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Does anyone like to do any work on my narrowboat I need the bilge area all de rusted and painted I will supply all materials just need a Labour cost or anyone interested thankyou


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11 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

If you want the job done properly, including the engine drip tray the engine will have to come out. There is no hurry because unless you want the paint to fall off PDQ you need to wait until the water and air temperateness are far higher than a present.

Most people don't take their engine out and can still do a proper job. The drip tray area under the engine itself is generally small and easy enough to maintain simply by keeping it dry and lining with absorbing pads.

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12 hours ago, LadyG said:

I think the problem is that of removing the engine, which is almost certainly going to give a better job. 

Not really. Oil and water will soon lift most bilge paints anyway, unless it's a good two pack. Better to accept that the drip tray will be oily but keep it dry so it doesn't corrode. Asthetically it doesn't make a lot of difference as nobody can see the drip tray anyway unless they get their head down there.

12 hours ago, David Mack said:

So a boatyard have told you the engine must come out to do the job properly (and I agree). And you think getting some bod off the street to try and do the job working around the engine will give you an acceptable result?

Some bod off the street might do a botch job, but it's possible to do a perfectly acceptable job without taking the engine out assuming there's access to the other areas besides what's directly under the engine..

Edited by blackrose
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10 hours ago, Phoenix_V said:

When I started boating with all boats fitted with Listers and BMC underneath the engine never needed painting because the oil leaking from the engine kept the bilge rust free, these new fangled japanese engines have created this issue.

If the engine doesn't leak then why would the area beneath it corrode if it's kept dry? You can always smear some oil over the base of the drip tray if that makes you feel better.

10 hours ago, robtheplod said:

maybe just chuck some oil in the bottom and problem solved!  :)

If you're just talking about the drip tray then yes as long as any coolant or other water that would get under the oil is removed. If you're talking about the rest of the engine room floor then it's not such a good idea unless you can ensure it stays dry and you're not walking on it because you'll just transfer oil to your decks.

Edited by blackrose
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A few things to consider - does the engine require any work that may be easier when removed from the boat?

 Do you want to run the risk of abrasive dust, rust particles and steel shavings entering the engine, or other moving parts in the engine bay?

 

Have the boatyard specified the job? If it will include bead blasting a canalside job of uncontrolled quality won't compare on any level, and if a reputable firm you will have some comeback if anything goes wrong. 

 There is also the option of deferring this job until the engine and/or stern gear need attention, which is highly likely to be not too far into the future if not already done.

Edited by BWM
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4 hours ago, blackrose said:

Most people don't take their engine out and can still do a proper job. The drip tray area under the engine itself is generally small and easy enough to maintain simply by keeping it dry and lining with absorbing pads.

I think I said several posts up that drip trays tend not to rust but as for the need to get the engine out to do the rest, that depends upon the design of the boat. If the ga stank is at the front or in the cabin side then it removes a very big obstruction that it causes against the  rear bulkhead of a cruiser stern. Again with a cruiser stern if any supports for the engine boards are fixed they create an obstruction that again prevents access to parts of the bilge. I am over 6ft tall with long arms but there were parts of my bilge that I could only access with long handled radiator brushes, no idea how I could de-rust those areas. On modern rear engine trads if there is fixed furnishing or steps beside the engine they may again restrict full access. On a semi-trad I dread to think how difficult access the the bilge area will be through the side seats.

 

In all cases with the engine out you can usually squat down in the engine space and reach all around you.

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2 hours ago, BWM said:

A few things to consider - does the engine require any work that may be easier when removed from the boat?

 Do you want to run the risk of abrasive dust, rust particles and steel shavings entering the engine, or other moving parts in the engine bay?

 

Have the boatyard specified the job? If it will include bead blasting a canalside job of uncontrolled quality won't compare on any level, and if a reputable firm you will have some comeback if anything goes wrong. 

 There is also the option of deferring this job until the engine and/or stern gear need attention, which is highly likely to be not too far into the future if not already done.

???  

"enter the engine" how?  

"moving parts" (prop shaft) ? 

"steel shavings"  - OMG !!!  what are you doing to shave steel when cleaning the bilge?

just use common sense - not really a problem.  

Edited by Murflynn
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It depends on how much space there is in your engine hole as to weather the job is feasible.

On my old boat it would have been impossible with the engine in.The engine could only be accessed by either lying on the counter and reaching down,or by removing internal trim and reaching in.

A friends boat however,has quite a cavernous engine hole.He keeps tools and spares down there and there is room to kneel beside the engine.

