me in touch with the owner or at least know of the boat...

 

Thank you

[PD1964]

You know what everyone is going to ask Why?

  I see it’s for sale, so I take it your interested in buying, no luck contacting the seller via the Ad on Apolloduck?

https://narrowboats.apolloduck.co.uk/boat/soar-valley-57-semi-trad-for-sale/653855

Edited February 9, 2021 by PD1964

[NB DW]

36 minutes ago, PD1964 said:

You know what everyone is going to ask Why?

  I see it’s for sale, so I take it your interested in buying, no luck contacting the seller via the Ad on Apolloduck?

https://narrowboats.apolloduck.co.uk/boat/soar-valley-57-semi-trad-for-sale/653855

 

It's up with a brokerage, not that you'd be able to tell from the (barely existent) ad.

[haggis]

I didn't see any side hatches. is there only one way of entering and leaving the boat? Asking from a safety point of view. Looks a bit expensive but I am probably not up with current pricing in the strong second hand boat market. 

 

haggis

[Alan de Enfield]

 

Someone else was asking about that recently and there was a lot of questions about it.

 

One being" where is this gas locker & how can that pass the BSS with all that 'stuff' in the same space' as the gas cylinders and by what method is it 'gas-tight' to above the regulator/valves ?"

 

 

[TheBiscuits]

6 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Someone else was asking about that recently and there was a lot of questions about it.

 

One being" where is this gas locker & how can that pass the BSS with all that 'stuff' in the same space' as the gas cylinders and by what method is it 'gas-tight' to above the regulator/valves ?"

 

 

 

I'm convinced the gas locker is the whole welldeck/cratch area on that boat.  The curved metal bit is the shaped front of the cabin, and the white PVC bit is the cratch cover.

 

If the forward bulkhead is gas tight I think it complies with BSS - any leaking gas would escape the boat safely and not enter the cabin or bilges.  The welldeck scuppers should be acceptable as gas locker drains.

 

[Alan de Enfield]

17 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

 

I'm convinced the gas locker is the whole welldeck/cratch area on that boat.  The curved metal bit is the shaped front of the cabin, and the white PVC bit is the cratch cover.

 

If the forward bulkhead is gas tight I think it complies with BSS - any leaking gas would escape the boat safely and not enter the cabin or bilges.  The welldeck scuppers should be acceptable as gas locker drains.

 

 

I just cannot see it - if the white plastic is the front of the cratch, with the bottom level with the gunwales, then what is the 'blue' (metal ?) that the cupboard and shelf are attached to ?

 

 

 

 

Assuming it is a secure, gas tight, cratch with no door or access into the cabin, it looks to be a poor design for egress, with both 'doors' being in the rear 1/4  of the boat (side hatch and rear door)

 

Not a boat I'd want to buy.

Edited February 10, 2021 by Alan de Enfield

[magnetman]

There is a side hatch near the bows on the starboard side. 

 

I'd rather see one each side but the boat is safely set up in terms of emergency egress. 

Edited February 10, 2021 by magnetman

[TheBiscuits]

1 minute ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

I just cannot see it - if the white plastic is the front of the cratch, with the bottom level with the gunwales, then what is the 'blue' (metal ?) wass that the cupboard and shelf are attached to ?

 

Assuming it is a secure, gas tight, cratch with no door or access into the cabin, it looks to be a poor design for egress, with both 'doors' being in the rear 1/4  of the boat (side hatch and rear door)

 

Not a boat I'd want to buy.

 

 

The white plastic is the inner side of the blue PVC cratch cover.  The shelf, the locker and the regulator are attached to the forward bulkhead of the cabin, and the gas bottles are exactly where the bow doors would be on a "normal" boat layout. 

 

Forward access/egress is via doors/hatch on the starboard side - you can see the upper hatch on the roof - that is positioned at the foot of the bed.  The head of the bed is against the other side of the forward bulkhead.

[haggis]

1 minute ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

 

The white plastic is the inner side of the blue PVC cratch cover.  The shelf, the locker and the regulator are attached to the forward bulkhead of the cabin, and the gas bottles are exactly where the bow doors would be on a "normal" boat layout. 

 

Forward access/egress is via doors/hatch on the starboard side - you can see the upper hatch on the roof - that is positioned at the foot of the bed.  The head of the bed is against the other side of the forward bulkhead.

Ah, I see it now. Not a boat I would ever think of owning especially at that price

 

haggis

[magnetman]

I think that's actually quite a clever bit of work there. You get a nice little shed area completely separated from the cabin, easy access to gas rather than fannying about at the pointy end, nice dry coal storage, bike or whatever, and you get a full size bed across the boat with a door at the end for air and/or emergency exit.

 

Having lived previously on a 55ft narrow boat with normal front and rear doors for 12 years I really like this alternative a lot. 

 

Very practical. Provided that the access across the engine room is comfortable to get in and out of the boat. 

 

 

 

Edit to remove double post.

Edited February 10, 2021 by magnetman

[PD1964]

I would say a way over priced boat and probably owned by an elderly couple living in the Marina.

Why would you turn your well deck into a  dodgy gas locker?

NB DW look elsewhere far better boats out there in this price range with nice well deck seating areas and front doors.

 

[TheBiscuits]

8 minutes ago, PD1964 said:

Why would you turn your well deck into a  dodgy gas locker?

[snip]

far better boats out there in this price range with nice well deck seating areas and front doors.

