Responsible or Irresponsible Tier 3 Cruising?

[alias]

8 minutes ago, matty40s said:

Does he Vlog too?

No, but he can move in mysterious ways that don't break the rules.

[Guest]

25 minutes ago, Tam & Di said:

So if their boat is used for work does it have a commercial licence, relevant safety gear and suitable insurance? From the earlier description of the scuppers or whatever they called their well deck drains I suspect their boat does not comply with commercial vessel standards. Do they have certification as commercial skippers - a commercial boatman's certificate?  ?

 

Tam

I would suggest that is ever so slightly over the top.

 

At the very most they are running a video production business from the boat and that would IMHO fit comfortably within the scope of a CRT business licence, which for all we know they may very well have. Though looking at the categories of CRT business licences it's debatable as to which category of licence they could apply for.

 

Video productions may come under 'providing a service' but it's debatable as the 'product' is sent out electronically from the boat and no customers are required to call on or at the boat to receive the product or service.

 

From the roving trader section:-

 

Any boat used for trading in multiple locations.
Includes boats used for the sale of goods and/or
services, cargo carrying, and the provision of boat
handling courses.
Customers may board the boat in order to
inspect or purchase goods (subject to insurance
cover and holding a Non-private BSS certificate)
when moored up, but the boat must never
navigate with customers on board, except where
the boat is licensed for boat handling courses.
Advertising any kind of trading or business
activity on or from the boat is deemed to be
trading. If the boat is used for a business use that
is not advertised anywhere on the boat and does
not involve any deliveries to the boat or any
customers visiting the boat (e.g. proof reading
copy sent via email, writing wills) then its use is
not deemed to be that of a Roving Trader. If the
boat is used as a workshop to produce goods to
be sold on the internet or at land based markets,
then such use is deemed to be that of a roving trader.

Edited January 6, 2021 by The Happy Nomad

[PD1964]

13 minutes ago, The Happy Nomad said:

Especially if they are legally allowed to do so.

 

The fact is there are a lot of anomalies in the Covid world, it's just how it is.

I don’t think it would hurt them if they stayed put for a month and showed some moral responsibility on their Vlog. I know they have had comments on their Vlogs asking why they are moving against advice which they have subsequently removed, as with most Vloggers they don’t show the negative comments they just remove them, what a perfect world.

[Guest]

11 minutes ago, matty40s said:

Does he Vlog too?

No, at least not as far as I know.  But if he did I'm pretty sure somebody on here would find something to moan about if he did.

2 minutes ago, PD1964 said:

I don’t think it would hurt them if they stayed put for a month and showed some moral responsibility on their Vlog. I know they have had comments on their Vlogs asking why they are moving against advice which they have subsequently removed, as with most Vloggers they don’t show the negative comments they just remove them, what a perfect world.

 

Their vlog their choice.

 

No body is forced to watch it or read the comments.

 

[PD1964]

10 minutes ago, The Happy Nomad said:

 

Their vlog their choice.

 

No body is forced to watch it or read the comments.

 

I watch them hit and miss. I stopped taking them seriously when I seen  how pathetic Colin was when he had to empty the cassette toilet. 

Edited January 6, 2021 by PD1964

[Guest]

Just now, PD1964 said:

I watch them hit and miss. I stopped taking them seriously when I seen  how pathetic Shaun was when he had to empty the cassette toilet. 

I'm not sure the point is for them to be taken seriously 100% of the time.

 

Some people found it amusing. I know people who react in exactly the same way emptying the loo.

[matty40s]

17 minutes ago, The Happy Nomad said:

 

Their vlog their choice.

 

No body is forced to watch it or read the comments.

 

The Covid Pandemic is no-ones choice, the restrictions are in place to protect vulnerable people and the NHS. 

This isnt about their Vlog, its about them doing what is right in the present world outside their Vlog.

The reason this is so bad now is that some people seem to feel justified finding ways round the rules, guidelines and restrictions.

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, matty40s said:

The Covid Pandemic is no-ones choice, the restrictions are in place to protect vulnerable people and the NHS. 

This isnt about their Vlog, its about them doing what is right in the present world outside their Vlog.

The reason this is so bad now is that some people seem to feel justified finding ways round the rules, guidelines and restrictions.

I always had you down as somebody who could actually read, seems I may be wrong.

 

In that post I was talking about their right/choice to remove comments from their own vlog. Not about their right or other wise to legally work during the pandemic.

 

PS and don't be so patronising, I am well aware as you know of the consequences of this pandemic.