It would not be difficult to de-rust and paint his engine bilge with the engine in place.

It's too cold at the moment for painting,so I would just clean it out as best you can and leave it untill summer or the engine needs to come out for some reason.

You might try getting some more quotes from other yards.£2000 sounds rather dear,and £700 too cheap.I would guess about £1000.

Edited by Mad Harold
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17 hours ago, Jerra said:

Perhaps the boatyard didn't want the job!

It does sound like a "go away" quote. A bit like what insurance companies do to renewal quotes when they want to get out of a particular market.

 

16 hours ago, Phoenix_V said:

When I started boating with all boats fitted with Listers and BMC underneath the engine never needed painting because the oil leaking from the engine kept the bilge rust free, these new fangled japanese engines have created this issue.

Owners of classic cars with old fashioned engines that leak oil refer to them as self replenishing chassis corrosion protection systems.

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12 minutes ago, Mad Harold said:

It depends on how much space there is in your engine hole as to weather the job is feasible.

On my old boat it would have been impossible with the engine in.The engine could only be accessed by either lying on the counter and reaching down,or by removing internal trim and reaching in.

 

Some boats (particularly modern trads) are not easy , and can be so tight as to make changing the oil filter a difficult job.

Drop the spanner or a nut and it could be 'goodbye'.

 

My Trad :

 

 

 

 

IMG_20131214_121819.jpg

IMG_20131214_121846.jpg

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On 15/01/2021 at 16:40, Daniel Grantham said:

It’s a boat that’s been sitting in a marina for the last 2 years plus I want it to be a liveaboard and not rely on a marina 

Your going to waste a lot of money if you don’t do jobs like this yourself. Not a hard job, sounds like you don’t want to get your hands dirty?  This is basic and if your not prepared to do jobs like this then maybe having a boat is not for you. Or you should of bought a brand new one with a freshly painted engine bay and no dirt.

Edited by PD1964
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4 hours ago, PD1964 said:

Your going to waste a lot of money if you don’t do jobs like this yourself. Not a hard job, sounds like you don’t want to get your hands dirty?  This is basic and if your not prepared to do jobs like this then maybe having a boat is not for you. Or you should of bought a brand new one with a freshly painted engine bay and no dirt.

where can I hire a daily help to make the beds and do the washing up in my galley? 

she has to have her own transport between bridges so I can "continuously cruise".

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22 hours ago, Murflynn said:

???  

"enter the engine" how?  

"moving parts" (prop shaft) ? 

"steel shavings"  - OMG !!!  what are you doing to shave steel when cleaning the bilge?

just use common sense - not really a problem.  

Propshaft U/J's, C/V joints, fuel pump linkage, alternator internals and many others are vulnerable to abrasive dust, not to forget the air intake - it is not clear if the owner will be living aboard during the work so this needs to be considered. 

 The O/P wants it cleaned, prepared and painted - this process will produce all the above. Try reading the original question before attacking those attempting to help, as this sort of drivel brings nothing in the way of help to the boat owner. 

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8 minutes ago, BWM said:

Propshaft U/J's, C/V joints, fuel pump linkage, alternator internals and many others are vulnerable to abrasive dust, not to forget the air intake - it is not clear if the owner will be living aboard during the work so this needs to be considered. 

 The O/P wants it cleaned, prepared and painted - this process will produce all the above. Try reading the original question before attacking those attempting to help, as this sort of drivel brings nothing in the way of help to the boat owner. 

I am fully aware of the OP.

I am also aware that with a suitable dose of common sense none of those "hazards" are either realistic or unavoidable.    Oh f**k !!  - I forgot that common sense is no longer fashionable.

 

Please collect your "steel shavings" as evidence to explain how they are created when cleaning, de-rusting and painting the bilge.

 

.............................  in your case "bilge" supercedes my alleged "drivel".    :wacko:

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1 hour ago, Murflynn said:

I am fully aware of the OP.

I am also aware that with a suitable dose of common sense none of those "hazards" are either realistic or unavoidable.    Oh f**k !!  - I forgot that common sense is no longer fashionable.

 

Please collect your "steel shavings" as evidence to explain how they are created when cleaning, de-rusting and painting the bilge.

 

.............................  in your case "bilge" supercedes my alleged "drivel".    :wacko:

Anyone who has used various abrasives, grinding discs and knotted cup brushes will be aware of the end products of this. I don't understand what you believe this sort of asinine, argumentative banter brings in the way of useful information, it truly is one of the worst aspects of the forum.