 

Each to their own, I'd say.  It wouldn't particularly suit me, but to have bow doors would mean a smaller bed to allow walking past or one that needs to be put up/down every day.  Well deck seating isn't usually all that fantastic which is why so many people sit out on the towpath.

[nebulae]

I seem to remember a thread about side doors as a front emergency hatch.  You cant open the side doors in a narrow lock.  If the boat foundered with the stern sinking first,no way to get out. Somebody trying to invent the wheel?

[TheBiscuits]

Just now, nebulae said:

I seem to remember a thread about side doors as a front emergency hatch.  You cant open the side doors in a narrow lock.  If the boat foundered with the stern sinking first,no way to get out.

 

Don't do locks while you are in bed?

 

Most couples would tend to have one as a lockwheeler and the other as a steerer so neither would be in the forward cabin.  Singlehanders are very unlikely to be doing locks while asleep!

[magnetman]

I reckon the top hinged hatch is big enough to get out of in an emergency if the door is trapped closed.

Maybe not for more portly people but then it's not obligatory to buy the boat anyway. 

[matty40s]

A brokerage not wanting to pay any listing fees to Appolloduck.

[Alan de Enfield]

1 hour ago, magnetman said:

I think that's actually quite a clever bit of work there. You get a nice little shed area completely separated from the cabin, easy access to gas rather than fannying

 

BSS regs : But you are not supposed to 'store stuff'in your gas locker that could rattle about and produce a spark, or could fall onto the gas bottles and pull off the pipe, or fall onto or damage the regulator. No stuff stored that could fall and block the drains (cloths etc)

 

R = BSS mandatory Requirement.

 

7.3.3 Is the cylinder locker clear of any items that could block the drain? R

Check cylinder lockersfor any items which could block the drain.

Cylinder lockers must be clear of any item which could block the drain.

 

Failed !

 

7.4.3 Are LPG cylinders in a locker protected against falling objects? R

Check for the presence of a lid or cover on all top‐opening cylinder lockers. If not present check that the cylinders, regulators and associated equipment are otherwise protected. Top‐opening LPG cylinder lockers must either have: • a lid or cover, or • cylinders, and other LPG system components must be otherwise protected against falling objects.

 

Failed !

 

7.4.4 Is the cylinder locker clear of any items that could damage the LPG equipment or ignite leaked LPG? R

Check the contents of all cylinder lockers. Cylinder lockers must not contain loose sharp or heavy items such as anchors or mooring pins that could damage the cylinders or other LPG system components. Cylinder lockers must not contain any item that could ignite leaked LPG.

 

Failed !

 

What is that white 'cable' clipped to the side ?

A water tap is mounted (and piped in) below the height of the Cylinder valves (breach in gas-tightness ?)

Can the gas be turned off from inside the boat ? or, do you have to get off, walk round and go into the cratch ?

 

I'd suggest there are a number of safety issues on this boat.

Edited February 10, 2021 by Alan de Enfield

[PD1964]

3 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

What is that white 'cable' clipped to the side ?

 

I'd suggest there are a number of safety issues on this boat.

It looks like the main gas pipe into the boat coming from the duel regulator into what looks like a bubble tester then into the boat.

[ditchcrawler]

3 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

BSS regs : But you are not supposed to 'store stuff'in your gas locker that could rattle about and produce a spark, or could fall onto the gas bottles and pull off the pipe, or fall onto or damage the regulator. No stuff stored that could fall and block the drains (cloths etc)

 

R = BSS mandatory Requirement.

 

7.3.3 Is the cylinder locker clear of any items that could block the drain? R

Check cylinder lockersfor any items which could block the drain.

Cylinder lockers must be clear of any item which could block the drain.

 

Failed ! Is there anything that could block the drains, I can't see the drain to answer that

 

7.4.3 Are LPG cylinders in a locker protected against falling objects? R

Check for the presence of a lid or cover on all top‐opening cylinder lockers. If not present check that the cylinders, regulators and associated equipment are otherwise protected. Top‐opening LPG cylinder lockers must either have: • a lid or cover, or • cylinders, and other LPG system components must be otherwise protected against falling objects.

 

Failed !  Under the fixed shelf

 

 

7.4.4 Is the cylinder locker clear of any items that could damage the LPG equipment or ignite leaked LPG? R

Check the contents of all cylinder lockers. Cylinder lockers must not contain loose sharp or heavy items such as anchors or mooring pins that could damage the cylinders or other LPG system components. Cylinder lockers must not contain any item that could ignite leaked LPG.

 

Failed ! most things I can see look reasonably secure, more so than most conventional gas lockers

 

What is that white 'cable' clipped to the side ?

A water tap is mounted (and piped in) below the height of the Cylinder valves (breach in gas-tightness ?)

Can the gas be turned off from inside the boat ? or, do you have to get off, walk round and go into the cratch ?

 

I'd suggest there are a number of safety issues on this boat.

I think you may be being a bit hard there with your view.

[Alan de Enfield]

5 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

I think you may be being a bit hard there with your view.

 

You are of course entitled to your view, but I believe if you go thru the BSS requirements item by item it will be seen that (in my view) it fails on many of them.

 

Just 1 example : Mop, loose cloths etc can fall to the floor and block the drains

[ditchcrawler]

20 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

You are of course entitled to your view, but I believe if you go thru the BSS requirements item by item it will be seen that (in my view) it fails on many of them.

 

Just 1 example : Mop, loose cloths etc can fall to the floor and block the drains

Well I am not a BSS inspector so it is only my view, I have no idea if you are one or if its just your view, but our views differ which is good for discussion.