Edited January 6, 2021 by The Happy Nomad

[doratheexplorer]

1 hour ago, Tam & Di said:

So if their boat is used for work does it have a commercial licence, relevant safety gear and suitable insurance? From the earlier description of the scuppers or whatever they called their well deck drains I suspect their boat does not comply with commercial vessel standards. Do they have certification as commercial skippers - a commercial boatman's certificate?  ?

 

Tam

 

1 hour ago, Tam & Di said:

 

 

1 hour ago, Tam & Di said:

 

I'm currently working from home.  I don't pay business rates, nor have I submitted a planning application for change of use.

Edited January 6, 2021 by doratheexplorer

[matty40s]

26 minutes ago, The Happy Nomad said:

I always had you down as somebody who could actually read, seems I may be wrong.

 

In that post I was talking about their right/choice to remove comments from their own vlog. Not about their right or other wise to legally work during the pandemic.

 

PS and don't be so patronising, I am well aware as you know of the consequences of this pandemic.

Its not all about you Martin, it was aimed at what you typed, not what you should have typed if you wanted a specific response, and other related comments that were above.

No doubt they read, or are told about content on this forum an others. 

I like their Vlog, however, I do not like their attitude to National Covid restrictions, both the first time, and maybe now(not bothered watching for a couple of weeks)

See, not about you at all.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, matty40s said:

Its not all about you Martin, it was aimed at what you typed, not what you should have typed if you wanted a specific response, and other related comments that were above.

No doubt they read, or are told about content on this forum an others. 

I like their Vlog, however, I do not like their attitude to National Covid restrictions, both the first time, and maybe now(not bothered watching for a couple of weeks)

See, not about you at all.

Then perhaps you should have not quoted me but rather made a general none specific comment.

 

 

[matty40s]

30 minutes ago, doratheexplorer said:

 

 

I'm currently working from home.  I don't pay business rates, nor have I submitted a planning application for change of use.

They'll get you after its all over.....

[PD1964]

59 minutes ago, matty40s said:

The Covid Pandemic is no-ones choice, the restrictions are in place to protect vulnerable people and the NHS. 

This isnt about their Vlog, its about them doing what is right in the present world outside their Vlog.

The reason this is so bad now is that some people seem to feel justified finding ways round the rules, guidelines and restrictions.

It seams like they are only bothered about themselves and their Vlogs and not bothered about doing the right thing. Let’s see if they decide to stay in one place or continue to move in the next few weeks. Obviously a me, myself and I attitude with their actions in regard to Covid advice. 

Edited January 6, 2021 by PD1964

[Mike Todd]

1 hour ago, doratheexplorer said:

If that's how they make their livelihoods, then what else do you suggest?  TV programmes are still being made.  So what's the legal difference?

 

It feels odd, because they're doing something which the rest of us have been told not to do.  But letting them starve doesn't seem exactly fair.  Of course, for all I know, they earn £5 a month doing it, in which case, they should probably stop. 

 

What are the less popular vloggers doing?  Where should the line be drawn?

 

Under the current restrictions, TV and Film Crews are allowed to operate.

1 minute ago, PD1964 said:

It seams like they are only bothered about themselves and their Vlogs and not bothered about doing the right thing. Let’s see if they decide to stay in one place or continue to move in the next few weeks. Obviously me, myself and I with their actions in regard to Covid advice.

I think you will find that, for reasons quite obvious, this couple are obsessively careful about keeping within the Government rules - they might just not keep within yours, however.

[Mike Todd]

5 minutes ago, PD1964 said:

It seams like they are only bothered about themselves and their Vlogs and not bothered about doing the right thing. Let’s see if they decide to stay in one place or continue to move in the next few weeks. Obviously a me, myself and I attitude with their actions in regard to Covid advice. 

How could you tell from their vlog that they are not abiding by the current rules? What is restricted now was once allowed. Are you forgetting that there is usually quite a delay on most vlogs between filming and publication? 

[PD1964]

2 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

 

I think you will find that, for reasons quite obvious, this couple are obsessively careful about keeping within the Government rules - they might just not keep within yours, however.

Obviously not, as If they were why are they moving and have been moving throughout all the National Lockdowns? 

 Please don’t say they are allowed to move as It’s their job to make Vlogs. So not that obsessive about keeping safe.

[David Schweizer]

2 hours ago, doratheexplorer said:

If that's how they make their livelihoods, then what else do you suggest?  TV programmes are still being made.  So what's the legal difference?

 

It feels odd, because they're doing something which the rest of us have been told not to do.  But letting them starve doesn't seem exactly fair.  Of course, for all I know, they earn £5 a month doing it, in which case, they should probably stop. 