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27 minutes ago, BWM said:

Anyone who has used various abrasives, grinding discs and knotted cup brushes will be aware of the end products of this. I don't understand what you believe this sort of asinine, argumentative banter brings in the way of useful information, it truly is one of the worst aspects of the forum.

Common sense says you will not use grinding discs to clean the engine bilge.  Anyway they do not produce "metal shavings", they produce tiny particles of burnt iron.

Even using a grinder fitted with a cup brush in such a confined space is potentially hazardous - to the user.

Cup brushes and sanders of various types produce tiny particles of rust - again not "metal shavings".

 

Sensible technical advice is appreciated.  Alarmist imaginary warnings are not, especially to a newbie who thinks he has to lift the engine to clean an oily bilge tray.

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38 minutes ago, Murflynn said:

Common sense says you will not use grinding discs to clean the engine bilge.  Anyway they do not produce "metal shavings", they produce tiny particles of burnt iron.

Even using a grinder fitted with a cup brush in such a confined space is potentially hazardous - to the user.

Cup brushes and sanders of various types produce tiny particles of rust - again not "metal shavings".

 

Sensible technical advice is appreciated.  Alarmist imaginary warnings are not, especially to a newbie who thinks he has to lift the engine to clean an oily bilge tray.

You really appear to struggle with reality, the OP is new to boating and i think it is safe to assume that they have little experience of the processes involved. I never set out to advise you. 

 Sometimes you need to accept you are wrong, and on this occasion you are talking nonsense. 

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1 hour ago, Murflynn said:

Common sense says you will not use grinding discs to clean the engine bilge.  Anyway they do not produce "metal shavings", they produce tiny particles of burnt iron.

Even using a grinder fitted with a cup brush in such a confined space is potentially hazardous - to the user.

Cup brushes and sanders of various types produce tiny particles of rust - again not "metal shavings".

 

Sensible technical advice is appreciated.  Alarmist imaginary warnings are not, especially to a newbie who thinks he has to lift the engine to clean an oily bilge tray.

 

Unless its badly rusted so emery paper and hard work would not be enough.  Using an angle grinder plus whatever tool you put on it is potentially hazardous  so sensible people equip themselves to minimise the danger. that includes learning how to sue the tool safely and getting the correct PPE to minimise the danger. Whilst I agree about the metal shavings cup brushes do shed wires and they can look a bit like drill swarf so also like metal shavings.

 

I would be very interested in the methods you would use to remove rust from a bilge in a timely and efficient manner.

 

I would also be interested to hear how many narrowboat engine bay bilges those who say engine removal is not required to do a proper job have de-rusted and painted because two of us have said in some cases removing the engine is the quickest way. Back to your post, it would also be the safer way because it gives more space for proper body positioning relative to the tool and job and fewer obstructions for power tools to catch on.

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1 hour ago, robtheplod said:

When I do mine I'll leave the engine in place as i can get quite good access all around, but any less room I'd be looking to remove it....

That really is the whole point. In your case you have a removable centre support for the deck boards so can get into the bilge by standing astride the engine You ca also face the rear and fully bend down to get at the stern area. However try getting similar access with the centre support in place.

 

As far as I am aware the OP has not posted a photo that is similar to yours so any comments about the need to remove the engine can only be guess work and its no good guessing based on a single or a very few boats. On the face of it the engine might or might not have to be removed to do a timely job. There are two possibilities re the estimate. 1. It would be a faster overall job with the engine out or 2. its a we don't want the job price but behind a computer on the info we have at present we simply do not know.

 

It might even be that the use of a heated dry dock has been costed into that £2000.

Edited by Tony Brooks
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I did my semi-trad about 6 years ago. I had about as much room as robtheplod's pictures show in the post above. It was about the worst/dirtiest job I have done on the boat but very satisfying to see the end result. I took off as much rust as I could with an angle grinder and wire brushes, then painted with two coats of hammerite. I have a pram hood and container under the stern gland so I don't get much water laying down there and it still looks pretty good. 

 

I agree engine out would make it so much easier but it is diyable if you are flexible and bendy enough, and don't mind getting filthy. 

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I repainted our trad engine floor over a couple of years. It is a pig of a job especially for us pensioners. I found that doing it in stages helped to keep focused on doing a decent job while helping my creaking joints to recover in between.

 

My friends and I had engine bay envy at the Crick boat show a couple of years ago when three of us sat in the pristine engine room  of a dutch barge, we were so jealous of all the space down there.  

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