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Leoch Pure Lead Carbon batteries - one year update


magictime

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Thank you for the update. It is really useful when folks come back with their experiences, solutions and progress, or lack thereof. All helps to enrich and enlarge the collective expertise on here.

 

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14 hours ago, magictime said:

Just over a year ago I ordered some Leoch Pure Lead Carbon batteries, after a discussion on here, and I think I said I'd let everyone know how I got on with them. Much more recently I was asking for people's experience of the typical difference between batteries' nominal capacity and their actual capacity; this is a follow-up to that too.

 

Unfortunately I don't think I have anything terribly worthwhile to report. I got what should have been a 432Ah bank of Leoch PLCs fitted late last year, but very quickly got the impression that their actual capacity was not as advertised; following a full charge, I was seeing about 110Ah-120Ah counted out by my BMV before my Smartgauge showed a 50% state of charge, suggesting an actual capacity of 220Ah-240Ah or so. Long story short, after many, many emails back and forth and a bit of heel-dragging on both sides, I've just managed to return the batteries for a full refund. I've just fitted a new bank of the same size - the cheaper Leoch Superior Lead Carbons this time, as a like-for-like replacement wasn't available - and they do seem to have the advertised capacity. So it seems reasonable to assume the other ones were just faulty in some way, rather than that the manufacturer is routinely overstating capacity. But one year on I still have no experience of a non-faulty set of lead carbon batteries to share, I'm afraid.

 

 

 

Thanks for the update, even though it wasnt as useful as you hoped.

 

I will look forward to the December 2021 update. ?

Edited by cuthound
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14 hours ago, magictime said:

but very quickly got the impression that their actual capacity was not as advertised; following a full charge, I was seeing about 110Ah-120Ah counted out by my BMV before my Smartgauge showed a 50% state of charge, suggesting an actual capacity of 220Ah-240Ah or so. Long story short, after many, many emails back and forth and a bit of heel-dragging on both sides, I've just managed to return the batteries for a full refund.

It looks like some of the delay in resolving this is on your side but, how much was by the supplier. Did they accept that they were faulty immediately, and the heel dragging was due to logistics of the return, or was there a period of resistance?

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1 hour ago, Richard10002 said:

It looks like some of the delay in resolving this is on your side but, how much was by the supplier. Did they accept that they were faulty immediately, and the heel dragging was due to logistics of the return, or was there a period of resistance?

Well... I held off contacting them until early February, because I wanted to be sure the batteries had had a good few full charges and the Smartgauge had had plenty of opportunity to learn to read the state of charge correctly. I got a speedy reply asking if I had a 12V or a 24V setup; I guess they were hoping I'd say 24V, as that would have explained the symptom quite nicely! Then a couple of pretty fruitless exchanges where they were basically re-stating the claimed capacity and I was telling them that's not what I was seeing.

 

Then I stopped chasing it for a few months as the availability of solar power meant I was having no day-to-day issues, and it kept slipping my mind. By the time I got back in touch - August I think - the guy I had been emailing had left the company, and so it took a while to pick up the thread with new people.

 

Then there was some to-ing and fro-ing where they were trying to persuade me to jump through the hoops of the warranty claim process, while I was quoting chapter and verse on the Consumer Rights Act, insisting that since I'd alerted them to the fault within 6 months, there was a legal presumption that the goods had been faulty from new and that I was therefore entitled to a replacement or refund simply as a matter of my statutory rights. They never explicitly conceded this point, or even that the batteries were faulty, but one way or another they did finally offer a full refund.

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Of course you did realise that in cold winter weather that lead acid batteries capacity decreases by approx 1% per degree c under the rated temperature usually 25 deg c , in feb average temperature would have been in mid to high single digits so your bank would have been about 100Ah down on the rated capacity. Just to check you took this into account . I am sure Leoch would or should have pointed this out as well ? 

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1 minute ago, RufusR said:

Of course you did realise that in cold winter weather that lead acid batteries capacity decreases by approx 1% per degree c under the rated temperature usually 25 deg c , in feb average temperature would have been in mid to high single digits so your bank would have been about 100Ah down on the rated capacity. Just to check you took this into account . I am sure Leoch would or should have pointed this out as well ? 

I'm not sure they did point it out actually, but yes, I was aware that according to their data sheet, the batteries should have 'only' had 86% of their rated capacity at 0C - i.e. 372 Ah at the C20 rate. Clearly they didn't have anything close to that though, or I'd have been seeing more like 180+ Ah counted out following a full charge before my Smartgauge hit 50%. 

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8 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

If the new set do the same, get your smartguage calibrated ...

 

@Mike the Boilerman  had three that all read different numbers and it trashed his batteries.

Thanks. No sign of that though, and I've been looking at voltage readings in conjunction with the Smartgauge state of charge reading all along and they've always seemed pretty much in agreement - 12.1 or 12.2 volts at the '50%' mark (typically with a draw of a few amps).

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4 minutes ago, magictime said:

Thanks. No sign of that though, and I've been looking at voltage readings in conjunction with the Smartgauge state of charge reading all along and they've always seemed pretty much in agreement - 12.1 or 12.2 volts at the '50%' mark (typically with a draw of a few amps).

 

No worries - it just seemed a good point to mention it.

 

I assume you are using a separate voltmeter, not just looking at the voltage figures on the SG.

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31 minutes ago, TheBiscuits said:

 

No worries - it just seemed a good point to mention it.

 

I assume you are using a separate voltmeter, not just looking at the voltage figures on the SG.

My solar controller and BMV battery monitor also display voltage readings (and all three always agree).

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Different battery types have slightly different voltages at various states of charge. My AGM's have a fully charged voltage of 12.95 rather than the more normal 12.8 and a 50% of 12.2 other types often state 12.1 for 50%. I don't think the Smartgauge has a lead carbon setting so may be slightly out. I would assume Leoch would know about this though, but may not be familiar with the Smartgauge.

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11 minutes ago, Detling said:

Different battery types have slightly different voltages at various states of charge. My AGM's have a fully charged voltage of 12.95 rather than the more normal 12.8 and a 50% of 12.2 other types often state 12.1 for 50%. I don't think the Smartgauge has a lead carbon setting so may be slightly out. I would assume Leoch would know about this though, but may not be familiar with the Smartgauge.

I checked with the Smartgauge chappies last year and they advised me to use the 'carbon fibre' setting. 

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