 

What are the less popular vloggers doing?  Where should the line be drawn?

 

A lot of other people also make their living from a wide range of "non essential" services, are you suggesting that those people should also seek to circumnavigate the rules?

 

 

Edited January 6, 2021 by David Schweizer

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, David Schweizer said:

A lot of other people also make their living from a wide range of "non essential" services, are you suggesting that those people should also seek to circumnavigate the rules?

If they are providing a service that they are allowed to then they are not circumventing any thing.

 

I personally find it peculiar and anomalous that garden centres are allowed to open and are considered 'essential' but I'm not going to criticise individuals who own them or work in them if that is how they make their living, (you know in order to put food on the table and heat their homes).

 

If it's allowed it's allowed.

[Tam & Di]

1 hour ago, The Happy Nomad said:

 

From the roving trader section:-

 

......... If the boat is used as a workshop to produce goods to be sold on the internet or at land based markets, then such use is deemed to be that of a roving trader.

I wrote rather tongue in cheek (to keep it out of the way of the keyboard). However if they are making their Vlog on board and seeking money for it on the internet the CRT item does rather suggest that they might come into the definition of Roving Trader     ?‍♂️

 

Tam

[Victor Vectis]

As Youtube influencers they are in a position to influence others to think it is OK to continue moving.

 

And this is wrong, wrong, wrong. Just plain wrong however they choose to bend the rules.

 

Their justification last time was they were making an essential journey. From one waterpoint to the next and then the one after that, and so on.

 

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Tam & Di said:

I wrote rather tongue in cheek (to keep it out of the way of the keyboard). However if they are making their Vlog on board and seeking money for it on the internet the CRT item does rather suggest that they might come into the definition of Roving Trader     ?‍♂️

 

Tam

I agree it's possible to interpret what they are doing as providing goods or services from their boat. But what we don't know is their actual licence status. They may very well be correctly licensed or they may have checked with CRT to see what they need. Given their videos are now available on Amazon Prime Video this being a 'mainstream video service'  I would expect they have checked in order to be within any contract they will have with Prime.

[PD1964]

41 minutes ago, Victor Vectis said:

As Youtube influencers they are in a position to influence others to think it is OK to continue moving.

 

And this is wrong, wrong, wrong. Just plain wrong however they choose to bend the rules.

 

Their justification last time was they were making an essential journey. From one waterpoint to the next and then the one after that, and so on.

 

I watched their latest Vlog a few hours after it was released, was watching just before they came to the flint works and just caught the commentary about moving and I’m sure they said they were in a Tier 2 area, when in fact the area was Tier 4 in current time, I went back to view a few hours later to confirm what I heard and the place where I thought I heard it was just a black section where it looked like it had been edited out, so I’m now questioning did I hear it? I found this strange as they are so meticulous with their Vlog editing and didn’t remember a black section previously.
  There are people on here who watch them and obviously think they are doing nothing wrong with their creative movement in Lockdown, while the rest of us observe the cruising restrictions. You will also see no negative comments on their Vlog comments, so quite obviously not telling the full story to their followers, who as you say probably think it’s ok to cruise in Lockdown.

Edited January 6, 2021 by PD1964

[David Schweizer]

1 hour ago, The Happy Nomad said:

If they are providing a service that they are allowed to then they are not circumventing any thing.

 

I personally find it peculiar and anomalous that garden centres are allowed to open and are considered 'essential' but I'm not going to criticise individuals who own them or work in them if that is how they make their living, (you know in order to put food on the table and heat their homes).

 

If it's allowed it's allowed.

But that is the opposite to the point I was making. I was suggesting that if they make their living from a "non essential" service, they are currently not allowed to operate their business.

 

If it's not allowed, it's not allowed.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 6, 2021 by David Schweizer

[Athy]

1 hour ago, The Happy Nomad said:

 

 

I personally find it peculiar and anomalous that garden centres are allowed to open and are considered 'essential'

Is it because many people buy things, such as seed potatoes and onion sets, there from which they grow their own food?

 

I wonder when they became "Garden Centres". When I were a lad they were "nurseries". Perhaps they were renamed to avoid confusion with nurseries where small children are looked after.

Edited January 6, 2021 by Athy

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, David Schweizer said:

But that is not the point I was making. I was suggesting that if they make their living from a "non essential" service, they are currently not allowed to operate their business.

 

If it's not allowed, it's not allowed.

 

 

If you are talking about The Foxes then video and film production is currently allowed.

1 minute ago, Athy said:

Is it because many people buy things, such as seed potatoes and onion sets, there from which they grow their own food?

Possibly.